I hate Adobe (rant)

stevebrot · 02-22-2017, 11:20 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by lithedreamer

If Lightroom's limited editing capabilities are enough for your project (they usually are for mine, as I have said). When they're not, I still want something non-destructive.

Originally posted by Racer X 69

Photoshop CS5.

Non-destructive raster edits...now there is a concept

I know, I know...Photoshop has several functions when working with PSD files that are essentially non-destructive and when linked though Lightroom's "edit in" feature provides fairly tight "downstream" coupling between the two tools.

BTW, the "edit in" feature is very much worth learning in detail and allows for a high degree of flexibility when working with external editors and can approximate non-destructive edits, at least within session on the external editor.

Steve

mee · 02-22-2017, 04:28 PM

Affinity Photo can work non-destructively. That is what the 'live filter layers' do.

maddog22 · 03-09-2017, 10:44 AM

I have been installing this software for staff (Creative Cloud).

I seriously don't know how anyone can endure the torture of using any Adobe product. Each app takes 30 minutes to install if you have a powerful internet connection. You have to pay monthly and the Gigs of storage space it sucks out of your system is evidence of how bloaty and slow it is. I only give credit to software developers who can make useful software that is done quickly and efficiently.

Why use Photoshop when a simple photo editing program like Irfanview which is maybe 10 MBs with all the plugins installed.

Adobe's terrible.

**lithedreamer** · 03-09-2017, 11:16 AM

Originally posted by maddog22

Why use Photoshop when a simple photo editing program like Irfanview which is maybe 10 MBs with all the plugins installed.

So Irfanview supports everything Photoshop does? What about Photoshop's most rudimentary features?

Mac support?
Layers?
Layer blending?
Layer masks?
Saving files as PSD so I can come back to my layers later?
Support for raw files like DNG or PEF?

Should I even bother to continue? You're just supporting the software.

There are many valid reasons to hate on Adobe and its software, many competitors that are suitable for most of its purposes, but you really don't sound like you've ever used Photoshop.

mohb · 03-09-2017, 11:39 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by maddog22

Why use Photoshop when a simple photo editing program like Irfanview which is maybe 10 MBs with all the plugins installed.

Photoshop can do things most of us mere mortals can't imagine but it also does a lot of things you occasionally want to do and for those whose livelihoods depend on either of these two talents PS is the way to go.

**Oakland Rob** · 03-09-2017, 03:33 PM

Originally posted by mohb

Photoshop can do things most of us mere mortals can't imagine but it also does a lot of things you occasionally want to do and for those whose livelihoods depend on either of these two talents PS is the way to go.

Still, there is a point to be made about Adobe installers. I like their programs, but they spray stuff all over the place.

**boriscleto** · 03-09-2017, 04:18 PM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by Oakland Rob

Still, there is a point to be made about Adobe installers. I like their programs, but they spray stuff all over the place.

On OS X there are Adobe folders in /Library/Application Support & /Users/user/Library/Application Support.

Everything else is in the Application package or application folder in /Applications.

Lloyd_Christmas · 03-10-2017, 10:15 AM

So I have a stand alone version of LR, version 5.7.1.
I need a profile for a new lens but all the Adobe support is about the creative cloud which is $9.99 per month.
I guess if I want the lens profile I have to join this?

**Oakland Rob** · 03-10-2017, 10:15 AM

Originally posted by boriscleto

On OS X there are Adobe folders in /Library/Application Support & /Users/user/Library/Application Support.

Everything else is in the Application package or application folder in /Applications.

And in prefs, launchdaemons, frameworks, pdfservices, launchagents, etc. I wish it were all in those two folders. And generally it's not the stuff in there that has caused me to have to resort to Adobe's CC Cleaner Tool (the fact they need one is a bad sign); it's some obscure bit associated with AAM or something. I suppose given the complexity of the programs (and I have several besides Lr and Ps) it's necessary, but still.

**boriscleto** · 03-10-2017, 10:49 AM

Originally posted by Oakland Rob

And in prefs, launchdaemons, frameworks, pdfservices, launchagents, etc. I wish it were all in those two folders. And generally it's not the stuff in there that has caused me to have to resort to Adobe's CC Cleaner Tool (the fact they need one is a bad sign); it's some obscure bit associated with AAM or something. I suppose given the complexity of the programs (and I have several besides Lr and Ps) it's necessary, but still.

The only Adobe framework in the /Library/Frameworks on my system is Adobe AIR. I guess I've never paid attention to where they stick .plist files, but they aren't any worse than M$ in that regard...I don't have Acrobat, and I don't let Reader install itself in Plug-ins...

Actually I do have Acrobat, but it's a really old version on my old G3 iBook...

GodsPetMonkey · 03-25-2017, 06:06 PM

Originally posted by RichardS

I tried the Pentax utility and it sort-of works, but it's lacking many features that I rely on. So, I'm looking at Lightroom again.

That we still have silly regional pricing that has us paying an 'Australian tax' is ridiculous. Luckily we live in a global world where it isn't hard to get around the issue. More fool you Adobe.

