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06-24-2015, 01:23 PM   #1
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Wireless Flash Question - How to Make Main Flash Not Part of Exposure?

Hi Guys,

Going to be trying my hand at some wireless flash today. I have in the past used it (K-5 and K-7) and never cared about the main camera flash being a part of the exposure. However, I realize it should be possible? According the my AF540gz manual anyway. I can't seem to find this info the K-3 manual. Can this be done?

I want to just use my AF540gz or AF360gz fire flash off camera but not have the main camera flash to be included in the exposure. Please help me and sorry if this has been covered, I did not see it in search. Thanks guys in advance!

06-24-2015, 01:29 PM   #2
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QuoteOriginally posted by Ron_Man Quote
Hi Guys,

Going to be trying my hand at some wireless flash today. I have in the past used it (K-5 and K-7) and never cared about the main camera flash being a part of the exposure. However, I realize it should be possible? According the my AF540gz manual anyway. I can't seem to find this info the K-3 manual. Can this be done?

I want to just use my AF540gz or AF360gz fire flash off camera but not have the main camera flash to be included in the exposure. Please help me and sorry if this has been covered, I did not see it in search. Thanks guys in advance!
Set the pop-up flash to controller

Last edited by enoeske; 06-24-2015 at 01:46 PM.
06-24-2015, 01:37 PM   #3
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QuoteOriginally posted by enoeske Quote
Set the pop-up flash to master controller
I've tried both but the pop up flash still shows up in my pictures.

Maybe the question is what mode should the AF540gz be on? I have it set to slave, as that is the only way to get it to fire wirelessly.

Am I doing it right and this is what to expect as the outcome?
06-24-2015, 01:42 PM   #4
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I have seen other people comment that despite the promise of not including the pop-up flash in the exposure they have not seen this in practice. In practice they claim the pop-up still contributes to the exposure. Could you try adding a small modifier to bounce this so the off camera flash still sees it but the effect is limited on the subject?

06-24-2015, 01:46 PM   #5
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QuoteOriginally posted by Ron_Man Quote
I've tried both but the pop up flash still shows up in my pictures.

Maybe the question is what mode should the AF540gz be on? I have it set to slave, as that is the only way to get it to fire wirelessly.

Am I doing it right and this is what to expect as the outcome?
There is a good discussion here:

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/22-pentax-camera-field-accessories/161062...-external.html
06-24-2015, 03:02 PM   #6
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QuoteOriginally posted by Ron_Man Quote
Maybe the question is what mode should the AF540gz be on? I have it set to slave, as that is the only way to get it to fire wirelessly.
Set your K-3 built-in flash to "Wireless (Controller)" and the AF540GZ to "P-TTL/Slave".

This is in the AF540GZ manual but is confusing. It is only hinted at in the K-3 manual. As noted above, there is still some chance that the on-board flash will contribute to the exposure. It depends on the distances for both the slave and the subject.


Steve

Last edited by stevebrot; 06-24-2015 at 03:07 PM.
06-24-2015, 03:06 PM   #7
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QuoteOriginally posted by UncleVanya Quote
Could you try adding a small modifier to bounce this so the off camera flash still sees it but the effect is limited on the subject?
IIRC, this is the most common work-around, though it can be tricky to set up.


Steve
06-24-2015, 03:16 PM   #8
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No matter what mode it is in, master or control, the triggering flash (built-in or attached to the hotshoe) always fires during exposure. Whether it contributes significantly to the exposure depends on distance, ambient light, lens aperture, ....

Don't take my word for it, take a test photo in front of a mirror, with the triggering flash visible in the photo, and see for yourself.

06-24-2015, 05:05 PM   #9
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Please correct me if I am incorrect (I know you guys will never hesitate though to show someone wrong haha) But IIRC it has to trigger since Pentax uses an optical triggering method. This isn't an RF setup. The flashes must be in line of sight or at least in a location to pickup the OBF's light.

I'm using a pair of cheap RF triggers to play with remote (off camera) flash. It works well and the whole package was around 20 USD. Search for 'NPT-04' maybe if you get tired of the Pentax solution (I know this a fork in the thread.. but useful enough I thought to mention).
06-24-2015, 05:47 PM   #10
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Which wireless triggers support PTTL?
06-24-2015, 07:57 PM   #11
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kozlok Quote
Which wireless triggers support PTTL?
I've heard that NONE support Pentax P-TTL. There was a deal that Adam highlighted recently for a Cactus flash set-up, but after reading it, I think it didn't support P-TTL but rather a very flexible manual RF setup where you could change flash settings from the remote: Exclusive Cactus Flash and Sirui Tripod Coupon - Deals and Savings | PentaxForums.com
06-24-2015, 09:09 PM   #12
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There can be a small amount of the popup flash still present, which might be useful for portrait catchlights, but unwanted in something like a carefully-constructed still-life piece (which you're going to use manual for anyway, rather than P-TTL's guesswork).
06-25-2015, 12:32 AM   #13
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you can use very cheap radio triggers for manual set-up or get the Cactus V6 that supports Pentax PTTL.
06-25-2015, 07:29 AM   #14
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QuoteOriginally posted by max_pyne Quote
you can use very cheap radio triggers for manual set-up or get the Cactus V6 that supports Pentax PTTL.
I'm not sure that the Cactus supports P-TTL. See manual here: http://www.cactus-image.com/Cactus%20V6%20User%20Manual%20(EN).pdf

One mention of P-TTL in the whole thing and it isn't suggesting that it supports P-TTL in fact it is saying it can only use the TTL control on basic TTL flashes not those that are P-TTL etc.
06-25-2015, 07:40 AM   #15
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TTL pass-through: The V6 essentially pretends to not be there, thus allowing the on-camera flash to use all its native (P-TLL) features.
Note that pressing the shutter release button on the camera will fire the flash and trigger the V6 only if the shutter speed does not exceed the sync-speed. Unfortunately, Pentax cameras do not use the centre pin for triggering an on-camera flash in HSS mode. It is thus not possible to “steal” the HSS trigger signal, so optical triggering remains the only option for letting manual flashes contribute to an HSS exposure.

---------- Post added 25-06-15 at 16:41 ----------

UPDATE: As of firmware version V1.1.008, the V6 supports the Pentax AF540FGZ II and the Pentax AF360 FGZ II flash models.

Read more at: Cactus V6 Review - Conclusion | PentaxForums.com Reviews


I personally do not miss P-TTL support. Many professionals also avoid the vagaries of automatic metering and prefer manual flashes instead. David Hobby (aka “The Strobist”) once commented on TTL: "...I tweaked them around a lot. I am not used to the on-the-fly variability of TTL (one reason I do not normally use it) so the camera and I were both trying to drive the car."
Ideally, the V6 would still be able to emulate a system-dedicated P-TTL flash on-camera for two particular reasons that are Pentax-specific: It would be able to fool a Pentax DSLR into providing second-curtain sync and HSS trigger events. While the V6 can emulate these features with some manual delay settings and/or the help of a P-TTL capable flash, it would surely be convenient to use these P-TLL extras in a fully automated fashion. However, I personally would certainly not want to pay extra for this convenience. The ability to remote control power levels of off-camera flashes is the main feature of the V6 and I personally would not want it to become more expensive or specific to certain brands in order to have support for these features added.
I value that the V6 is highly brand-agnostic when it comes to supported cameras and/or flashes. In particular shooters that own multiple camera systems should take note of this one system that may address all their needs. I furthermore applaud the fact that the V6 upvalues any previous investments into TTL flashes and preserves the investment in any V5, LV5 gear.

Last edited by max_pyne; 06-25-2015 at 07:47 AM.
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