Device for both monitor and TV color calibration

**klh** · 11-18-2010, 08:16 AM

I would like to find a colorimeter that can help me calibrate both my Sony LCD HDTVs as well as my LCD computer monitors. It seems like most devices (i1D2, Spyder) do one or the other. Any suggestions?

markdesmarais · 11-18-2010, 09:52 AM

You can get software that will support TV calibration with a monitor sensor (actually the sensors are all the same). It is kind of geeky-high-end though-
homecinema-fr: Colorimètre HCFR
There is a thread (for that matter a whole forum) on TV calibration here-
ColorHCFR v2.0 Available... - AVS Forum
If you look around, people are not that excited about the accuracy of the Spyder sensor.

**Miguel** · 11-18-2010, 02:16 PM

I was in the same boat years ago. Tried to adapt my Spyder 2 (which is as accurate as anything--it's the software that matters--Coloreyes is the best) and it was too much hassle.

I did find a series of calibration images that worked quite well. So google for that. One scene has a man wearing dark pants with white pinstripes. I then adjusted the TV settings to enable the pinstripes to be visible without artifacts. Skin tones are pretty easy to render accurately enough for a TV.

M

**klh** · 11-21-2010, 07:36 PM

Originally posted by markdesmarais

You can get software that will support TV calibration with a monitor sensor (actually the sensors are all the same). It is kind of geeky-high-end though-
homecinema-fr: Colorimètre HCFR
There is a thread (for that matter a whole forum) on TV calibration here-
ColorHCFR v2.0 Available... - AVS Forum
If you look around, people are not that excited about the accuracy of the Spyder sensor.

Thanks for that. I've been reading those sites, but I have to admit that a lot of it is beyond me. I've used the DVD and AVS709 disks to make adjustments, and that was a huge improvement. But I still notice on one of my LCD TVs the colors just don't quite look right (lips appear more bluish, orange is too red). That's why I'd like to have a colorimeter to do it myself.

**klh** · 11-21-2010, 07:37 PM

Originally posted by Miguel

I was in the same boat years ago. Tried to adapt my Spyder 2 (which is as accurate as anything--it's the software that matters--Coloreyes is the best) and it was too much hassle.

I did find a series of calibration images that worked quite well. So google for that. One scene has a man wearing dark pants with white pinstripes. I then adjusted the TV settings to enable the pinstripes to be visible without artifacts. Skin tones are pretty easy to render accurately enough for a TV.

M

I've got the calibration images, and the white and black points are set properly. I'm really just having trouble with the color calibration.

markdesmarais · 11-22-2010, 10:33 AM

Getting a flat response curve is much more challenging than setting black and white points. I made sure to buy a TV that had the controls accessible, but haven't followed through with a meter yet.
As I understand, the problem with the Spyder series is that they are not calibrated at the factory, so while some of them are OK, others are not, and you have no way of knowing which variety you have. The top of the line spyders are calibrated, but they are much more expensive.

eddie1960 · 11-22-2010, 01:40 PM

the real issue is you need to be able to get to the service menus to do a proper tv calibration and manufacturers understandable don't want you accessing them (i spent 25 years in that industry) I'm pretty capable, and have accessed the service menus on many tvs but i actually paid someone i trusted to do a proper calibration on my tv so it reflected the broadcast standards (i didn't have the equipment to measure so I'd be eyeballing it)
and because i'm lazy i took my CPU/monitor/printer to a pro shop for calibration (it cost me less than buying the better software and sensor would and I didn't have to spend the time doing it)

**klh** · 11-24-2010, 09:56 AM

Both of my TVs are Sony Bravia models. There are websites on how to get to the service menu to do a full calibration, but I'm not really wanting to try that on my own.

The standard user menu gives Gain and Bias settings for Red, Green, and Blue. I do understand enough control theory to use these settings if I can only measure the output of the RGB inputs. That's why I'm looking for a simple colorimeter.

