[pschlute]

I “rub virtual shoulders” at a non-brand specific photo forum. They view Pentax as people stuck in the 20th Century. From their POV, ‘modern’ today means “FF” MILC and matching lenses

What are their pictures like ?

[UncleVanya]

I’m going to skip quoting as the points are spread over many posts:

K-1 vs d850
Pro:
-IBIS
-Astrotracer
-accelerator (mk II model)
-lunar lander screen
-Pentax menu

Con:
-fewer af lens options
-Nikon flash system (yawn)
-42 vs 36mp (very limited difference)
-Nikon pro support structure available (unclear how effective this is post Z launch for d850 users.

Small ff? DSLR can be a bit smaller than the K-1 but not really small by comparison to mirrorless.

Compete with Leica? I think they are trying to move in that direction in their own way.

Nikon F Mount autofocus is a mess as far as protocols and standards according to those who built some af adapters for other systems. EF is simpler due to the redesign around electronics - that paved a path different from everyone else.

Big three? Even Nikon was on the verge of collapse during the great market shrink. Dedicated photo platforms are in trouble and time will tell if newer generations buy enough to feed the ecosystem as those of us that shot film for decades die off.

[PKMike]

Please tell me what sets a K1 apart from a Nikon D850 or an older Canon 5DMK4?

Uh, price. and by a long shot. Plus this...

The K-1 has MUCH superior thought given to its design.

With the K-1, pretty much can just use my left palm and that's it.

That's why i can never understand why Nikon persisted with their stupid design of an entire column of buttons on the left-side of the cam body (for that range of cams).

What sets K-1 apart from D850?
(1) superior design. Proper thought and consideration given to placement of buttons etc.
Nikon is absolutely dumbass poor on this aspect.

2) extremely easy to understand and grasp and navigate the Pentax menu system.
I am not kidding.
My first Pentax digital body is K-1.
I did not have any prior experience with the others.
When i first got the K-1 (about 4-5 yrs ago), i really did not have to check up on any instruction manual and i could figure it around, the menu.

Nikon?
Let's not even get started.

If i give Pentax menu a score of 9/10 for ease of understanding, grasping and using.
Nikon will be a 3/10

3) the K-1's implementation of that Lunar struts screen.
That is absolute genius.
D850?
Doesn't even come 10feet close.

[Dartmoor Dave]

Those of you who have taken offense with this, please consider the following; who is Ricoh/Pentax's target market?

Photographers who want an optical viewfinder DSLR.

Who are they trying to appeal to?

Photographers who want an optical viewfinder DSLR.

How successful have thet been these past few years trying to keep up with other camera manufacturers?

They haven't been trying to. Ricoh seems content with Pentax being a popular brand in Japan and a niche product elsewhere.

Has their marketing strategy worked?

See above.

Are they more solid financially today than they were 5 years ago?

Are any camera manufacturers?

Will they be around in 5 years if they continue their current marketing strategy?

Yes. Pentax will be the dominant brand for anyone who wants an optical viewfinder DSLR.

What are you going to do with all your old Pentax equipment when they go bankrupt?

Keep using it.

[phoebus]

Dear Pentax/Ricoh,

I have had a passion for photography for many years and currently own Canon, Nikon and Sony gear. I also own a GRIII Street Edition.

[...]

There are many photographers like myself who value ruggedness, durability, dependability, simplicity and the ability to use new and older lenses. If we could afford a Leica system, we would be happy. Unfortunately some of us can't afford Leica, so we keep searching for the "Leica experience " with other camera manufacturers.

[...]

If you had settled on just Leica, you would have probably spent less in the long run...

As you don't list current Pentax equipment, I doubt Ricoh would be greatly interested in your view on Pentax, though I'm sure they'll be pleased you bought the GR3.

[jersey]

Those of you who have taken offense with this, please consider the following; who is Ricoh/Pentax's target market? Who are they trying to appeal to?

