UV filters degrade image quality

ChristianRock · 09-05-2013, 12:14 PM

Originally posted by JimJohnson

For some reason my web browser is not showing a post from Christian Rock, but I did get an email copy of the post:

I changed the post because I quickly realized I misread yours, where you mentioned caps I read hoods. So if I quickly updated my post, it's because I wanted it changed, not posted as it was originally.

**JimJohnson** · 09-05-2013, 12:36 PM

Originally posted by ChristianRock

Obviously you're not reading my posts.

I've already said I take them off to take pictures.

Oh I read them - word for word. I just have trouble believing that anyone would consistently bother to mount and unmount screw-in filters, carefully store them away from the environment while shooting, and then mount them again (after cleaning any dust off the front element of the lens - otherwise why bother putting a filter back on?). But you say you do, so you do. Personally, I'd miss a lot of great photos if I went to that trouble every time I picked up my camera.

ChristianRock · 09-05-2013, 12:43 PM

Why do I have to explain to you how I like to take pictures?

Usually I'll leave the bag in the car, take the camera with whatever lens I want on it and then maybe carry another one with me in case I need it. Or I'll get the camera to use it inside the house, put a lens on it according to my needs and the available light, maybe put a flash on, and off I go.
I'm sure as I go older I might simplify the process... but I like storing the camera with the body cap without lenses, and every lens in its place... so what, everybody is different

**JimJohnson** · 09-05-2013, 01:07 PM

Originally posted by ChristianRock

Why do I have to explain to you how I like to take pictures?

You don't.

I am decidedly of the type that I purchase gear to be used and not coddled. At the same time, I don't abuse gear or skimp on maintenance. That's true for my power and hand tools, scuba equipment (which my life depends on when in use), photo gear, etc. I don't deliberately put my lenses or cameras in harms way. I have cameras that are pushing 90 years old that are fully functional. (too bad I can no longer get film for some)

UV filters served a purpose back in my film days. I have found that with digital photography they are more a liability than an asset. In my opinion, a self-storing hood (mostly reversible bayonet mount in my case) and lens cap offers much better protection of my front lens elements than any filter, and a hood actually improves my images rather than degrades them in use. Caps and bayonet mount hoods also mount and unmount faster so I am much more likely to use them consistently. Finally, a filter really does nothing about keeping dust or humidity away from the most delicate optical surfaces, which are those inside and at the back of the lens. Body caps are good - but too, they argue against your preference for a filter over a lens cap on your lenses. They will let as much dust into your camera body as a good lens cap will allow to reach the front element of the lens.

Keep shooting and post some images for all of us to see! In the end, that's what really counts here. Learning (always learning) on how to improve my own photography.

ChristianRock · 09-05-2013, 01:11 PM

Originally posted by JimJohnson

Keep shooting and post some images for all of us to see! In the end, that's what really counts here. Learning (always learning) on how to improve my own photography.

Considering how many great, great photographers there are in this forum, and the fact I'm basically starting out this year, I think I'll wait a little bit and practice some more

Thanks for your thoughts.

richardstringer · 09-05-2013, 01:49 PM

I've stopped using my UV filter now, and i'm now using the lens hood too to try and keep sun flare out my photos.

**JimJohnson** · 09-05-2013, 03:17 PM

Originally posted by ChristianRock

Considering how many great, great photographers there are in this forum, and the fact I'm basically starting out this year, I think I'll wait a little bit and practice some more

Thanks for your thoughts.

Oh please do post anyhow. Look at this thread:
https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/pentax-k-r/201775-bad-image-quality.html

It is basically a year long journal of a photographer coming to grips with her new K-r. Reading the advice and watching the growth of this photographer is quite inspirational - are you watching this thread hollywoodhr?

SteveTheOldMan · 09-05-2013, 03:28 PM

When shooting landscapes, I do tend to use the CPL a lot. I have to admit that the UV filter is always on...I'm going to take the advice here, lose the UV & see if that improve IQ some.

SteveTheOldMan · 09-05-2013, 03:32 PM

@ricjardstringer...Very clever!

richardstringer · 09-05-2013, 04:08 PM

Thanks steve.

ChristianRock · 09-06-2013, 06:37 AM

Originally posted by JimJohnson

Oh please do post anyhow. Look at this thread:
https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/pentax-k-r/201775-bad-image-quality.html

It is basically a year long journal of a photographer coming to grips with her new K-r. Reading the advice and watching the growth of this photographer is quite inspirational - are you watching this thread hollywoodhr?

Thank you for pointing to that thread, it is inspiring indeed!

But from what I gather, her main discovery was how to use software. Which is also what I'm working on at the moment, without being able to afford Photoshop, so I'm using Picasa (for quick edits) and Raw Therapee.

**JimJohnson** · 09-06-2013, 07:32 AM

Originally posted by ChristianRock

Thank you for pointing to that thread, it is inspiring indeed!

