CS5 - Refine Edge

**lidy** · 09-12-2010, 04:28 PM - **1 Like**

I'm absolutely over the moon about some of the improved features in CS5. I had a go at the Refine Edge thing today, for which I used a picture of one of our dogs, taken some time ago. I've tried to separate him from the background many times and it's taken hours and hours of work and brought a lot of frustration. I was never quite satisfied with the results. There were always too many flaws: parts missing or parts that shouldn't be there. With this new CS5 feature it took me about 10 mins to get this result. #1 is the original picture, #2 is the cut-out version stuck onto a different background. Not yet perfect, I know - but that's mainly due to it being new to me and being unfamiliar with all the nuances and settings. A huge improvement nevertheless. I love this Refine Edge thingy!

Ole · 09-12-2010, 04:59 PM

That's impressive (and a nice dog at that)! When you get your technique down, please share! I find Refine Edge somewhat confusing and could use some hints!

JohnBee · 09-12-2010, 05:08 PM

Good job!
The hair looks intact.

**lidy** · 09-12-2010, 05:21 PM

Originally posted by Ole

That's impressive (and a nice dog at that)! When you get your technique down, please share! I find Refine Edge somewhat confusing and could use some hints!

Thx, Ole (on behalf of Lex (our dog) as well)! :-) What I usually do when I try something new, is, I look for info on the net, watch some video tuts, do as they say (which usually takes more time than doing the actual thing

), I compare the various methods, combine them, make a few notes and save 'em for future reference. I did that today as well, but it's all in Dutch, which probably won't be of much use to you.

I'll translate it tomorrow though and post it here and really, it's dead easy. You'll love using it!

**lidy** · 09-12-2010, 05:24 PM

Originally posted by JohnBee

Good job!
The hair looks intact.

Thanks, John!

**davidreilly3207** · 09-12-2010, 09:12 PM

Try blurring the new background for a more natural look, matching the f stop of the original.

Derridale · 09-12-2010, 11:36 PM

Very good result there - even the hairs near the dog's chest are intact. Very impressive indeed. And a nice-looking pooch it is too

The dog has been sharpened in the second picture, so having a sharper background doesn't really clash, but I agree that throwing the background just slightly out of focus would make it look even more convincing that the dog was actually there.

The only jarring note I can spot is that the dog is sunlit from our right, while the tower in the background is sunlit from our left.

Excellent job - must have a go at that!

slinco · 09-13-2010, 06:54 AM

Here's a few good video tutorials I've found:
http://av.adobe.com/russellbrown/CS5MaskBasics_SM.mov

http://av.adobe.com/russellbrown/CS5AdvancedMask_SM.mov

And for those adventurous souls who what to get deeper into compositing, here's a good one with lot's of great techniques:
The Complete Picture with Julieanne Kost - The Creative Composite | Adobe TV

**lidy** · 09-13-2010, 09:03 AM

Originally posted by mdave13

Try blurring the new background for a more natural look, matching the f stop of the original.

Thx, Dave. You mean like this?

**lidy** · 09-13-2010, 09:08 AM

Originally posted by Derridale

Very good result there - even the hairs near the dog's chest are intact. Very impressive indeed. And a nice-looking pooch it is too

The dog has been sharpened in the second picture, so having a sharper background doesn't really clash, but I agree that throwing the background just slightly out of focus would make it look even more convincing that the dog was actually there.

The only jarring note I can spot is that the dog is sunlit from our right, while the tower in the background is sunlit from our left.

Excellent job - must have a go at that!

Thanks, Pete. While adfding the frame, some sharpening was applied, you're right!

As to the sunlight - right again.

I must admit that I didn't pay much attention to the background picture at all. I was just so pleased with the results and the little time it took to achieve them that I didn't do any of the other stuff that I usually do, like softening some edges, adding a dropshadow etc.

**lidy** · 09-13-2010, 09:14 AM

Originally posted by Ole

That's impressive (and a nice dog at that)! When you get your technique down, please share! I find Refine Edge somewhat confusing and could use some hints!

Here you are, Ole, my mini guide to using the Refine Edge option.

(See picture below for settings.)

