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06-03-2023, 03:14 AM   #1
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pentax KP exagerated greens

Hi there, new user here and this post is my reason for finally creating an account,

I recently bought a pentax KP and have been very happy with it so far exept for one little thing that I can't seem to figure out, a lot of my pictures of plants seem to have very exagerated greens, almos fluorescent and artificial like, reds and blues have been beautiful so far (especially the reds stand out in how accurate they come out) but greens have me stumped, I've looked into the whitebalance settings, my lighting, different lenses with different coatings, all with marginal differences but none result in a acceptably accurate rendition of the foliage colors.
I'm currently looking into improving my pp skills to try and fix it in post, but I was wondering if anyone has had a similar problem, and if there is an in camera fix.
I shoot dng+ and mostly leave whitebalance on auto

also, to be clear, pictures turn out great generally, its not like there is a green tint or anything, its just that parts of the picture that are green, come out "too green"

06-03-2023, 03:24 AM   #2
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If you are shooting DNGs, you can just tone down the greens in you RAW converter. Do the greens come out a bit overdone in the jpegs? Remember that the way the colour filter in front of your camera's sensor is designed it has twice as many green points as blue or red...
06-03-2023, 03:45 AM   #3
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QuoteOriginally posted by This_dude Quote
its not like there is a green tint or anything, its just that parts of the picture that are green, come out "too green"
Can you post some examples which may help. Also, are your jpegs sRGB colour space and is your monitor calibrated ? Are you using a wide-gamut monitor ?
06-03-2023, 04:10 AM   #4
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Have a look at your setting under the camera symbol numer one "Aangepaste opname" (Custom Image) and see which of the possible settings there is chosen. On my KP it is either lively or natural and that works well with greens of the grasses. Experiment with those settings till you are satisfied with the outcome. It also depends on the lens used. I had a HD 35mm f2 and the greens were flat and with the DA 35mm f2.4 they are brilliant, so the HD was returned. So please mention the lens you used.

06-03-2023, 04:11 AM   #5
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If you are developing jpegs in-camera, what are your settings? In RAW development, I sometimes actually UP the green saturation a bit with my KP.

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Last edited by jgnfld; 06-03-2023 at 04:21 AM.
06-03-2023, 05:28 AM   #6
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first of all, thanks everybody for the responses so far!
QuoteOriginally posted by rpjallan Quote
If you are shooting DNGs, you can just tone down the greens in you RAW converter. Do the greens come out a bit overdone in the jpegs? Remember that the way the colour filter in front of your camera's sensor is designed it has twice as many green points as blue or red...
this is one thing I'm currently looking into, and ultimately I think it would be the best option, but sometimes its handy to have the in camera developed JPEGs be good enough, I hadnt thought about the amount of green red and blue points on the sensor, that makes a lot of sense actually


QuoteOriginally posted by pschlute:
Can you post some examples which may help. Also, are your jpegs sRGB colour space and is your monitor calibrated ? Are you using a wide-gamut monitor ?
I've attached two jpegs from the camera below, in both the green is a lot more vivid and "popping" than they are in real life, and in the second image (IMGP0984) the leaves have a sort of brown reddish tinge, which in real life is a lot more prominent, but the camera made them more green, this might be due to what rpjallan mentioned about the color points on the sensor, the jpegs are sRGB, I'm not sure if the monitor is colour calibrated, its a 2021 27" Imac

QuoteOriginally posted by AfterPentax Mark II:
Have a look at your setting under the camera symbol numer one "Aangepaste opname" (Custom Image) and see which of the possible settings there is chosen. On my KP it is either lively or natural and that works well with greens of the grasses. Experiment with those settings till you are satisfied with the outcome. It also depends on the lens used. I had a HD 35mm f2 and the greens were flat and with the DA 35mm f2.4 they are brilliant, so the HD was returned. So please mention the lens you used.
I've looked into that setting, and have also tried several lenses, so far no luck on this particular issue, but I do find the natural and lively settings very handig in a lot of cases

QuoteOriginally posted by jgnfld:
If you are developing jpegs in-camera, what are your settings?
for the two pictures below, everything is on auto as far as the settings go, very nice picture of yours btw
Attached Images
View Picture EXIF
PENTAX KP  Photo 
View Picture EXIF
PENTAX KP  Photo 
06-03-2023, 05:53 AM - 1 Like   #7
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I think the images look great, but green is my favorite color.

Whenever I buy used equipment, I reset it to factory defaults, then assess what settings I need to change.