As we were always complaining, target market is Japan. Everyone else is getting scraps and leftovers. And we cannot do anything about it. It seems that Ricoh is happy with it and is not willing to spent money to make brand recognizable abroad. I am not happy about it, but well. Maybe when then monopolize DSLR or SLR market it will change a bit but I do not intend to hold my breath until then.

How successful have thet been these past few years trying to keep up with other camera manufacturers? Has their marketing strategy worked? Are they more solid financially today than they were 5 years ago? Will they be around in 5 years if they continue their current marketing strategy?

Going by financial reports it seems that yes, they were successful and it seems that they will be here in 5 years. Or rather - they will be in Japan.

What are you going to do with all your old Pentax equipment when they go bankrupt?

Keep using it for as long as it is viable? Cameras don't die only because manufacturer bankrupt. I mean Minolta cameras are still out there despite being taken over by Sony. Heck, look and OMDS and Olympus. All E-M cameras have not stopped working when Olympus sold off their camera business.


And when it comes time when I need/want to replace K-3/3 and Pentax is not there I will simply buy something else. What's the problem?

[StiffLegged]

Dear snegron1, you are just this week’s latest whizzbang idea for making Pentax/Ricoh fabulously successful and long-lived. We get these sorts of suggestions here on a fairly regular basis and I have to ask if you’ve written to Ricoh? We’re not aware that our favourite photography brand polls these fora in search of their next business plan, so you might have more success by contacting them directly.

Good luck.


edit: it would probably suprise you, but lots of us here remember the old film days, still have an MX or LX and still use them, as do many Spotmatic users.

---

Last edited by StiffLegged; 03-21-2023 at 02:18 PM.

[pschlute]

As we were always complaining, target market is Japan. Everyone else is getting scraps and leftovers

That is not accurate. All cameras and lenses have been made available to the entire world upon release with the exception of some special editions.

What do you want to buy that you cannot ?

[Sandy Hancock]

Please tell me what sets a K1 apart from a Nikon D850 or an older Canon 5DMK4?

I am not completely familiar with the feature set of these cameras, and several other posters have chipped in already.

In addition to the points made so far, do the 5D Mark IV or D850 have the following?
IBIS - allowing pixel shift, astrotracer, composition adjustment and limited tilt/shift
Full backwards compatibility with all K-mount lenses
Stop down metering and focus confirmation for legacy lenses
A comparable level of weather sealing
TAv mode
HyperP mode with a green button to reset instantly

The Canon and Nikon are no doubt fine DSLRs, and I would not be surprised if I've missed something here, but I don't feel my photography is limited by the K-1 Mark II.

[clackers]

My reason for getting rid of one of them (Nikon D750) was because Nikon changed their lens mount witout caring about their loyal customers.

Well, I think in one way that's an admirable attitude, but you do hurt yourself.

The D850 was/is a candidate for best FF DSLR.

I would expect the next Pentax K-1 to exceed it the way the K3 III now exceeds the D500 in APS-C.

But for those right now who love a real viewfinder and not a stream of CCTV jpegs, the 750 is a fine camera and the 850 even better!

[MarkJerling]

Photographers who want an optical viewfinder DSLR.





Photographers who want an optical viewfinder DSLR.





They haven't been trying to. Ricoh seems content with Pentax being a popular brand in Japan and a niche product elsewhere.





See above.





Are any camera manufacturers?





Yes. Pentax will be the dominant brand for anyone who wants an optical viewfinder DSLR.





Keep using it.

Well said Dave. +1.

[yucatanPentax]

My primary requirements I insisted on when I purchsed all the cameras I mentioned; RUGGED & DEPENDABLE. ...
. . .

Please note that I DID NOT mention anything about wanting a camera with video features, or any advanced electronic features.

There are many photographers like myself who value ruggedness, durability, dependability, simplicity and the ability to use new and older lenses. ...

Pentax/Ricoh has the opportunity now to fill the need of those of us who want to get back to basics with a tough, reliable camera system that can use both new and classic lenses.

Pentax/Ricoh can set itself apart from other popular camera manufacturers by focusing on "getting back to basics".

