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03-30-2019, 02:29 AM - 2 Likes   #211
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QuoteOriginally posted by CharLac Quote
So with an 85 on an APS-C, how far away from the subject would you typically stand?
Maybe ten feet? If the focus point is too far away then you lose the blurred background. If it's too close then you may get distortion as you'll need a really wide sweep to get enough background for the effect.

And I rarely stand for a Brenizer, I almost always crouch. As my subjects are usually low it's a better perspective and allows a more stable shot, which is important to keep you focus from drifting forward or backwards.

03-30-2019, 04:24 AM   #212
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QuoteOriginally posted by edom31 Quote
I just discovered this thread (thanks to Charlie for referencing it elsewhere)...

Now, does the subject needs to be centered in order to qualify as using the method, or can it be off centered?

While I stiched (the computer did) the following shots (about 4-5 per image), I do not think they're wide enough to fit into the category... but this is my first try. I also need to find software to stitch in a table manner (rows/columns).

Anyways, here they are:


Hey Ed, glad you found this interesting. I think my next attempt will be with a 50 f/1.4 on my k-3
03-30-2019, 05:02 AM - 1 Like   #213
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QuoteOriginally posted by CharLac Quote
Hey Ed, glad you found this interesting. I think my next attempt will be with a 50 f/1.4 on my k-3
I'm on my way to the botanical garden... will try my luck with the A 100/4 macro - f4, but does bokeh well enough.
03-30-2019, 05:29 AM - 1 Like   #214
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QuoteOriginally posted by edom31 Quote
I'm on my way to the botanical garden... will try my luck with the A 100/4 macro - f4, but does bokeh well enough.
Good luck! I look forward to seeing your results

03-30-2019, 01:52 PM - 1 Like   #215
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QuoteOriginally posted by CharLac Quote
Good luck! I look forward to seeing your results
Thank you, Charlie...

Well, went to the botanical garden, they had an Orchid show... But went with my 2-year-old, so I was only able to attempt this Brenizer (with the K 55/1.8)

03-30-2019, 04:05 PM - 1 Like   #216
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Pouring rain outside so I just thought I would practice the overlapping motion

8 stitched
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03-31-2019, 02:51 PM - 5 Likes   #217
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FA77 / 13 shots

9 shots
03-31-2019, 11:34 PM - 1 Like   #218
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QuoteOriginally posted by irek83 Quote
FA77 / 13 shots

9 shots
Totally nailed these, and perfect example of how even shots under double digits can drive home the effect.



04-01-2019, 07:43 PM   #219
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Does anyone have success rates with handheld vs tripod or nodal point vs not or short vs normal vs tele?
I tried recently and it was awful. Distortion was bad but I got the effect so I did learn.
Do you expect 100% to work (If you make no mistakes) or do you expect some situations to work better than others and if so what should I look for?
04-01-2019, 11:33 PM   #220
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QuoteOriginally posted by swanlefitte Quote
Does anyone have success rates with handheld vs tripod or nodal point vs not or short vs normal vs tele? ....... Do you expect 100% to work (If you make no mistakes) or do you expect some situations to work better than others and if so what should I look for?
I'm no Brenizer guru so I'll just chip in on a couple of points. I'm quite comfortable workin hand held; landscape or portrait; getting a "proper" exposure setting first and then shooting in Manual; and fairly confident about achieving the effect using 50 to 200mm lenses with preference for 77 to 135mm range.
04-02-2019, 01:44 AM   #221
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QuoteOriginally posted by swanlefitte Quote
Does anyone have success rates with handheld vs tripod or nodal point vs not or short vs normal vs tele?
I tried recently and it was awful. Distortion was bad but I got the effect so I did learn.
Do you expect 100% to work (If you make no mistakes) or do you expect some situations to work better than others and if so what should I look for?
If you follow my advice outlined about it can help, or as Rod suggest doing it fully Manual (however the AE-L is there for a reason, this is one of those situations it can help).

Something else you might want to consider when approaching the stitching process. If you have a look at irek83's shot of his lad on the rocks, if you glance top left you can see what looks like vignetting in the middle of the sky between the two frames. This is because the FA77 wide open will naturally vignette quite heavily anyway, and indeed a lot of other lenses will also. Sometimes stitching software can deal with the vignetting between frames, sometimes it doesn't do so well, it's one of those occasions I find Photoshop can do a better job than say Microsoft's ICE.

It's worthwhile perhaps taking the images taken and applying 'lens Profile Correction' in Lightroom, you will see all the frames corrected for distortion and vignetting, then you can try the stitch with those files, it may fix some of these issues.

But really it's actually practice, as long as you follow the basic principles outlined (both in this thread or just google 'how to take a brenizer') you will see certain settings need to be adhered to and then it's just a case of choosing the right lens and practice the overlapping, overlapping more is always better than less, aim for a 1/3rd at least.