06-03-2023, 06:16 AM - 1 Like   #8
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Just a couple more thoughts, after seeing the images, the green might be looking a bit over the top because it is really the only colour in the image. Also, are you using window light here? I have found in some cases, to get the best colour, manual white balance is worth a go. It's a little bit of a pain but it's not like your subject is going to rush off all of a sudden. Another thing, Custom Image settings (or whatever they are called on your camera) won't affect the colours of your RAW files. If you want to use the jpegs, I suggest using a setting with lower saturation & contrast. You might even be able to change some of the settings. I think it's preferable to be able to boost those later if need be.
06-03-2023, 06:42 AM   #9
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QuoteOriginally posted by This_dude Quote
I've attached two jpegs from the camera below
Thanks. The greens don't look overdone to me, but obviously I am not looking at them on your screen. Do they look the same on a phone screen or someone else's computer monitor ?

I do notice that the EXIF shows +2 for both contrast and sharpening which may lead to a more vibrant image.
06-03-2023, 07:04 AM   #10
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You can customize the jpg profiles in the KP. Try the natural one to start and see if that tones things down too much. Then work from there or the one you have now and adjust.
06-03-2023, 08:26 AM - 1 Like   #11
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QuoteOriginally posted by This_dude Quote
Hi there, new user here and this post is my reason for finally creating an account,

I recently bought a pentax KP and have been very happy with it so far exept for one little thing that I can't seem to figure out, a lot of my pictures of plants seem to have very exagerated greens, almos fluorescent and artificial like, reds and blues have been beautiful so far (especially the reds stand out in how accurate they come out) but greens have me stumped, I've looked into the whitebalance settings, my lighting, different lenses with different coatings, all with marginal differences but none result in a acceptably accurate rendition of the foliage colors.
I'm currently looking into improving my pp skills to try and fix it in post, but I was wondering if anyone has had a similar problem, and if there is an in camera fix.
I shoot dng+ and mostly leave whitebalance on auto

also, to be clear, pictures turn out great generally, its not like there is a green tint or anything, its just that parts of the picture that are green, come out "too green"
I noticed early on with my KP that if it was set on "Vibrant" and to a lesser extant "Bright" custom image settings, that the colors were exaggerated or even garish especially in the "Vibrant" custom image setting. I find that I get the best results using the "Natural" setting. On my other Pentax cameras (*istDS, K-5 & K-3) the "Bright" custom image setting has generally been fine. Try the "Natural" setting & see if that gives better more natural results.
06-03-2023, 09:17 AM   #12
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The DA21 seems to show greens especially vibrantly on my K3iii (shooting raw). I usually dial down the green channel a little in saturation slider in Lightroom to taste. Sometimes the reds as well.
06-03-2023, 07:51 PM   #13
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I think it's a really good idea to look at the Custom Image options (JPEG profiles) and how you can customize them. Pentax offers a huge amount of customizability to the JPEG output. There are quite a lot of presets to start with and then many parameter adjustments to customize each one.

To get the look you want, it might be good to take a RAW file and use the in-camera RAW development tool to get the look you want out of the camera. Then you can use those settings going forward. The way to do this is to look at the Raw image in playback mode and use the Manage Image function. Not 100% sure which button it is on the KP, but it's AE-L on the K-3 III.

Actually, I've had the chance to see a couple of presentations and take part in a Pentax seminar on Custom Image settings here in Japan. In one of them, the engineer responsible for developing the feature spoke about the differences between some of the preset options. The "Natural" setting is supposed not to have a strong bias, but still to have the "Pentax-ness" about it. I think this might mean strong greens, among other things. On the other hand, they later added "Flat" for people who just wanted a completely neutral looking image. It does not have this particular Pentax character at all.

The other seminar, they suggested to think of the presets as just a starting point to add your own customizations to. This was focused on what you can achieve by shooting RAW and doing in-camera development.

I guess if you want more customization than this, doing RAW development in a computer application is the way to go.

References:
About Custom image Presets: Give further expression with PENTAX "Custom Image" | RICOH IMAGING
About Parameter Adjustment: More info | Give further expression with PENTAX "Custom Image" | RICOH IMAGING
06-04-2023, 12:21 AM   #14
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Something occurred to me … there's not a "skylight" filter or similar on the lens which is skewing the colour balance, is there?
I noticed, in an advert posting, the offered "skylight" filter had a definite magenta hue, which is, of course, the opposite to green.
06-04-2023, 06:12 AM   #15
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QuoteOriginally posted by robgski Quote
I think the images look great, but green is my favorite color.

