PS Elements 12 or Lightroom 5, or ?

calicojack · 01-18-2014, 09:48 AM

As the end of windows XP support draws near, I find myself looking for a new Windows 8 (or 8.1) computer. Along with this upgrade, I'm thinking about upgrading from my present PS Elements 8 to the current PSE 12 or Lightroom 5. Photographically, I just bought a new K5ii to replace my trusty K10D so I also have a brand new version of Pentax Photo Utility to install on my new computer. I do most of my photography direct to jpeg in camera unless I forsee the need to adjust color balance. I enjoy taking photos more than playing with them in the computer and strive for the best captures I can get (old school Film and Darkroom mentality). I generally don't play with Layers, although I have on rare occasions.
I'm looking for advice from the more experienced crowd. Should I convert to Lightroom 5 for it's raw processing power and take better advantage of my camera's capabilities? (I assume Lightroom can also open and process JPEG's). Stay with PSE 12 (upgraded from my current 8) for it's ease of use of the organizer with it's limited raw capabilities. (always have the Pentax Utility if needed). Or what other possibilities? I'm an advanced amatuer photographically but more of a novice with post processing. I have no real dillusions of becoming a "Pro" photographer, but I do get asked to photograph several events (Bigish Sweet 16 Party next month and similar requests). Comments, Suggestions all welcomed.

**Kerrowdown** · 01-18-2014, 09:51 AM

I'm a tad bias, but all I will say is that between Lightroom and the use of Photoshop CC for the really heavy stuff, all my needs are met.

**Canada_Rockies** · 01-18-2014, 10:16 AM

I use Lightroom. If you need layers in your post processing take both, otherwise LR will do all the work for you. v5 in particular has quite good editing. You could use GIMP instead of Elements if you only need "heavy lifting" as Kerrowdown mentions. It's free.

calicojack · 01-18-2014, 10:56 AM

Thanks guys. I appreciate the quick input.
Just a clarification question ot two...... Lightroom does import and work on jpegs's as well as raw formats, correct? What is your opinion of the photo organizer in Lightroom as opposed to the Elements organizer.

**Just1MoreDave** · 01-18-2014, 11:13 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by calicojack

...What is your opinion of the photo organizer in Lightroom as opposed to the Elements organizer.

Lightroom actually works and is useful.

**jatrax** · 01-18-2014, 11:34 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by calicojack

Lightroom does import and work on jpegs's as well as raw formats, correct? What is your opinion of the photo organizer in Lightroom as opposed to the Elements organizer.

Yes it works with jpegs, DNG, PEF, TIFF and likely some others I don't use.

Lightroom IS an organizer. Lightroom is a photo organizer with processing abilities added on. PhotoShop Elements is an image processor with some rudimentary organizing functions added on. As noted above if you regularly use layers then you will also need a pixel editor like Elements or GIMP or one of the many plugins available, but for 95% of all other work Lightroom is all you need.

Don't expect to just sit down and be comfortable with it though, especially if you have a lot of experience with Photoshop. The workflow is much different. Start slow, learn each section and don't get frustrated. LR is a big program with an amazing range of features.

A few things to keep firmly in mind:
1) The key to LR is presets and templates. Figure out how you want to do something and then create a preset or template for that.
2) LR is an image organizer, your workflow must be centered on it 100%. If you are used to just jumping into Elements for a quick edit and then saving the file and using it somehow, this will change. When you need an image you go to LR and export it in whatever format, and size you need.
3) Your images are not "in" Lightroom. You need an organized file structure on the hard disk where the actual files are located. LR can move the images from your card to that spot for you, but the files are always separate. Having the files in one organized place makes moving to a new computer or just regular backups much easier.

SpecialK · 01-18-2014, 11:51 AM - **1 Like**

Quote:

Lightroom actually works and is useful.

Elements organizer works, too, though perhaps with less features. I hate tagging images, but I've done it (until about 6 months ago...gotta get back to it) and it covers the basics. No doubt much depends on your requirements and the way you organize.

Here are some related software threads from earlier.

