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09-03-2019, 04:15 PM   #31
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QuoteOriginally posted by texandrews Quote
Glad we "see" "eye to eye" ! And just as something I thought you might find interesting:

For archival repro shots and catalogs, we have to color match to prints. This means shooting an artwork and then printing the shot, and then scrutinizing the print against the actual artwork. One thing I saw my former colleague do (and she had decades of experience shooting for major artists and museums in NYC) was use a Pantone color fan to match colors she knew were likely to be a problem against the artwork. This way when she was color matching with prints she could go back to her notes and tweak accordingly. The Macbeth color chart and Color Checker Passport were not enough, nor was standard white balancing or camera profiling. Very old school, very effective.

But, pursuant to your comments, I also came away convinced that excellent fine arts repro photographers were a lot like sommeliers---not just any old soul can do it at the highest level. I like my wine, and my palate isn't crude, but I'm no sommelier.
Yes, we do see "eye to eye" and also "Pentax Bayer filter to Bayer filter", too.

I can certainly believe that using the Pantone fan would be superior to just a standard color chart. Pantone uses a greater range of dyes and pigments to get a fuller range of colors. I'm sure some of those pigments and dyes have strange spectra that are sure to give strange results on a standard RGB Bayer filter sensor and help correct the repro if it used some strange dye or pigment.

Archival repro can be really hard especially if there are any fears that the subject matter has suffered from color shifting from light damage, ozone damage, acid papers, oxidizing varnish, etc. There's some really cool science going into understanding how dyes and pigments age and what to do about it. A good example is the work on Van Gogh's fading colors.

09-03-2019, 04:40 PM   #32
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QuoteOriginally posted by lakeshore Quote
What are your opinions regarding this trend? Do you like it?
I don't like it, but I am in the minority. I took a look at Ken Rockwell's website a while ago and his landscape colours are so unrealistic, the photos look cheap and tawdry, in my opinion of course, If you want strangers to look at your photographs you have to go overboard to get their attention, otherwise your hard work gets ignored. Now that I think about it, many things in life are dependent on being outrageous in order to get attention.
09-03-2019, 04:48 PM - 1 Like   #33
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QuoteOriginally posted by Charlie70 Quote

I'm aware that all camera's have their own "color science", but I always prefer the colors to be reproduced as accurately as possible.

So I'm looking for advice on how to achieve this with the K-70. I've been playing around with the various white balance options and custom image modes, but I wonder if there's some kind of magic formula that others are using?

I have noticed that reds are generally over-saturated and yellows are paler than they appear in reality.


Yeah, get yourself a colour checker chart or at the least a neutral grey one, Charlton.

I find myself doing a bit of product photography now that my wife's gotten into eBay selling. The colours of clothing have to be accurate or as a vendor you leave yourself wide open to an unhappy buyer.

In Lightroom, you can do this once at the start of the session, and if you're using artificial lighting it doesn't change so you can just click and apply the tint and temperature correction to every picture you took in one go.

As others have said, you also need to calibrate your monitor - I have a USB SpyderExpress to help.
09-03-2019, 04:49 PM - 1 Like   #34
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Everything is pretty covered here. I have one point.
When you see a subject looking particularly pleasing it is mostly because of the light. The color of the light is a major part of that. A natural tint on the scene if you will. If you tell the settings to correct for this tint you get "true" color but you don't want that. The tint is what you want. For this a white balance of daylight is probably what you want. A book in campfire light with the true white pages? Yeach. I want that yellow orange.

09-04-2019, 05:42 AM - 1 Like   #35
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QuoteOriginally posted by RGlasel Quote
I don't like it, but I am in the minority. I took a look at Ken Rockwell's website a while ago and his landscape colours are so unrealistic, the photos look cheap and tawdry, in my opinion of course, If you want strangers to look at your photographs you have to go overboard to get their attention, otherwise your hard work gets ignored. Now that I think about it, many things in life are dependent on being outrageous in order to get attention.
Hey, I represent that statement.
09-04-2019, 06:56 AM   #36
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
Including a colour card in your photo and then matching it in post is the only way to ensure colour accuracy.
I will second that, which is why I carry an X-rite ColorChecker Passport in my camera bag.

QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
And for folks like me, I don't even care, it's not about what's there. A raw file is something i can use to create something.
I will second that as well. I seldom use my ColorChecker in the field. I use it mainly in my table top studio where I am documenting objects. In the field I sometimes deliberately distort colors using colored filters to obtain the artistic effect that I desire.
09-06-2019, 12:46 PM   #37
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QuoteOriginally posted by macman24054 Quote
My system to get accurate color and brightness from shoot to print in to set a custom white balance with a grey card and keep my monitor calibrated with the Spyder 5 pro. I shoot mostly weddings. The two photographers that work with me and myself have used the same calibration tools for the last two years with very accurate results. One of us can edit and one can print with the same accuracy as if the same person edited and printed. Simple system that gets accurate results.
Sounds like a good set up.

This stuff isn't hard. Just requires a basic understanding, a system that works, and most of all consistency and always shooting the grey card.
09-08-2019, 12:54 AM   #38
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I just go by eye. No colour charts, profiling or specialist software. Works for me

09-08-2019, 04:10 AM   #39

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As with everything it gets more difficult the closer to perfection you get. Towards the end it becomes impossible. As often when this subject comes up there are posters unable to see the options between default (bright) camera settings and fully colour managed workflow and super expensive gear. The colour accuracy of default camera and software settings is usually not very good at all. It's engineered towards someones idea of pleasing colours. As we all know opinions diverge substantially. So in reality theres a sliding scale each offering significant improvements. A couple off the top of my head starting with the least complicated.

- Neutral colour setting in camera
- Calibrated monitor and each raw manually adjusted from memory
- Custom dcp profile for *your* camera. This means a one time shooting of colour charts under controlled light and running software on the result.
- Taking reference shots of colour charts during shooting.
- Buying expensive special colour accurate, non consumer, gear

I've mentioned this before but the Pentax colours do as the OP says diverge quite visibly in some colours specifically the reds. With well known memory reds people will notice the photo looking off.

The main issue with colour inaccuracy is hue shifts. White balance is a bit of a red herring. WB is important for the image to look right but, as some have mentioned, it can look right with rather differing whitebalance due to how we percieve light. Capturing and displaying the correct relationships between the colours in the scene is however more important. A chef might add spices to a meal but still want the best produce as a base. It's much the same with photography.

As you've seen above some disregard the actual colours of the scene completely and this tend to be photographers who are concerned only with the image in itself. Photographers who aim to describe, tell a story or research a topic might be more interested in the results not looking alien or 'wrong'.
03-13-2020, 02:22 AM   #40
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I also have question regarding color accuracy of my K-70. My Canon was perfect, my current Nikon is good, although only the red is orangish and skin tones are not nice. Go back to the K-70. I realized that red colors are much better than the oranhish Nikon but tends to go a bit magenta. This is not a big problem it is acceptable. But the yellow is absolute not true yellow, it has green influence, has green tint of the yellows. I shot yellow plastic Mignions, even with flash they are slightly greenish. Outside a Blue Tit bird's feather that is pure yellow here also can be seen slightly greenish tint. The rest of the color I really love it of the K-70. What are the experiences and what is the medicine for red, but especially for yellow color? I will really going mad if I have to push here-there the different sliders in Lightroom like HUE, Saturation, Vibration, et. or even touching the Tone Curve to create a new LR Profile like I also did for the Nikon. Thank you.

Last edited by Carlos33; 03-13-2020 at 02:30 AM.

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