But from what I gather, her main discovery was how to use software. Which is also what I'm working on at the moment, without being able to afford Photoshop, so I'm using Picasa (for quick edits) and Raw Therapee.

This subject seems to be evolving. Hollywoodhr did in fact become better at post processing, but she evolved in her camera handling skills too. I'm sort of waiting to see if and what she posts next.

There are several free tools. If you are happy with them, that's great. For me Photoshop Elements has become a very cost effective solution. It uses the same Adobe Camera RAW as both its big siblings Photoshop and Lightroom. It is sort of a cross between those two, pulling out the most commonly used features of both. MSRP for version 11 is US$100, but I suspect version 12 is waiting in the wings and you can find version 11 frequently discounted to around US$50.

Once I started using PSE 11, I pretty much abandoned my much more expensive LR4 and all my freebie editors.

richardstringer · 09-06-2013, 09:34 AM

I use Photoshop Elements 10, it's fantastic for it's price, although i've heard about a graduated nd filter in Lightroom and i'm very interested in that because I keep forgetting to use my nd grad filter when I need it.

nanhi · 09-06-2013, 11:21 AM

Hello Richardstringer Sir, perhaps you bought a fake Hoya. I have seen a lot of these replicas from China and the Philippines sold unabashedly on Amazon and ebay and perhaps elsewhere like India, Thailand, Bangkok etc.
I use Hoya Pro1D filters + some B&W + SMC Pentax, and these are awesome.
Yes, every filter degrades image quality to a certain extent. But using the ones above, one can hardly notice the difference.
I was mildly surprised by a 62mm GRIFFEN Slim Frame Filter I bought for $ 9 in a Lane in Kolkata India full of Camera Shops, for my DA 18-135 WR lens. 62mm is an odd size and only the Griffen appeared to look good (well manufactured and coated), while most Hoyas there were fakes.
It turned out to be an excellent one.
And this controversy - to filter or not to filter - will go on and on till doomsday.
Regards.

richardstringer · 09-06-2013, 11:28 AM

I bought the Hoya filter from Amazon which are pretty damn good, i've never heard of any fake stuff on there.

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09-05-2013, 12:14 PM	#31
ChristianRock Pentaxian Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: People's Republic of America Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 9,910	Originally posted by JimJohnson For some reason my web browser is not showing a post from Christian Rock, but I did get an email copy of the post: I changed the post because I quickly realized I misread yours, where you mentioned caps I read hoods. So if I quickly updated my post, it's because I wanted it changed, not posted as it was originally.

09-05-2013, 12:36 PM	#32
JimJohnson Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Summer:Lake Superior - Michigan Winter:Texas Hill Country Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,774	Originally posted by ChristianRock Obviously you're not reading my posts. I've already said I take them off to take pictures. Oh I read them - word for word. I just have trouble believing that anyone would consistently bother to mount and unmount screw-in filters, carefully store them away from the environment while shooting, and then mount them again (after cleaning any dust off the front element of the lens - otherwise why bother putting a filter back on?). But you say you do, so you do. Personally, I'd miss a lot of great photos if I went to that trouble every time I picked up my camera.

09-05-2013, 12:43 PM	#33
ChristianRock Pentaxian Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: People's Republic of America Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 9,910	Why do I have to explain to you how I like to take pictures? Usually I'll leave the bag in the car, take the camera with whatever lens I want on it and then maybe carry another one with me in case I need it. Or I'll get the camera to use it inside the house, put a lens on it according to my needs and the available light, maybe put a flash on, and off I go. I'm sure as I go older I might simplify the process... but I like storing the camera with the body cap without lenses, and every lens in its place... so what, everybody is different

09-05-2013, 01:07 PM	#34
JimJohnson Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Summer:Lake Superior - Michigan Winter:Texas Hill Country Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,774	Originally posted by ChristianRock Why do I have to explain to you how I like to take pictures? You don't. I am decidedly of the type that I purchase gear to be used and not coddled. At the same time, I don't abuse gear or skimp on maintenance. That's true for my power and hand tools, scuba equipment (which my life depends on when in use), photo gear, etc. I don't deliberately put my lenses or cameras in harms way. I have cameras that are pushing 90 years old that are fully functional. (too bad I can no longer get film for some) UV filters served a purpose back in my film days. I have found that with digital photography they are more a liability than an asset. In my opinion, a self-storing hood (mostly reversible bayonet mount in my case) and lens cap offers much better protection of my front lens elements than any filter, and a hood actually improves my images rather than degrades them in use. Caps and bayonet mount hoods also mount and unmount faster so I am much more likely to use them consistently. Finally, a filter really does nothing about keeping dust or humidity away from the most delicate optical surfaces, which are those inside and at the back of the lens. Body caps are good - but too, they argue against your preference for a filter over a lens cap on your lenses. They will let as much dust into your camera body as a good lens cap will allow to reach the front element of the lens. Keep shooting and post some images for all of us to see! In the end, that's what really counts here. Learning (always learning) on how to improve my own photography.

