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12-13-2018, 01:31 PM   #1
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Which protection filter?

Well, maybe similar thread was discussed million times but....

In search of some good protection filter I found this thread on dpreview:

Hoya vs B&W

They are comparing Hoya vs B&W. Nothing special but one of them posted something that forces me to rethink my strategy how to protect the front element of my most expensive lens. Here's article:

EF 24-70/2.8 II front element filter drama.

To be honest, I'm not a big fan of protection or UV filters. None of my current lenses have it. I'm of those people who think that the best option to protect your lens is the lens hood. But there's sometimes situation when having filter attached to your lens might let you feel more secure, like wind, salt water etc etc... Having some kind of extra protection in these kind of situations is not a bad idea, isn't it?

Anyway, my heart stops when I look at the front element in that article. How this can be? and how Hoya is involved in this? According to this list Hoya is the best by the way in terms of flare resistance.

12-13-2018, 01:36 PM - 1 Like   #2
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Try this article for more information. It's old but has many basic truths built in and frankly remains very informative:
UV filters test - Introduction - LensTip.com

They also have a newer on on CPL filters.
Polarizing filters test 2015 - Introduction - LensTip.com

BTW, after MUCH investigation and use, I find Marumi filters to be, generally speaking, the best combination of quality at a fair price.
12-13-2018, 01:37 PM - 2 Likes   #3
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I never use filters for protection. At best, they're pointless.
12-13-2018, 01:39 PM - 2 Likes   #4
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QuoteOriginally posted by selfnoise Quote
I never use filters for protection. At best, they're pointless.
Shoot much in the desert or on a beach? Hmmm........ All or nothing statements are usually pointless.

12-13-2018, 01:45 PM   #5
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QuoteOriginally posted by Docrwm Quote
BTW, after MUCH investigation and use, I find Marumi filters to be, generally speaking, the best combination of quality at a fair price.
Docrwm, yes, they look good, one moment I thought maybe I'll go for Marumi. little bit on expensive side.... but in that tests Marumi is far from best, somewhere 10th place if I'm not mistaken.
12-13-2018, 01:50 PM   #6
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QuoteOriginally posted by Docrwm Quote
Shoot much in the desert or on a beach? Hmmm........ All or nothing statements are usually pointless.
I shoot on the beach all the time. I'm not dunking the camera in the sand... Strangely I never end up with problems.

I've also taken my camera on weeklong trips in Arizona, zero issues.

If there's enough blowing sand to get in my camera lens, there's enough to get in my eyes. So my solution to taking my lens into a hazardous situation is...I don't take it into a hazardous situation.
12-13-2018, 01:54 PM   #7
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QuoteOriginally posted by selfnoise Quote
If there's enough blowing sand to get in my camera lens, there's enough to get in my eyes. So my solution to taking my lens into a hazardous situation is...I don't take it into a hazardous situation.
best solution ever!
12-13-2018, 01:59 PM   #8
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QuoteOriginally posted by Lev Quote
Docrwm, yes, they look good, one moment I thought maybe I'll go for Marumi. little bit on expensive side.... but in that tests Marumi is far from best, somewhere 10th place if I'm not mistaken.
If you're talking about the UV article I linked to they're 5th. But Hoya changed their process for mounting the glass a few years ago and while B&W rate higher they're often 2-4x as much for VERY minimal improvements IMHO.

---------- Post added 12-13-18 at 04:02 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by selfnoise Quote
I shoot on the beach all the time. I'm not dunking the camera in the sand... Strangely I never end up with problems.

I've also taken my camera on weeklong trips in Arizona, zero issues.

If there's enough blowing sand to get in my camera lens, there's enough to get in my eyes. So my solution to taking my lens into a hazardous situation is...I don't take it into a hazardous situation.
I've seen lenses that were "fine" after prolonged use at the beach without "blowing sand" that simply weren't ok. But, to each their own. I'll keep using high quality filters in such situations. Have a Great Day!

12-13-2018, 02:22 PM   #9
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thanks! good info about Hoya. But can you tell why you prefer Marumi over Hoya? All I know some people say Hoya filters are difficult to clean.
12-13-2018, 03:28 PM   #10
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QuoteOriginally posted by Lev Quote
thanks! good info about Hoya. But can you tell why you prefer Marumi over Hoya? All I know some people say Hoya filters are difficult to clean.
Solid construction. Same glass as B+W. Light transmission and distortion among the best. Cost-Benefit equation. Cleaning varies based on coatings but generally not a challenge IMHO.
12-13-2018, 05:19 PM   #11
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Since I use DSLRs I attach protection filters only occasionally.
But back in the1980s I bought original Asahi Pentax SMC coated filters for the standard sizes.

At least at that time, they were probably the best you could buy.
I have no idea whether Pentax still offers SMC (or HD) coated filters, or filters at all.
12-14-2018, 04:07 AM - 1 Like   #13
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QuoteOriginally posted by angerdan Quote
What do you want to protect your lens against?
If it's physical impact, hard glass would be the choice.
I always find it interesting how you can make almost anything look like "proof" in lab tests. Mechanical/physical impact in real life almost never takes the form of a perfect elastic collision at a 90-degree angle exactly centered at the middle of a glass surface by either a perfectly round sphere or a flat metal surface (and even less when the glass surface is supported from below with a ring about the same size as the metal ball). Let's also assume that such a situation happens 1 out of every 1000 impacts and that an impact on a front element sunken behind a protruding lenshood (because of course, we all use those 100% of the times) would only happen extremely rarely over the lifetime of a lens unless you are often using it under extreme circumstances, say 1 out of every 100000 uses of the lens.

You are more likely to win a couple of million in a lottery than have the front element of your lens nearly destroyed by "physical" impact only to have the filter save you in the nick of time.

Using a protection filter always is never a good idea. Using it sometimes to protect against sand or spray may or may not be a good idea (chances are if the sand or spray are serious enough, shooting through a piece of glass is not going to help you get a good image anyway). So simple logic would confirm that never using a protection filter may just be a very decent policy which may very rarely lead you to have to repair or replace a lens..
12-14-2018, 04:21 AM   #14
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thanks angerdan, I don't think that I will need this level of impact protection, rather just against scratches and etc. Thanks anyway!!
12-14-2018, 09:11 AM - 4 Likes   #15
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QuoteOriginally posted by newmikey Quote
Using a protection filter always is never a good idea. Using it sometimes to protect against sand or spray may or may not be a good idea (chances are if the sand or spray are serious enough, shooting through a piece of glass is not going to help you get a good image anyway). So simple logic would confirm that never using a protection filter may just be a very decent policy which may very rarely lead you to have to repair or replace a lens..
I keep a small stack of ruined UV and Skylight filters handy for when people ask whether it's a good idea to have a protection filter over their lens. Each one successfully saved the lens it was mounted to. Some have large cracks running from the edge where they were hit (thus saving the lens filter ring - many of which are polycarbonate these days). Others have bullseye hits right in the middle, with chipped or holes right through the glass.

Is it technically better to have no glass in front of your lens' front element? Absolutely.

But if you're on vacation somewhere, and you bounce your camera off the hotel room doorknob, it ruins your holiday a lot less if you can unscrew the chipped filter, and keep shooting.

It's a lot less fun trying to use some valuable vacation funds to buy a replacement lens in some resort town where they're either impossible to find - or three times the price of what you'd pay back home.
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