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/32-digital-processing-software-printing/2...5-buy-not.html

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/32-digital-processing-software-printing/2...lightroom.html

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/32-digital-processing-software-printing/2...catalogue.html

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/32-digital-processing-software-printing/2...are-if-so.html

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/32-digital-processing-software-printing/2...-software.html

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/32-digital-processing-software-printing/2...troom-5-a.html

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/32-digital-processing-software-printing/2...-software.html

**RGlasel** · 01-18-2014, 11:52 AM

Originally posted by jatrax

LR is an image organizer, your workflow must be centered on it 100%

jatrax pretty much nailed it with all of his points above. You can use Lightroom's developing tools for removing red eye, dust, gradient adjustments of exposure, sharpness, etc., and move back and forth between hundreds of images much, much easier than using PSE. If I need to remove someone's ex from a picture or use the head from a different picture to replace one that has a tongue sticking out, then I'll sit down for an hour or two with photo editing software to work just on that file. If you don't want to use Lightroom, then look for a different program that is geared for organizing photos, not editing them. You will be much more productive.

NicoleC · 01-18-2014, 11:57 AM

You can download a 30 day trial of Lightroom. That might be the best best for you to be sure LR does everything you need.

**eonb** · 01-18-2014, 02:04 PM

95%+ of the work that I do is with Lightroom. If you just want to "correct" photographs then Lightroom is it. If you want to do lots of "clever" image manipulation, then Photoshop is for you.

reeftool · 01-18-2014, 03:29 PM

I use Lightroom for everything, even my phone camera shots. It does most everything I need. Up until recently, I was using Lightroom 4 and Elements 11 for the stuff Lightroom couldn't do, along with a few plug ins. I recently took advantage of Adobe's $9.99 Lightroom 5/CC deal which was an unbeatable offer IMO. I may do something else next year if the price jumps up too much. How much I use Photoshop CC will determine my choice next year. Judging by release schedules, next year we will probably be very close to an LR 6.

calicojack · 01-19-2014, 07:16 AM

Thanks all. It certainly seems like the general concensus is to go with Lightroom as the primary program and to back it up with Photoshop or similar if I want to do the type of editting that I don't enjoy doing.
I appreciate everyone's input, but especially "jatrax" with his comment.....

Originally posted by jatrax

Lightroom IS an organizer. Lightroom is a photo organizer with processing abilities added on. PhotoShop Elements is an image processor with some rudimentary organizing functions added on. As noted above if you regularly use layers then you will also need a pixel editor like Elements or GIMP or one of the many plugins available, but for 95% of all other work Lightroom is all you need.

calicojack · 01-20-2014, 05:56 AM

OK, I've made my choice and ordered Lightroom 5 and "The Adobe Photoshop Lightroom 5 Book for Digital Photographers (Voices That Matter)" book by Scott Kelby as my training tool. I still have my PS Elements and Premiere Elements 8 disks so I'll probably install them also (even though I really don't do videos.)
Thanks to all who gave some input,
Brian T

**Canada_Rockies** · 01-20-2014, 09:19 AM

Brian, Kelby's books are well done, but the "humour" is way overdone. Don't let it throw you off. The lessons themselves are well written and easily assimilated. I'm sure you will be happy with Lightroom.

calicojack · 01-20-2014, 11:07 AM

Originally posted by Canada_Rockies

Brian, Kelby's books are well done, but the "humour" is way overdone. Don't let it throw you off. The lessons themselves are well written and easily assimilated. I'm sure you will be happy with Lightroom.

Albert,
I'm familiar with a few of Kelby's books and his writting / joking style. I've used his book on PSE 5 (I think it was 5 anyway) to help me learn my way around Elements and I actually really like his 2 or 3 book set on Digital Photography (no new info for me but interesting approach to teaching). Thanks for your help and comments here and in other places in this forum.
Regards,
Brian