FA85, FA77 are great lenses for this kinda work, but it can be done with other lenses too, just don't use lenses that go too wide otherwise the effect is less pronounced. Even when I use a FA43 on the K-1 I'm pushing it a little.
04-02-2019, 05:58 AM   #222
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Handheld I have never had success at panorama shots unless the subject is at infinity. They take so long to process I really don't want to practice if I will only get 10% to work.
I find in general at infinity the arc of the camera is small, about 10 degrees but at close range it needs to sweep around 30 degrees.
Anyway I would like to know things like up to 15 degrees gets good results 70% but by 20 degrees it drops to 30% . Does a more out of focus background make it harder to stitch? Would my success go down as I open the lens up?
04-02-2019, 12:57 PM   #223
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QuoteOriginally posted by swanlefitte Quote
Handheld I have never had success at panorama shots unless the subject is at infinity. They take so long to process I really don't want to practice if I will only get 10% to work.
I find in general at infinity the arc of the camera is small, about 10 degrees but at close range it needs to sweep around 30 degrees.
Anyway I would like to know things like up to 15 degrees gets good results 70% but by 20 degrees it drops to 30% . Does a more out of focus background make it harder to stitch? Would my success go down as I open the lens up?
Honestly it sounds as if you're over thinking things. I guarantee all brenizer method shots are done handheld, it would just take too long with a tripod + the scenario given (wedding, bride and groom shot etc, no time for tripods etc), the practice and technique in deciding how to pan around for the shot is actually instrumental in how many of your attempts become keepers vs scrapyard. My earlier attempts were very scrappy too. Don't give up, yes some are very good at it off the bat, that doesn't mean you can't also master the technique.
Tripodding in general is something I typically do more for long exposure and pixelshift than panoramas these days. I dunno... it just feels as though computing and software power in stitching handheld shots has come a long way since the days of using the pan function of a tripod. I've stitched many landscape shot panorama from standing and just giving a good decent amount of overlap (focus to infinity as you say).
Brenizer is of course typically not focusing to infinity. It's a 'Bokeh Panorama', it's really not much different to normal landscape panoramas except that you want to ensure the focus is correct on the subject and add frames vertically as well as horizontally.

Here's a few things to consider;

1) Let us know your camera lens and system, we can advise if that might work or not. Essentially you can do it with a lot of lenses but some combos might be harder than others.

2) Let us know your camera settings, or follow Rods advice and use Manual, or create a User Mode with my suggested settings before, paying attention to such things as locking exposure, back button focusing and getting off Auto White Balance etc

3) I typically take the subject matter as my first shot, but you needn't have to. What you can't really do (or I don't advise) is to take the shot, chimp to see if it's in focus, see that it is, and then go back to getting the extra frames. You will simply have moved the camera too much from the first shot to 'putting it back' exactly where it was to really succeed with the rest of the frames and stitch. You do have to have a degree of trust that you nailed focus. I have done many a brenizer and thought "Cool!" went to review the first and most critical shot (of the person or subject) and realised it suffered a little in back focus or whatever and the focus wasn't really that sharp and therefore the shot is ruined, delete 20 odd shots and try again.

4) I have shot brenizers with Live View and things like Face Detection before, but it is a slower process, really using the OVF is best I think, you can fire off and pan the camera around more gently and subtler this way. Typically I only use Face Detection focus and Live View if doing a very small 4-5 Brenizer, otherwise OVF is better.

5) Try and pan the camera around gently, twist at your torso a little to help with the shots.

6) What I started off doing is just practice a single row. This meant I turned my camera into portrait mode and snapped perhaps 1 in the middle for focus, and then added frames on the side with plenty of overlap. This was 6-7 shots in portrait mode, one of my earlier first attempts, and we can see it's not perfect;



My composition is off, I really needed more grass below her feet, and if we inspect the grass to the left of her it was starting to do that weird thing where it creates sharp peaks. Essentially this is just overlapping issues and with more practice this kinda affect is less seen.

7) What software are you using for the stitch? As I mentioned earlier I can get quite very different results from using different programs. I like ICE but have had it complete screw up a straight edge like a railing or something where as Photoshop takes longer to process the shot but handles the task better (in my experience). It could be that you are being disheartened with your attempts and your technique is fine, you just need to find a capable program that can stitch your work together.
04-02-2019, 01:22 PM   #224
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QuoteOriginally posted by BruceBanner Quote
I guarantee all brenizer method shots are done handheld, it would just take too long with a tripod.
Wrong, I only do mine with a tripod with a geared tripod head on it. Very quick, very precise, better results.
04-02-2019, 01:25 PM   #225
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I appreciate the great response.
Let me say I use my ks2 on manual. Last time I used my nikkor 105 2.5. Tried the 77 before that. My sigma 70 gave me my best result but I don't like it's bokeh so it defeats the purpose. I use Photoshop cs6.
With basic panoramas I have found a lens with less distortion is better. My sigma 18-35 is better than my sigma 10-20 despite needing more frames.
It sounds like you have gotten good at limiting the camera movement, that's something I can work on. I am guessing the shot you posted has about an arc of 30 degrees between the 7 shots. Is that about the most or do you think you could get a good shot turning 360 degrees?
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