1. Use the Quick Selection Tool for a first selection.
2. Click on Select>Refine Edge (or click the Refine Edge button in the tool bar).
3. You can change the colour of the background under View Mode.
4, Click on Smart Radius and move the slider up to between 6-7 (or more, keep an eye on the preview and see what looks best).
5. Click on he Radius Tool and paint the areas that need adjusting
6. Click on Shift Edge and set to e.g. -4.
7. Click on Decontaminate colours and set it to sth like 70.
8. If wanted, set feather and smooth (you'll have to play with the settings - they vary per picture).
9. Under Output to click on New Document with Layer Mask and click OK.
10. A new document will open with your cut-out subject.
11. Rightclick the adjustment layer and click Convert to Smart Object.
12.That's it, you're done! If you feel that the edges are too sharp, you can try to soften 'em a bit by using the blur tool.

**davidreilly3207** · 09-13-2010, 04:30 PM

Much better, IMHO.

Ole · 09-13-2010, 07:03 PM

Originally posted by lidy

Here you are, Ole, my mini guide to using the Refine Edge option.

(See picture below for settings.)

1. Use the Quick Selection Tool for a first selection.
2. Click on Select>Refine Edge (or click the Refine Edge button in the tool bar).
3. You can change the colour of the background under View Mode.
4, Click on Smart Radius and move the slider up to between 6-7 (or more, keep an eye on the preview and see what looks best).
5. Click on he Radius Tool and paint the areas that need adjusting
6. Click on Shift Edge and set to e.g. -4.
7. Click on Decontaminate colours and set it to sth like 70.
8. If wanted, set feather and smooth (you'll have to play with the settings - they vary per picture).
9. Under Output to click on New Document with Layer Mask and click OK.
10. A new document will open with your cut-out subject.
11. Rightclick the adjustment layer and click Convert to Smart Object.
12.That's it, you're done! If you feel that the edges are too sharp, you can try to soften 'em a bit by using the blur tool.

Thanks, I appreciate it!

vandermark · 09-14-2010, 01:38 AM

Well done Lidy ;-)

KxBlaze · 09-15-2010, 03:37 PM

The level of detail you have is amazing. How did you get the almost individual hairs? I have a similar picture and if I try to use the quick selection tool on hairs that thin it will select everything that is near that hair.

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09-12-2010, 04:28 PM - 1 Like	#1
lidy Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2009 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 534	CS5 - Refine Edge I'm absolutely over the moon about some of the improved features in CS5. I had a go at the Refine Edge thing today, for which I used a picture of one of our dogs, taken some time ago. I've tried to separate him from the background many times and it's taken hours and hours of work and brought a lot of frustration. I was never quite satisfied with the results. There were always too many flaws: parts missing or parts that shouldn't be there. With this new CS5 feature it took me about 10 mins to get this result. #1 is the original picture, #2 is the cut-out version stuck onto a different background. Not yet perfect, I know - but that's mainly due to it being new to me and being unfamiliar with all the nuances and settings. A huge improvement nevertheless. I love this Refine Edge thingy!

09-12-2010, 04:59 PM	#2
Ole Administrator Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Copenhagen, Denmark Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 4,408	That's impressive (and a nice dog at that)! When you get your technique down, please share! I find Refine Edge somewhat confusing and could use some hints!

09-12-2010, 05:08 PM	#3
JohnBee Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Newrfoundland Photos: Albums Posts: 4,667	Good job! The hair looks intact.

09-12-2010, 05:21 PM	#4
lidy Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2009 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 534 Original Poster	Originally posted by Ole That's impressive (and a nice dog at that)! When you get your technique down, please share! I find Refine Edge somewhat confusing and could use some hints! Thx, Ole (on behalf of Lex (our dog) as well)! :-) What I usually do when I try something new, is, I look for info on the net, watch some video tuts, do as they say (which usually takes more time than doing the actual thing ), I compare the various methods, combine them, make a few notes and save 'em for future reference. I did that today as well, but it's all in Dutch, which probably won't be of much use to you. I'll translate it tomorrow though and post it here and really, it's dead easy. You'll love using it!

09-12-2010, 05:24 PM	#5
lidy Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2009 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 534 Original Poster	Originally posted by JohnBee Good job! The hair looks intact. Thanks, John!

09-12-2010, 09:12 PM	#6
davidreilly3207 Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: South Jersey Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 720	Try blurring the new background for a more natural look, matching the f stop of the original.

09-12-2010, 11:36 PM	#7
Derridale Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Brisbane, Australia Posts: 412	Very good result there - even the hairs near the dog's chest are intact. Very impressive indeed. And a nice-looking pooch it is too The dog has been sharpened in the second picture, so having a sharper background doesn't really clash, but I agree that throwing the background just slightly out of focus would make it look even more convincing that the dog was actually there. The only jarring note I can spot is that the dog is sunlit from our right, while the tower in the background is sunlit from our left. Excellent job - must have a go at that!