01-18-2014, 09:48 AM	#1
calicojack Inactive Account Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Long Island, N.Y. Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,124	PS Elements 12 or Lightroom 5, or ? As the end of windows XP support draws near, I find myself looking for a new Windows 8 (or 8.1) computer. Along with this upgrade, I'm thinking about upgrading from my present PS Elements 8 to the current PSE 12 or Lightroom 5. Photographically, I just bought a new K5ii to replace my trusty K10D so I also have a brand new version of Pentax Photo Utility to install on my new computer. I do most of my photography direct to jpeg in camera unless I forsee the need to adjust color balance. I enjoy taking photos more than playing with them in the computer and strive for the best captures I can get (old school Film and Darkroom mentality). I generally don't play with Layers, although I have on rare occasions. I'm looking for advice from the more experienced crowd. Should I convert to Lightroom 5 for it's raw processing power and take better advantage of my camera's capabilities? (I assume Lightroom can also open and process JPEG's). Stay with PSE 12 (upgraded from my current 8) for it's ease of use of the organizer with it's limited raw capabilities. (always have the Pentax Utility if needed). Or what other possibilities? I'm an advanced amatuer photographically but more of a novice with post processing. I have no real dillusions of becoming a "Pro" photographer, but I do get asked to photograph several events (Bigish Sweet 16 Party next month and similar requests). Comments, Suggestions all welcomed.

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01-18-2014, 09:51 AM	#2
Kerrowdown PEG Moderator Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Highlands of Scotland... "Hold Infinity in the palm of your hand" - William Blake Photos: Gallery Posts: 57,816	I'm a tad bias, but all I will say is that between Lightroom and the use of Photoshop CC for the really heavy stuff, all my needs are met.

01-18-2014, 10:16 AM	#3
Canada_Rockies Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Sparwood, BC, Canada Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 12,385	I use Lightroom. If you need layers in your post processing take both, otherwise LR will do all the work for you. v5 in particular has quite good editing. You could use GIMP instead of Elements if you only need "heavy lifting" as Kerrowdown mentions. It's free.

01-18-2014, 10:56 AM	#4
calicojack Inactive Account Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Long Island, N.Y. Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,124 Original Poster	Thanks guys. I appreciate the quick input. Just a clarification question ot two...... Lightroom does import and work on jpegs's as well as raw formats, correct? What is your opinion of the photo organizer in Lightroom as opposed to the Elements organizer.

01-18-2014, 11:13 AM - 1 Like	#5
Just1MoreDave Site Supporter Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Aurora, CO Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 6,340	Originally posted by calicojack ...What is your opinion of the photo organizer in Lightroom as opposed to the Elements organizer. Lightroom actually works and is useful.

01-18-2014, 11:34 AM - 1 Like	#6
jatrax Site Supporter Join Date: May 2010 Location: Washington Cascades Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 12,991	Originally posted by calicojack Lightroom does import and work on jpegs's as well as raw formats, correct? What is your opinion of the photo organizer in Lightroom as opposed to the Elements organizer. Yes it works with jpegs, DNG, PEF, TIFF and likely some others I don't use. Lightroom IS an organizer. Lightroom is a photo organizer with processing abilities added on. PhotoShop Elements is an image processor with some rudimentary organizing functions added on. As noted above if you regularly use layers then you will also need a pixel editor like Elements or GIMP or one of the many plugins available, but for 95% of all other work Lightroom is all you need. Don't expect to just sit down and be comfortable with it though, especially if you have a lot of experience with Photoshop. The workflow is much different. Start slow, learn each section and don't get frustrated. LR is a big program with an amazing range of features. A few things to keep firmly in mind: 1) The key to LR is presets and templates. Figure out how you want to do something and then create a preset or template for that. 2) LR is an image organizer, your workflow must be centered on it 100%. If you are used to just jumping into Elements for a quick edit and then saving the file and using it somehow, this will change. When you need an image you go to LR and export it in whatever format, and size you need. 3) Your images are not "in" Lightroom. You need an organized file structure on the hard disk where the actual files are located. LR can move the images from your card to that spot for you, but the files are always separate. Having the files in one organized place makes moving to a new computer or just regular backups much easier.