I guess count me "puzzled."
How is Pentax not delivering the highlighted points today? And I didn't even quote the three previous uses of "rugged and dependable." Aren't existing Pentax cameras rather known for being rugged and dependable?

I didn't see anyone being "rattled" by anything. All I saw was a somewhat repetitive, unclear, nonspecific "request" (?), even after a few follow-up comments by the OP. Even this far in, it's unclear to me what the OP wants?

[Rondec]

It is pretty obvious that there are two big features that Pentax has that sell it to those who choose to buy it.

1. Optical Viewfinder. You may not appreciate it but there are still a chunk of people out there who prefer to look through an OVF to an EVF. This is a niche that is completely unserved at this point as nearly all brands have shut down SLR production. As to whether or not that is enough of a niche to continue selling Pentax cameras, we will see. All of the camera brands are likely to have to tighten their belts a little, as the camera market seems to have tanked over the last five years.

2. K Mount Lenses. Once again, this is a niche, but Pentax makes and has made a huge number of K mount lenses that are easily usable without an adapter on Pentax cameras. I have posted elsewhere, but just for me to replace my Pentax DFA f2.8 zooms for the Z mount would cost 7500 dollars -- and that isn't even talking about the primes I have accumulated over time. Looking over other mirrorless options, it seems like they have similar pricing. Every brand has good lenses, but it isn't until you look at pricing between different brands that you realize that premium lenses come at a cost.

It is really hard to argue about ergonomics -- most of the people here like Pentax's ergonomics, but then we shoot with their cameras and so shooting with Canon feels foreign. As far as additional features, Pentax needs to include those. Assuming you have a sensor capable of decent frame rate, it is also capable of video capture. It is foolish to leave something like video off because there is no cost savings to leaving it off, but there are probably photographers out there that would choose not to buy a camera because it doesn't have video capability, even if they never use it.

I don't know what Pentax's future is, but I do remain optimistic. They have a nice niche, they have minimal competition, they are part of a bigger, diversified company (Ricoh) that seems committed to producing SLRs and they they have a fairly lean operation. I think that they are better designed to more forward in a falling market than a company like Nikon, where the only solution seems to be to sell the same gear for higher prices.

[snegron1]

It is pretty obvious that there are two big features that Pentax has that sell it to those who choose to buy it.

1. Optical Viewfinder. You may not appreciate it but there are still a chunk of people out there who prefer to look through an OVF to an EVF. This is a niche that is completely unserved at this point as nearly all brands have shut down SLR production. As to whether or not that is enough of a niche to continue selling Pentax cameras, we will see. All of the camera brands are likely to have to tighten their belts a little, as the camera market seems to have tanked over the last five years.

2. K Mount Lenses. Once again, this is a niche, but Pentax makes and has made a huge number of K mount lenses that are easily usable without an adapter on Pentax cameras. I have posted elsewhere, but just for me to replace my Pentax DFA f2.8 zooms for the Z mount would cost 7500 dollars -- and that isn't even talking about the primes I have accumulated over time. Looking over other mirrorless options, it seems like they have similar pricing. Every brand has good lenses, but it isn't until you look at pricing between different brands that you realize that premium lenses come at a cost.

It is really hard to argue about ergonomics -- most of the people here like Pentax's ergonomics, but then we shoot with their cameras and so shooting with Canon feels foreign. As far as additional features, Pentax needs to include those. Assuming you have a sensor capable of decent frame rate, it is also capable of video capture. It is foolish to leave something like video off because there is no cost savings to leaving it off, but there are probably photographers out there that would choose not to buy a camera because it doesn't have video capability, even if they never use it.

I don't know what Pentax's future is, but I do remain optimistic. They have a nice niche, they have minimal competition, they are part of a bigger, diversified company (Ricoh) that seems committed to producing SLRs and they they have a fairly lean operation. I think that they are better designed to more forward in a falling market than a company like Nikon, where the only solution seems to be to sell the same gear for higher prices.

The fact that Pentax chose to stick with two very important features (optical viewfinder and K mount), is reassuring for loyal Pentax customers.

