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02-15-2017, 12:58 AM - 1 Like   #16
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QuoteOriginally posted by Steve.Ledger Quote
The OP asked "Is electronic shutter available in normal optical viewfinder mode "
This implies the OP wants to use the electronic shutter while looking through the OVF, otherwise why would he have mentioned the OVF at all?
Yes, that is the point: he may want to use KP in electronic shutter mode and optical viewfinder instead of back LCD because of:
a) different autofocusing
b) top speed shutter time 1/24000 vs 1/6000

02-15-2017, 01:26 AM   #17
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I called it "OVF mode", when I meant the "normal thingie whatever mode" that is NOT liveview.
As described above I could see it as feature to gain 1/24000 shutter speeds in that mode while not changing anything else in that mode. I would just see it as a quicker electronic shutter "behind" the mechanical shutter.

And the manual is quite clear that this does not work in flash mode (intentionally disabled).

Would be fun to try out backwards using smartrig device (www.doc-diy.net :: SmaTrig 2 - The improved smart 15-in-1 trigger for SLRs) meant for lightning strike photography which triggers the shutter when something flashes. Obviously this circumvents the block as the camera can be set to non-flash mode as it is itself triggered by the flash not the other way around.
02-15-2017, 04:14 AM   #18
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QuoteOriginally posted by lithedreamer Quote
Electronic viewfinder in OVF mode is totally possible. The mirror has to raise to expose the sensor either way, it's just a matter of what kind of shutter curtains you're using.

QuoteOriginally posted by apete Quote
Yes, that is the point: he may want to use KP in electronic shutter mode and optical viewfinder instead of back LCD because of:
a) different autofocusing
b) top speed shutter time 1/24000 vs 1/6000

Please explain, with diagrams if you can to show how a DSLR Optical Viewfinder can still be used to view the scene with the mirror raised?

I don't care that you can [of course] use electronic shutter AFTER the mirror has been raised, that's not the point I'm making.
What I am saying is that you cannot look through the (OVF) optical viewfinder (8) and still see the scene through the lens while the mirror (2) is raised with Pentax DSLRs.



One of the main reasons for using electronic shutter with MILC is 'silence'. A DSLR will still make a 'reflex' sound at least once when using it's electronic shutter mode.
02-15-2017, 05:36 AM   #19
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QuoteOriginally posted by Steve.Ledger Quote
Please explain, with diagrams if you can to show how a DSLR Optical Viewfinder can still be used to view the scene with the mirror raised?

I don't care that you can [of course] use electronic shutter AFTER the mirror has been raised, that's not the point I'm making.
What I am saying is that you cannot look through the (OVF) optical viewfinder (8) and still see the scene through the lens while the mirror (2) is raised with Pentax DSLRs.



One of the main reasons for using electronic shutter with MILC is 'silence'. A DSLR will still make a 'reflex' sound at least once when using it's electronic shutter mode.
I think what people mean is that there is a momentary blackout with any DSLR when the mirror flips up, but this needn't be any worse using an ES. The main value of the ES in Pentax cameras, however is to reduce vibration so that when used with mirror lock-up, you can get the best possible IQ. The main use of the ES in the KP, on ghe other hand, is probably to enable faster shutter speeds. Neither is particularly related to shutter noise.

02-15-2017, 05:38 AM - 1 Like   #20
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QuoteOriginally posted by Steve.Ledger Quote
Please explain, with diagrams if you can to show how a DSLR Optical Viewfinder can still be used to view the scene with the mirror raised?

I don't care that you can [of course] use electronic shutter AFTER the mirror has been raised, that's not the point I'm making.
I honestly have no idea what you're arguing against here then? Open mechanical shutter and get the sensor ready, then when the shutter is pressed, raise mirror, trip electronic shutter, done.

No you can't see through the optical viewfinder when the mirror is raised when the picture is being taken. There's going to be mirror black out with an electronic or mechanical shutter.

Yes, you'd lose some of the advantages of the electronic shutter, the floppy mirror will rattle around causing vibrations and noise, but having the option to access 1/24,000s shutter speed and still use the optical viewfinder would be handy for shooting wide open in bright, sunny conditions.

---------- Post added 02-15-17 at 07:52 AM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by cgchang Quote
Found this site with clips of Pentax KP electronic shutter in live view and in "conventional mode". Also has clips of the KP shutter vs other Pentax cameras.

