[Tingchaleun]

Hello, i'm a big fan of this website: [daily dose of imagery]
His photos look amazing, and its great exercise to think about how he took the shot. I'm certain he uses some sort of filter to get a really contrasty-documentary look, but i don't know anything about filters, except i know they can be very expensive. So i wanted to ask this forum if anybody uses filters on their lenses, and if you do, tell me a little about the variety, what to watch out for, costs, etc. i want to know anything you can tell me.

There are certain shots that, from my experience, seem impossible to shoot while retaining so much detail in the high contrast areas. For example, there was one shot that was taken of a ttc (Toronto Transit Commission) street car...[daily dose of imagery] moon and streetcar ...How is this shot possible?

Check out all or most of his pictures, they are all great.

[TheWengler]

The most useful filters on a DSLR are a circular polarizer, graduated neutral density filter and a neutral density filter. The polarizer is used for reducing glare and increasing the pop of clouds. It's most effective when pointed at 90 degrees from the light source. Graduated ND filters are used for those scenes when you either have a dark foreground and a well exposed sky or a blown out sky and a well exposed foreground. It's more convenient to use rectangular filters for these situations because you aren't limited to framing the horizon in the center of the image. Another solution to this problem is high dynamic range photography. Basically for HDR you take several images of the same scene. Usually at least 3. Each at different exposures then combine them using software. ND filters are used for taking longer exposures in bright light. Most commonly for achieving that fluid water look. Most of the other filter types can be duplicated in Photoshop. B+W is the highest quality brand but expensive. Hoya is still good but more affordable. Multi coated filters also seem to becoming more popular.

[TaoMaas]

There are certain shots that, from my experience, seem impossible to shoot while retaining so much detail in the high contrast areas. For example, there was one shot that was taken of a ttc (Toronto Transit Commission) street car...[daily dose of imagery] moon and streetcar ...How is this shot possible?

Several days before the actual full moon, the moon comes up in a pretty bright sky. Each day afterwards, the moon comes up later and later until the day of the full moon when it comes up in a dark sky. So it's possible to shoot what appears to be a full moon and still have semi-decent light on the rest of the scene.

[Tingchaleun]

Thanks for the replies. So far, great info! I have a few more questions though:

"Graduated ND filters are used for those scenes when you either have a dark foreground and a well exposed sky or a blown out sky and a well exposed foreground. "
- Do you mean in an "either-or" circumstances or one graduated ND filter can be used for both circumstances?

"It's more convenient to use rectangular filters for these situations because you aren't limited to framing the horizon in the center of the image. "
- I am lost here, what is a rectangular filter? how does it fit onto my lens?

- What do multicoated filters do in addition to the Graduated ND filters and ND filters?

- Also, sometimes when i read lens-reviews, there is mention of the front element rotating when focusing, therefore a polarizer is not good/functionble/recommended.....why is that? And by "polarizer" does this include graduated ND filters and ND filters?

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Last edited by Tingchaleun; 12-06-2007 at 02:26 PM.

[TaoMaas]

Thanks for the replies. So far, great info! I have a few more questions though:

"Graduated ND filters are used for those scenes when you either have a dark foreground and a well exposed sky or a blown out sky and a well exposed foreground. "
- Do you mean in an "either-or" circumstances or one graduated ND filter can be used for both circumstances?

Those are generally your choices when you've got a sky that's much brighter than the foreground. If you give the sky the proper exposure, then the foreground goes dark. But if you expose for the foreground, the sky gets over-exposed. That's when you would use a graduated ND (Neutral Density) filter. You use the dark half of the filter to knock down the brightness of the sky so that you can arrive at an exposure that will keep both the sky and the foreground in a useable range.

"It's more convenient to use rectangular filters for these situations because you aren't limited to framing the horizon in the center of the image. "
- I am lost here, what is a rectangular filter? how does it fit onto my lens?

Are you familiar with the Cokin line of filters? Those are retangular filters. There's a filter holder for them that attaches to the front of your lens. You don't HAVE to use that holder, though. I usually just hold my filter up to the front of my lens.

- What do multicoated filters do in addition to the Graduated ND filters and ND filters?

Multicoating is something that's completely different than neutral density. All sorts of filters can have multicoating. It's basically just very, very thin layers (or coats) that are applied to the surface of a lens or filter to help control flare and to increase contrast.

- Also, sometimes when i read lens-reviews, there is mention of the front element rotating when focusing, therefore a polarizer is not good/functionble/recommended.....why is that? And by "polarizer" does this include graduated ND filters and ND filters?