I realize that won't give me a professional calibration, but it should give better results than I've got at the moment. Now if that colorimeter could also be used to calibrate my PC monitor for photo work, I'm real happy.

reeftool · 11-25-2010, 09:01 PM

Originally posted by eddie1960

the real issue is you need to be able to get to the service menus to do a proper tv calibration and manufacturers understandable don't want you accessing them (i spent 25 years in that industry) I'm pretty capable, and have accessed the service menus on many tvs but i actually paid someone i trusted to do a proper calibration on my tv so it reflected the broadcast standards (i didn't have the equipment to measure so I'd be eyeballing it)
and because i'm lazy i took my CPU/monitor/printer to a pro shop for calibration (it cost me less than buying the better software and sensor would and I didn't have to spend the time doing it)

Taking it to somebody might not be a bad idea as it's not something you should have to do once it's been done. I've heard mixed things about the Spyder. It seems to work on some monitors but not others. I do understand the value of a calibrated monitor as I have 3 in the house and you can notice the difference. I have also noticed differences in color and brightness with different video cards which I'm not sure the monitor software can do anything about.

Beau · 11-28-2010, 08:33 AM

I can recommend the HCFR tool with an X-rite Display2 colorimeter. It's not that hard. I used it to calibrate my Samsung TV which has a full CMS (color management system). There's no need to go into the service menu.

If you use a pc as an input device, you can create a color profile as you would for a normal pc monitor. I did this to correct the small remaining calibration errors. I can highly recommend DispCalGUI over the software which comes supplied with the colorimeters.

markdesmarais · 11-28-2010, 01:39 PM

Originally posted by Beau

I can recommend the HCFR tool with an X-rite Display2 colorimeter. It's not that hard. I used it to calibrate my Samsung TV which has a full CMS (color management system). There's no need to go into the service menu.

If you use a pc as an input device, you can create a color profile as you would for a normal pc monitor. I did this to correct the small remaining calibration errors. I can highly recommend DispCalGUI over the software which comes supplied with the colorimeters.

Nice- hadn't run across DispCalGUI- that looks like a good one!

My LG also has the color management stuff available at the user level- its becoming more common on the higher end units.

11-18-2010, 08:16 AM	#1
klh Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: May 2009 Location: West Lafayette, Indiana, USA Posts: 827	Device for both monitor and TV color calibration I would like to find a colorimeter that can help me calibrate both my Sony LCD HDTVs as well as my LCD computer monitors. It seems like most devices (i1D2, Spyder) do one or the other. Any suggestions?

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11-18-2010, 09:52 AM	#2
markdesmarais Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Massachusetts Photos: Gallery Posts: 186	You can get software that will support TV calibration with a monitor sensor (actually the sensors are all the same). It is kind of geeky-high-end though- homecinema-fr: Colorimètre HCFR There is a thread (for that matter a whole forum) on TV calibration here- ColorHCFR v2.0 Available... - AVS Forum If you look around, people are not that excited about the accuracy of the Spyder sensor.

11-18-2010, 02:16 PM	#3
Miguel Site Supporter Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Near Seattle Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,743	I was in the same boat years ago. Tried to adapt my Spyder 2 (which is as accurate as anything--it's the software that matters--Coloreyes is the best) and it was too much hassle. I did find a series of calibration images that worked quite well. So google for that. One scene has a man wearing dark pants with white pinstripes. I then adjusted the TV settings to enable the pinstripes to be visible without artifacts. Skin tones are pretty easy to render accurately enough for a TV. M

11-21-2010, 07:36 PM	#4
klh Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: May 2009 Location: West Lafayette, Indiana, USA Posts: 827 Original Poster	Originally posted by markdesmarais You can get software that will support TV calibration with a monitor sensor (actually the sensors are all the same). It is kind of geeky-high-end though- homecinema-fr: Colorimètre HCFR There is a thread (for that matter a whole forum) on TV calibration here- ColorHCFR v2.0 Available... - AVS Forum If you look around, people are not that excited about the accuracy of the Spyder sensor. Thanks for that. I've been reading those sites, but I have to admit that a lot of it is beyond me. I've used the DVD and AVS709 disks to make adjustments, and that was a huge improvement. But I still notice on one of my LCD TVs the colors just don't quite look right (lips appear more bluish, orange is too red). That's why I'd like to have a colorimeter to do it myself.