01-18-2014, 11:51 AM - 1 Like	#7
SpecialK Pentaxian Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: So California Photos: Gallery Posts: 16,480	Quote: Lightroom actually works and is useful. Elements organizer works, too, though perhaps with less features. I hate tagging images, but I've done it (until about 6 months ago...gotta get back to it) and it covers the basics. No doubt much depends on your requirements and the way you organize. Here are some related software threads from earlier. https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/32-digital-processing-software-printing/2...5-buy-not.html https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/32-digital-processing-software-printing/2...lightroom.html https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/32-digital-processing-software-printing/2...catalogue.html https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/32-digital-processing-software-printing/2...are-if-so.html https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/32-digital-processing-software-printing/2...-software.html https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/32-digital-processing-software-printing/2...troom-5-a.html https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/32-digital-processing-software-printing/2...-software.html

01-18-2014, 11:52 AM	#8
RGlasel Site Supporter Join Date: Sep 2013 Location: Saskatoon Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 3,228	Originally posted by jatrax LR is an image organizer, your workflow must be centered on it 100% jatrax pretty much nailed it with all of his points above. You can use Lightroom's developing tools for removing red eye, dust, gradient adjustments of exposure, sharpness, etc., and move back and forth between hundreds of images much, much easier than using PSE. If I need to remove someone's ex from a picture or use the head from a different picture to replace one that has a tongue sticking out, then I'll sit down for an hour or two with photo editing software to work just on that file. If you don't want to use Lightroom, then look for a different program that is geared for organizing photos, not editing them. You will be much more productive.

01-18-2014, 11:57 AM	#9
NicoleC Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2013 Location: Madison, AL Posts: 448	You can download a 30 day trial of Lightroom. That might be the best best for you to be sure LR does everything you need.

01-18-2014, 02:04 PM	#10
eonb Site Supporter Join Date: Oct 2012 Location: North-East England Posts: 73	95%+ of the work that I do is with Lightroom. If you just want to "correct" photographs then Lightroom is it. If you want to do lots of "clever" image manipulation, then Photoshop is for you.

01-18-2014, 03:29 PM	#11
reeftool Pentaxian Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Upstate New York Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 9,553	I use Lightroom for everything, even my phone camera shots. It does most everything I need. Up until recently, I was using Lightroom 4 and Elements 11 for the stuff Lightroom couldn't do, along with a few plug ins. I recently took advantage of Adobe's $9.99 Lightroom 5/CC deal which was an unbeatable offer IMO. I may do something else next year if the price jumps up too much. How much I use Photoshop CC will determine my choice next year. Judging by release schedules, next year we will probably be very close to an LR 6.

01-19-2014, 07:16 AM	#12
calicojack Inactive Account Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Long Island, N.Y. Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,124 Original Poster	Thanks all. It certainly seems like the general concensus is to go with Lightroom as the primary program and to back it up with Photoshop or similar if I want to do the type of editting that I don't enjoy doing. I appreciate everyone's input, but especially "jatrax" with his comment..... Originally posted by jatrax Lightroom IS an organizer. Lightroom is a photo organizer with processing abilities added on. PhotoShop Elements is an image processor with some rudimentary organizing functions added on. As noted above if you regularly use layers then you will also need a pixel editor like Elements or GIMP or one of the many plugins available, but for 95% of all other work Lightroom is all you need.

01-20-2014, 05:56 AM	#13
calicojack Inactive Account Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Long Island, N.Y. Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,124 Original Poster	OK, I've made my choice and ordered Lightroom 5 and "The Adobe Photoshop Lightroom 5 Book for Digital Photographers (Voices That Matter)" book by Scott Kelby as my training tool. I still have my PS Elements and Premiere Elements 8 disks so I'll probably install them also (even though I really don't do videos.) Thanks to all who gave some input, Brian T

01-20-2014, 09:19 AM	#14
Canada_Rockies Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Sparwood, BC, Canada Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 12,385	Brian, Kelby's books are well done, but the "humour" is way overdone. Don't let it throw you off. The lessons themselves are well written and easily assimilated. I'm sure you will be happy with Lightroom.

01-20-2014, 11:07 AM	#15
calicojack Inactive Account Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Long Island, N.Y. Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,124 Original Poster	Originally posted by Canada_Rockies Brian, Kelby's books are well done, but the "humour" is way overdone. Don't let it throw you off. The lessons themselves are well written and easily assimilated. I'm sure you will be happy with Lightroom. Albert, I'm familiar with a few of Kelby's books and his writting / joking style. I've used his book on PSE 5 (I think it was 5 anyway) to help me learn my way around Elements and I actually really like his 2 or 3 book set on Digital Photography (no new info for me but interesting approach to teaching). Thanks for your help and comments here and in other places in this forum. Regards, Brian