Whenever I buy used equipment, I reset it to factory defaults, then assess what settings I need to change.
true haha, green is my favourite colour as well, the factory reset is a good tip, I hadn't thought of doing one because I was lucky enough to find one of the last (possibly even the last) brand new KP in the Netherlands, maybe even europe, at a shop in Den Haag, but it is quite possible that this was a showroom model so a factory reset might be a good idea

QuoteOriginally posted by rpjallan Quote
Just a couple more thoughts, after seeing the images, the green might be looking a bit over the top because it is really the only colour in the image. Also, are you using window light here? I have found in some cases, to get the best colour, manual white balance is worth a go. It's a little bit of a pain but it's not like your subject is going to rush off all of a sudden. Another thing, Custom Image settings (or whatever they are called on your camera) won't affect the colours of your RAW files. If you want to use the jpegs, I suggest using a setting with lower saturation & contrast. You might even be able to change some of the settings. I think it's preferable to be able to boost those later if need be.
the green does contrast quite a bit with the black background, as pictures I actually quite like them as is, but since they are product photos for our webshop I'm going for color accuracy haha, the light I'm using here is a small led light, not ideal I know (working on getting a propper lighting solution), but previously with my canon eos 100D never had any issues using it, I tried experimenting with the temperature setting on the light, but the camera on auto always compensates to right about the same colours, one thing I did noticed just today while taking some pictures outside is that the more natural light hits the subject/scene, the more natural the greens look, in shady spots I would notice it more than straight in the sun. several people have suggested looking into the jpeg profiles, I'll do that and try a lower saturation and contrast setting, seems like my camera still has a lot of features for me to learn haha

QuoteOriginally posted by pschlute Quote
Thanks. The greens don't look overdone to me, but obviously I am not looking at them on your screen. Do they look the same on a phone screen or someone else's computer monitor ?

I do notice that the EXIF shows +2 for both contrast and sharpening which may lead to a more vibrant image.
it does differ a bit from screen to screen, but generally I can notice right away on the camera screen, I'm not sure where that +2 is comming from, it does seem to be consistent across all of my pictures, I'll do a factory reset as suggested by robgski and see if that changes anything, otherwise, I'll look into where that setting can be changed

QuoteOriginally posted by UncleVanya Quote
You can customize the jpg profiles in the KP. Try the natural one to start and see if that tones things down too much. Then work from there or the one you have now and adjust.
I'll do this, seems like there's still a lot of customization options for me to learn, coming from a canon eos 100D I'm not used to this amount of features haha, but loving every bit of it so far!

QuoteOriginally posted by JPT Quote
I think it's a really good idea to look at the Custom Image options (JPEG profiles) and how you can customize them. Pentax offers a huge amount of customizability to the JPEG output. There are quite a lot of presets to start with and then many parameter adjustments to customize each one.

To get the look you want, it might be good to take a RAW file and use the in-camera RAW development tool to get the look you want out of the camera. Then you can use those settings going forward. The way to do this is to look at the Raw image in playback mode and use the Manage Image function. Not 100% sure which button it is on the KP, but it's AE-L on the K-3 III.

Actually, I've had the chance to see a couple of presentations and take part in a Pentax seminar on Custom Image settings here in Japan. In one of them, the engineer responsible for developing the feature spoke about the differences between some of the preset options. The "Natural" setting is supposed not to have a strong bias, but still to have the "Pentax-ness" about it. I think this might mean strong greens, among other things. On the other hand, they later added "Flat" for people who just wanted a completely neutral looking image. It does not have this particular Pentax character at all.

The other seminar, they suggested to think of the presets as just a starting point to add your own customizations to. This was focused on what you can achieve by shooting RAW and doing in-camera development.

I guess if you want more customization than this, doing RAW development in a computer application is the way to go.

References:
About Custom image Presets: Give further expression with PENTAX "Custom Image" | RICOH IMAGING
About Parameter Adjustment: More info | Give further expression with PENTAX "Custom Image" | RICOH IMAGING
oh wow, thank you for the detailed answe, I was already planning on googling it later, but it appears here is all the info i need to work with the profiles haha, I'll give it a try today and update tomorrow

QuoteOriginally posted by kypfer Quote
Something occurred to me … there's not a "skylight" filter or similar on the lens which is skewing the colour balance, is there?
I noticed, in an advert posting, the offered "skylight" filter had a definite magenta hue, which is, of course, the opposite to green.
no filter on the lens no, but indeed something to keep in mind!
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