To work a polarizer, you have to rotate the filter until you get the effect you desire. That's why it makes a difference if the front element of the lens you're using it on rotates. You can still use the polarizer. It's just that you may have to reset it after your lens focuses.

[TaoMaas]

Here's a pic of mine in the gallery where I used a graduated neutral density filter:
User Photo Gallery - Landscape

In the actual scene, the sky was brighter than the reflection in the water, so I used a neutral density filter to knock down the brightness of the sky and make it match the reflection better. Except I used to strong of a filter and the sky ended up a tad too dark. lol I don't remember for sure, but if I were guessing, I say that I used my 2 stop graduated ND and I should have used the 1 stop.

[Tingchaleun]

Thanks Taomass, you've been a great help!

i noticed that some filters are described with either a "4x" or "8x" ND filter. what does this mean?

What is the difference between an ND filter and polarizer? or are they the same?

As with good quality lenses, does it matter if i spend $30 on a polarizer, or $100? (Hoya has a huge range).

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Last edited by Tingchaleun; 12-06-2007 at 08:24 PM.

[TaoMaas]

Thanks Taomass, you've been a great help!

i noticed that some filters are described with either a "4x" or "8x" ND filter. what does this mean? What is the difference between an ND filter and polarizer? or are they the same?

They're different filters. A neutral density filter decreases the amount of light coming into the camera without affecting the colors. Why would you want to do that? Well...let's say you wanted to take a shot of a waterfall and make the water blur, but it's too bright out for you to be able to get your shutter speed below 1/30th of a second. By adding a neutral density filter, you can cut the light down further and get your shutter speed to 1/8 or 1/4, depending on how strong of a filter you use. Or maybe you're shooting portraits outdoors, but again the light is too bright for you to open up your lens and throw the background out of focus. You could put on a neutral density filter, cut down the light, and thereby be able to use a wider aperture to blur the background. A graduated neutral density filter is only dark on 1/2 of the filter and is used to darken only a portion of a scene. The 2x, 4x, 8x ratings on neutral density filters tell you how much your exposure will increase with that particular filter. I think a 2x means you need to double your exposure time, which corresponds to opening up your lens one f-stop or doubling your shutter speed time.
A polarizer removes reflections. It can kill reflections on store windows or remove the shine from a leaf, for example. Removing the reflections in a scene will often intensify the colors and that's why a lot of people like to use them. A polarizer will also make the sky a darker blue when used at the right angle. I think the reason it does that is because it removes the reflections on the particles in the air, but don't quote me on that. lol It's most effective at 90 degrees to the angle of the sun. Normally, a polarizer will cut down your light by 2 stops. That's probably why you're thinking it's the same thing as a neutral density filter.

[TheWengler]

This might help you...

Filter options for digital cameras

[TaoMaas]

As with good quality lenses, does it matter if i spend $30 on a polarizer, or $100? (Hoya has a huge range).

Yeah, it matters, but you have to decide how MUCH it matters to you, just like you would with lenses. As a rule of thumb, I'd buy a filter that's about the same quality range as the lens you intend to put it on. But that I mean that if you're shooting the kit lenses with your Pentax DSLR, then a Tiffen or Hoya filter would be fine. But if you shoot with nothing but the 77mm or 31mm Limited lenses, you might want to think about stepping up to a B&W or Heliopan filter.

[Tingchaleun]

Awesome info, thanks guys. That website is pretty comprehensive. I think i've got all my questions answered. I'm gonna try out a polarizer and see what it does for my photos.

[Groundloop]

Off topic and rather late, but when I saw the shot of the full moon and the streetcar I knew immediately where it was taken and wondered if Sam took it. I checked the "About" page on the site and sure enough I was right. I sometimes freelance at the company he works for. Very talented and a super nice guy.

[Tingchaleun]

I know this thread hasn't been active for a while, but if you did follow along, i was researching for polarizing filters to put on my Tamron 28-75 2.8. I decided to get a Hoya HMC67mm made in Japan. This model comes in the grey packaging (Hoya colour codes their line of polarizers.) Anyways, for those who might be interested, here are two quick shots i took with and without polarizers.

About Photos: Unprocessed, shot in raw and saved as jpegs via lightroom. NOTE: i had to save the images significantly smaller than their original 2.5mb file sizes. But my intentions are to show the contrast that it brings out and not necessarily the quality or sharpness. The last image is an post-processed version of the shot where a polarizer was used.

[Tingchaleun]

after uploading the photos, and seeing it on the website, they appear slightly darker and less contrast than how i view it directly in Windows and PS.

If you're interested in specs for these shots: 1) 1/250, f8, iso200, @38mm, 2) 1/60, f8, iso200 @38mm. The added polarizer slowed down my shutter speed, big time!