11-21-2010, 07:37 PM	#5
klh Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: May 2009 Location: West Lafayette, Indiana, USA Posts: 827 Original Poster	Originally posted by Miguel I was in the same boat years ago. Tried to adapt my Spyder 2 (which is as accurate as anything--it's the software that matters--Coloreyes is the best) and it was too much hassle. I did find a series of calibration images that worked quite well. So google for that. One scene has a man wearing dark pants with white pinstripes. I then adjusted the TV settings to enable the pinstripes to be visible without artifacts. Skin tones are pretty easy to render accurately enough for a TV. M I've got the calibration images, and the white and black points are set properly. I'm really just having trouble with the color calibration.

11-22-2010, 10:33 AM	#6
markdesmarais Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Massachusetts Photos: Gallery Posts: 186	Getting a flat response curve is much more challenging than setting black and white points. I made sure to buy a TV that had the controls accessible, but haven't followed through with a meter yet. As I understand, the problem with the Spyder series is that they are not calibrated at the factory, so while some of them are OK, others are not, and you have no way of knowing which variety you have. The top of the line spyders are calibrated, but they are much more expensive.

11-22-2010, 01:40 PM	#7
eddie1960 Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Toronto Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 13,666	the real issue is you need to be able to get to the service menus to do a proper tv calibration and manufacturers understandable don't want you accessing them (i spent 25 years in that industry) I'm pretty capable, and have accessed the service menus on many tvs but i actually paid someone i trusted to do a proper calibration on my tv so it reflected the broadcast standards (i didn't have the equipment to measure so I'd be eyeballing it) and because i'm lazy i took my CPU/monitor/printer to a pro shop for calibration (it cost me less than buying the better software and sensor would and I didn't have to spend the time doing it)

11-24-2010, 09:56 AM	#8
klh Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: May 2009 Location: West Lafayette, Indiana, USA Posts: 827 Original Poster	Both of my TVs are Sony Bravia models. There are websites on how to get to the service menu to do a full calibration, but I'm not really wanting to try that on my own. The standard user menu gives Gain and Bias settings for Red, Green, and Blue. I do understand enough control theory to use these settings if I can only measure the output of the RGB inputs. That's why I'm looking for a simple colorimeter. I realize that won't give me a professional calibration, but it should give better results than I've got at the moment. Now if that colorimeter could also be used to calibrate my PC monitor for photo work, I'm real happy.

11-25-2010, 09:01 PM	#9
reeftool Pentaxian Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Upstate New York Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 9,553	Originally posted by eddie1960 the real issue is you need to be able to get to the service menus to do a proper tv calibration and manufacturers understandable don't want you accessing them (i spent 25 years in that industry) I'm pretty capable, and have accessed the service menus on many tvs but i actually paid someone i trusted to do a proper calibration on my tv so it reflected the broadcast standards (i didn't have the equipment to measure so I'd be eyeballing it) and because i'm lazy i took my CPU/monitor/printer to a pro shop for calibration (it cost me less than buying the better software and sensor would and I didn't have to spend the time doing it) Taking it to somebody might not be a bad idea as it's not something you should have to do once it's been done. I've heard mixed things about the Spyder. It seems to work on some monitors but not others. I do understand the value of a calibrated monitor as I have 3 in the house and you can notice the difference. I have also noticed differences in color and brightness with different video cards which I'm not sure the monitor software can do anything about.

11-28-2010, 08:33 AM	#10
Beau Junior Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Leuven, Belgium Posts: 37	I can recommend the HCFR tool with an X-rite Display2 colorimeter. It's not that hard. I used it to calibrate my Samsung TV which has a full CMS (color management system). There's no need to go into the service menu. If you use a pc as an input device, you can create a color profile as you would for a normal pc monitor. I did this to correct the small remaining calibration errors. I can highly recommend DispCalGUI over the software which comes supplied with the colorimeters.

11-28-2010, 01:39 PM	#11
markdesmarais Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Massachusetts Photos: Gallery Posts: 186	Originally posted by Beau I can recommend the HCFR tool with an X-rite Display2 colorimeter. It's not that hard. I used it to calibrate my Samsung TV which has a full CMS (color management system). There's no need to go into the service menu. If you use a pc as an input device, you can create a color profile as you would for a normal pc monitor. I did this to correct the small remaining calibration errors. I can highly recommend DispCalGUI over the software which comes supplied with the colorimeters. Nice- hadn't run across DispCalGUI- that looks like a good one! My LG also has the color management stuff available at the user level- its becoming more common on the higher end units.