09-13-2010, 06:54 AM	#8
slinco Inactive Account Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Upstate New York Posts: 203	Here's a few good video tutorials I've found: http://av.adobe.com/russellbrown/CS5MaskBasics_SM.mov http://av.adobe.com/russellbrown/CS5AdvancedMask_SM.mov And for those adventurous souls who what to get deeper into compositing, here's a good one with lot's of great techniques: The Complete Picture with Julieanne Kost - The Creative Composite \| Adobe TV

09-13-2010, 09:03 AM	#9
lidy Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2009 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 534 Original Poster	Originally posted by mdave13 Try blurring the new background for a more natural look, matching the f stop of the original. Thx, Dave. You mean like this?

09-13-2010, 09:08 AM	#10
lidy Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2009 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 534 Original Poster	Originally posted by Derridale Very good result there - even the hairs near the dog's chest are intact. Very impressive indeed. And a nice-looking pooch it is too The dog has been sharpened in the second picture, so having a sharper background doesn't really clash, but I agree that throwing the background just slightly out of focus would make it look even more convincing that the dog was actually there. The only jarring note I can spot is that the dog is sunlit from our right, while the tower in the background is sunlit from our left. Excellent job - must have a go at that! Thanks, Pete. While adfding the frame, some sharpening was applied, you're right! As to the sunlight - right again. I must admit that I didn't pay much attention to the background picture at all. I was just so pleased with the results and the little time it took to achieve them that I didn't do any of the other stuff that I usually do, like softening some edges, adding a dropshadow etc.

09-13-2010, 09:14 AM	#11
lidy Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2009 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 534 Original Poster	Originally posted by Ole That's impressive (and a nice dog at that)! When you get your technique down, please share! I find Refine Edge somewhat confusing and could use some hints! Here you are, Ole, my mini guide to using the Refine Edge option. (See picture below for settings.) 1. Use the Quick Selection Tool for a first selection. 2. Click on Select>Refine Edge (or click the Refine Edge button in the tool bar). 3. You can change the colour of the background under View Mode. 4, Click on Smart Radius and move the slider up to between 6-7 (or more, keep an eye on the preview and see what looks best). 5. Click on he Radius Tool and paint the areas that need adjusting 6. Click on Shift Edge and set to e.g. -4. 7. Click on Decontaminate colours and set it to sth like 70. 8. If wanted, set feather and smooth (you'll have to play with the settings - they vary per picture). 9. Under Output to click on New Document with Layer Mask and click OK. 10. A new document will open with your cut-out subject. 11. Rightclick the adjustment layer and click Convert to Smart Object. 12.That's it, you're done! If you feel that the edges are too sharp, you can try to soften 'em a bit by using the blur tool.

09-13-2010, 04:30 PM	#12
davidreilly3207 Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: South Jersey Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 720	Much better, IMHO.

09-13-2010, 07:03 PM	#13
Ole Administrator Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Copenhagen, Denmark Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 4,408	Originally posted by lidy Here you are, Ole, my mini guide to using the Refine Edge option. (See picture below for settings.) 1. Use the Quick Selection Tool for a first selection. 2. Click on Select>Refine Edge (or click the Refine Edge button in the tool bar). 3. You can change the colour of the background under View Mode. 4, Click on Smart Radius and move the slider up to between 6-7 (or more, keep an eye on the preview and see what looks best). 5. Click on he Radius Tool and paint the areas that need adjusting 6. Click on Shift Edge and set to e.g. -4. 7. Click on Decontaminate colours and set it to sth like 70. 8. If wanted, set feather and smooth (you'll have to play with the settings - they vary per picture). 9. Under Output to click on New Document with Layer Mask and click OK. 10. A new document will open with your cut-out subject. 11. Rightclick the adjustment layer and click Convert to Smart Object. 12.That's it, you're done! If you feel that the edges are too sharp, you can try to soften 'em a bit by using the blur tool. Thanks, I appreciate it!

09-14-2010, 01:38 AM	#14
vandermark New Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Wageningen, The Netherlands Photos: Gallery Posts: 15	Well done Lidy ;-)

09-15-2010, 03:37 PM	#15
KxBlaze Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: California Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,602	The level of detail you have is amazing. How did you get the almost individual hairs? I have a similar picture and if I try to use the quick selection tool on hairs that thin it will select everything that is near that hair.