09-05-2013, 01:11 PM	#35
ChristianRock Pentaxian Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: People's Republic of America Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 9,910	Originally posted by JimJohnson Keep shooting and post some images for all of us to see! In the end, that's what really counts here. Learning (always learning) on how to improve my own photography. Considering how many great, great photographers there are in this forum, and the fact I'm basically starting out this year, I think I'll wait a little bit and practice some more Thanks for your thoughts.

09-05-2013, 01:49 PM	#36
richardstringer Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Boston, Lincolnshire Posts: 145 Original Poster	I've stopped using my UV filter now, and i'm now using the lens hood too to try and keep sun flare out my photos.

09-05-2013, 03:17 PM	#37
JimJohnson Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Summer:Lake Superior - Michigan Winter:Texas Hill Country Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,774	Originally posted by ChristianRock Considering how many great, great photographers there are in this forum, and the fact I'm basically starting out this year, I think I'll wait a little bit and practice some more Thanks for your thoughts. Oh please do post anyhow. Look at this thread: https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/pentax-k-r/201775-bad-image-quality.html It is basically a year long journal of a photographer coming to grips with her new K-r. Reading the advice and watching the growth of this photographer is quite inspirational - are you watching this thread hollywoodhr?

09-05-2013, 03:28 PM	#38
SteveTheOldMan Forum Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Central MA, USA Posts: 63	When shooting landscapes, I do tend to use the CPL a lot. I have to admit that the UV filter is always on...I'm going to take the advice here, lose the UV & see if that improve IQ some.

09-05-2013, 03:32 PM	#39
SteveTheOldMan Forum Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Central MA, USA Posts: 63	@ricjardstringer...Very clever!

09-05-2013, 04:08 PM	#40
richardstringer Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Boston, Lincolnshire Posts: 145 Original Poster	Thanks steve.

09-06-2013, 06:37 AM	#41
ChristianRock Pentaxian Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: People's Republic of America Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 9,910	Originally posted by JimJohnson Oh please do post anyhow. Look at this thread: https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/pentax-k-r/201775-bad-image-quality.html It is basically a year long journal of a photographer coming to grips with her new K-r. Reading the advice and watching the growth of this photographer is quite inspirational - are you watching this thread hollywoodhr? Thank you for pointing to that thread, it is inspiring indeed! But from what I gather, her main discovery was how to use software. Which is also what I'm working on at the moment, without being able to afford Photoshop, so I'm using Picasa (for quick edits) and Raw Therapee.

09-06-2013, 07:32 AM	#42
JimJohnson Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Summer:Lake Superior - Michigan Winter:Texas Hill Country Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,774	Originally posted by ChristianRock Thank you for pointing to that thread, it is inspiring indeed! But from what I gather, her main discovery was how to use software. Which is also what I'm working on at the moment, without being able to afford Photoshop, so I'm using Picasa (for quick edits) and Raw Therapee. This subject seems to be evolving. Hollywoodhr did in fact become better at post processing, but she evolved in her camera handling skills too. I'm sort of waiting to see if and what she posts next. There are several free tools. If you are happy with them, that's great. For me Photoshop Elements has become a very cost effective solution. It uses the same Adobe Camera RAW as both its big siblings Photoshop and Lightroom. It is sort of a cross between those two, pulling out the most commonly used features of both. MSRP for version 11 is US$100, but I suspect version 12 is waiting in the wings and you can find version 11 frequently discounted to around US$50. Once I started using PSE 11, I pretty much abandoned my much more expensive LR4 and all my freebie editors.

09-06-2013, 09:34 AM	#43
richardstringer Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Boston, Lincolnshire Posts: 145 Original Poster	I use Photoshop Elements 10, it's fantastic for it's price, although i've heard about a graduated nd filter in Lightroom and i'm very interested in that because I keep forgetting to use my nd grad filter when I need it.

09-06-2013, 11:21 AM	#44
nanhi Veteran Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Bangalore, India Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 469	Hello Richardstringer Sir, perhaps you bought a fake Hoya. I have seen a lot of these replicas from China and the Philippines sold unabashedly on Amazon and ebay and perhaps elsewhere like India, Thailand, Bangkok etc. I use Hoya Pro1D filters + some B&W + SMC Pentax, and these are awesome. Yes, every filter degrades image quality to a certain extent. But using the ones above, one can hardly notice the difference. I was mildly surprised by a 62mm GRIFFEN Slim Frame Filter I bought for $ 9 in a Lane in Kolkata India full of Camera Shops, for my DA 18-135 WR lens. 62mm is an odd size and only the Griffen appeared to look good (well manufactured and coated), while most Hoyas there were fakes. It turned out to be an excellent one. And this controversy - to filter or not to filter - will go on and on till doomsday. Regards.

09-06-2013, 11:28 AM	#45
richardstringer Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Boston, Lincolnshire Posts: 145 Original Poster	I bought the Hoya filter from Amazon which are pretty damn good, i've never heard of any fake stuff on there.