In terms of ergonomics, I find that Pentax and Nikon (older F-mount series) are quite similar compared to other manufacturers. For many years I used Nikon. I purchased Canon and Sony gear and shot with 3 systems at the same time! Canon truly is foreign in terms of ergonomics, Sony is somewhat similar to Nikon.

Fast lenses fetch premium prices in any brand as you mentioned. That's why having the ability to use lenses you have spent good money on in the past with newer systems is a major plus. I had amassed a bunch of Nikon lenses over the years. I was really disappointed that I couldn't merge them over to newer Nikon Z bodies (AF does not work with older lenses on newer Nikon Z mount bodies). Lucky for me that Canon produced an inexpensive EF to RF mount adapter that let me use my older EF lenses on their R bodies! While I didn't have as many Canon lenses as I did with my Nikon lenses, the ones I did have worked flawlessly; even AF!

As for Sony lens availability, I personally find it a bit misleading. While there are several 3rd party manufacturers that make lenses for Sony, they are all pretty much very similar focal lengths. For example, I need a compact- sized, 16mm full frame prime lens for my Sony A7c. It doesn't exist! No one makes it! I had purchased the A7c as a full frame, compact travel camera. It came with a compact (slow) 28-60mm kit lens, so I purchased a Tamron 24mm f2.8, Sony 40mm f2.5 G and a Sony 85mm f1.8 as a lightweight travel kit. The 24mm wasn't wide enough, so I bought a Tamron 20-40mm f2.8 as my main travel lens. I didn't get the Sony PZ 16-35mm f4 because of its slow minimum aperture of f4.0. The closest I could get to a 16mm was with either a Sony 14mm f1.8 GM (ridiculously expensive), a Rokinon AF 14mm f1.8 (questionable build quality and reliability issues), a Tamron 17-28mm f2.8 (too close to 20mm on the wide end and not very compact), or a Sigma 16-28mm f2.8 (pricy and not very compact). Small, fast, AF lenses for Sony are very scarce which is a shame because Sony bodies are pretty small, especially the A7c.

I have been tossing around the idea of selling all my Sony equipment and either buy more Canon lenses, or buy into Pentax. I don't think I'd get rid of my Canon gear, but I would replace my current Sony travel gear for Pentax.

[UncleVanya]

As for Sony lens availability, I personally find it a bit misleading. While there are several 3rd party manufacturers that make lenses for Sony, they are all pretty much very similar focal lengths. For example, I need a compact- sized, 16mm full frame prime lens for my Sony A7c. It doesn't exist! No one makes it! I had purchased the A7c as a full frame, compact travel camera. It came with a compact (slow) 28-60mm kit lens, so I purchased a Tamron 24mm f2.8, Sony 40mm f2.5 G and a Sony 85mm f1.8 as a lightweight travel kit. The 24mm wasn't wide enough, so I bought a Tamron 20-40mm f2.8 as my main travel lens. I didn't get the Sony PZ 16-35mm f4 because of its slow minimum aperture of f4.0. The closest I could get to a 16mm was with either a Sony 14mm f1.8 GM (ridiculously expensive), a Rokinon AF 14mm f1.8 (questionable build quality and reliability issues), a Tamron 17-28mm f2.8 (too close to 20mm on the wide end and not very compact), or a Sigma 16-28mm f2.8 (pricy and not very compact). Small, fast, AF lenses for Sony are very scarce which is a shame because Sony bodies are pretty small, especially the A7c.

I’m not sure why this is the case. Several 15mm lenses exist, but even at f4.5 these aren’t super light. The closest option I can possibly suggest is the Sigma 16-28 at under 500g. There’s also a 16mm f3.5 fisheye that’s often overlooked as it’s optically not stellar and it’s heavy - that lens is the FE 28 with the fisheye converter attached. I own it and find it ok but it’s completely not what you are asking for.

This guide may help you: Guide to Ultra Wideangle lenses for the Sony A7/A9/A1 Series - phillipreeve.net