Pentax DSLR shutter sounds, part 2 | breakfastographer
That answers that! Good find

Last edited by BrianR; 02-15-2017 at 05:46 AM.
02-15-2017, 06:23 AM - 1 Like   #21
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QuoteOriginally posted by Steve.Ledger Quote
Please explain, with diagrams if you can to show how a DSLR Optical Viewfinder can still be used to view the scene with the mirror raised?
I don't care that you can [of course] use electronic shutter AFTER the mirror has been raised, that's not the point I'm making.
What I am saying is that you cannot look through the (OVF) optical viewfinder (8) and still see the scene through the lens while the mirror (2) is raised with Pentax DSLRs.
Steve, I did never tell here that there would be no blackout. Yes, there would be blackout. But even with blackout I would be still using OVF to point and shoot. Just like in normal mode with mirror. Are you saying that would not be using OVF? What would I be using then?
QuoteOriginally posted by Steve.Ledger Quote
One of the main reasons for using electronic shutter with MILC is 'silence'. A DSLR will still make a 'reflex' sound at least once when using it's electronic shutter mode.
You care about 'silence' but we care in this thread about top speed of shutter. And that is why that thread was started. About speed of shutter with OVF use. We are discussing here the way to point with OVF and have 1/24000 shutter speed the same time.

Last edited by apete; 02-15-2017 at 06:28 AM.
02-15-2017, 03:02 PM - 1 Like   #22
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Sigh.... Never mind. Carry on
03-31-2017, 08:39 AM   #23
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After some fooling with the electronic shutter it seems it can be used in OVF mode. This is different than the K1 in which the ES can only be used in live view. According to the manual, and confirmed by my use, the ES can be used any time with the exception of Flash, Bulb mode, Interval shooting, or Shake Reduction. Lately I have been using higher ISO values with faster shutter speeds as to not rely on SR so much, so I am thinking of using ES as my default setting. This will eliminate any issues associated with the mechanical shutter. Can anyone think of a reason NOT to use ES other than the stated exceptions?

03-31-2017, 12:41 PM   #24
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QuoteOriginally posted by clackers Quote
Yep, subjects that aren't stationary.

Please explain.
03-31-2017, 01:31 PM   #25
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Just picked up my Kp,

Yes it works with ovf, only there is about 1/8th of a second added to the blackout, no quieter than usual.

In live view that goes out to maybe 1/3rd of a second - live view makes a few clicks and whirs, but no louder than the AF (with a 35 2.4). slower and quieter than a normal lv shot with the mechanical shutter.

Not much good for non stationary things due to blackout not letting you see the subject at the time of taking and the fact that moving objects will deform due to the read speed of the sensor in this mode - I just wobbled the camera at 1/640th and all of the verticals are bowed - at 1/24k it's more pronounced if anything.

Only really useful if it's necessary to go over 1/6000th, I've very rarely needed to go over that.
03-31-2017, 03:23 PM   #26
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The vast majority of my shots are stationary or maybe slow moving objects so I can live with a 1/8 second blackout. I have not tried it with fast moving objects and I need to experiment more. The manual states that distortion can occur at fast shutter speeds with fast moving objects. I guess it is how you define the word "fast" that matters. There has got to be some working room between "stationary" and "fast moving".


What puzzles me is why one would be shooting over 1/6000 unless you were trying to freeze motion?

Last edited by sibyrnes; 03-31-2017 at 03:29 PM.
03-31-2017, 04:52 PM   #27
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QuoteOriginally posted by sibyrnes Quote
Please explain.
Do you like this?

Electronic shutters are too slow compared to mechanical ones.

1/1000s ...

03-31-2017, 06:45 PM   #28
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QuoteOriginally posted by sibyrnes Quote
What puzzles me is why one would be shooting over 1/6000 unless you were trying to freeze motion?
In Lieu of an ND filter would be my best guess - I'm sure someone will have a technical reason they want that feature.
03-31-2017, 10:27 PM   #29
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QuoteOriginally posted by clackers Quote
Do you like this?

Electronic shutters are too slow compared to mechanical ones.

1/1000s ...

I would probably like that photo if it was a better composition





Actually that's a pretty cool photo!


I am basically a landscape/still life kind of guy. Action and sports type photography is something I have little interest in but I respect the skills and technique involved in that.


So, I'm thinking electronic shutter, by eliminating any chance of shutter shock, may be something that will help me obtain sharper images in situations where I don't use a tripod(and live view). I still have a lot of experimenting to do.

Last edited by sibyrnes; 03-31-2017 at 10:38 PM.
04-01-2017, 01:06 AM   #30
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QuoteOriginally posted by sibyrnes Quote
!


I am basically a landscape/still life kind of guy. .
Then EFCS should be fine, although you won't be able to use flashes for your still life pics.



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