All you need to do to access Lightroom at US prices is to have an Adobe CC account that is registered as being resident in the US. All you need to do that is an email address that hasn't been used to create a Adobe CC account before. If you can wait it is worth holding out until B&H or Adorama have a sale (~$99 instead of ~$120).

**Rondec** · 03-26-2017, 02:55 AM

Originally posted by Lloyd_Christmas

So I have a stand alone version of LR, version 5.7.1.
I need a profile for a new lens but all the Adobe support is about the creative cloud which is $9.99 per month.
I guess if I want the lens profile I have to join this?

I think you can just upgrade from version 5 stand alone to version 6 stand alone for 79 dollars and I assume that would include the lens profile you want.

beholder3 · 03-26-2017, 03:54 PM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by Lloyd_Christmas

So I have a stand alone version of LR, version 5.7.1.
I need a profile for a new lens but all the Adobe support is about the creative cloud which is $9.99 per month.
I guess if I want the lens profile I have to join this?

No.

All lens profiles can be used in all LR versions.

You get all the newest lens profiles officially for FREE in the DNG converter software.

No need to EVER leave 5.7.1.

03-09-2017, 10:44 AM	#123
maddog22 New Member Join Date: Mar 2017 Posts: 1	I just support this software, but Adobe Products are simple BLOAT I have been installing this software for staff (Creative Cloud). I seriously don't know how anyone can endure the torture of using any Adobe product. Each app takes 30 minutes to install if you have a powerful internet connection. You have to pay monthly and the Gigs of storage space it sucks out of your system is evidence of how bloaty and slow it is. I only give credit to software developers who can make useful software that is done quickly and efficiently. Why use Photoshop when a simple photo editing program like Irfanview which is maybe 10 MBs with all the plugins installed. Adobe's terrible.

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02-22-2017, 11:20 AM - 1 Like	#121
stevebrot Otis Memorial Pentaxian Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Vancouver (USA) Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 42,007	Originally posted by lithedreamer If Lightroom's limited editing capabilities are enough for your project (they usually are for mine, as I have said). When they're not, I still want something non-destructive. Originally posted by Racer X 69 Photoshop CS5. Non-destructive raster edits...now there is a concept I know, I know...Photoshop has several functions when working with PSD files that are essentially non-destructive and when linked though Lightroom's "edit in" feature provides fairly tight "downstream" coupling between the two tools. BTW, the "edit in" feature is very much worth learning in detail and allows for a high degree of flexibility when working with external editors and can approximate non-destructive edits, at least within session on the external editor. Steve

02-22-2017, 04:28 PM	#122
mee Veteran Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 7,403	Affinity Photo can work non-destructively. That is what the 'live filter layers' do.

03-09-2017, 11:16 AM	#124
lithedreamer Site Supporter Join Date: Sep 2013 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 1,799	Originally posted by maddog22 Why use Photoshop when a simple photo editing program like Irfanview which is maybe 10 MBs with all the plugins installed. So Irfanview supports everything Photoshop does? What about Photoshop's most rudimentary features? Mac support? Layers? Layer blending? Layer masks? Saving files as PSD so I can come back to my layers later? Support for raw files like DNG or PEF? Should I even bother to continue? You're just supporting the software. There are many valid reasons to hate on Adobe and its software, many competitors that are suitable for most of its purposes, but you really don't sound like you've ever used Photoshop.

03-09-2017, 11:39 AM - 1 Like	#125
mohb Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2010 Photos: Albums Posts: 1,912	Originally posted by maddog22 Why use Photoshop when a simple photo editing program like Irfanview which is maybe 10 MBs with all the plugins installed. Photoshop can do things most of us mere mortals can't imagine but it also does a lot of things you occasionally want to do and for those whose livelihoods depend on either of these two talents PS is the way to go.

03-09-2017, 03:33 PM	#126
Oakland Rob Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Apr 2015 Location: Bay Area California Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 798	Originally posted by mohb Photoshop can do things most of us mere mortals can't imagine but it also does a lot of things you occasionally want to do and for those whose livelihoods depend on either of these two talents PS is the way to go. Still, there is a point to be made about Adobe installers. I like their programs, but they spray stuff all over the place.

03-09-2017, 04:18 PM - 1 Like	#127
boriscleto Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: North Syracuse, NY Photos: Gallery Posts: 16,475	Originally posted by Oakland Rob Still, there is a point to be made about Adobe installers. I like their programs, but they spray stuff all over the place. On OS X there are Adobe folders in /Library/Application Support & /Users/user/Library/Application Support. Everything else is in the Application package or application folder in /Applications.

03-10-2017, 10:15 AM	#128
Lloyd_Christmas Pentaxian Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: Atlanta, GA Posts: 458	So I have a stand alone version of LR, version 5.7.1. I need a profile for a new lens but all the Adobe support is about the creative cloud which is $9.99 per month. I guess if I want the lens profile I have to join this?

03-10-2017, 10:15 AM	#129
Oakland Rob Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Apr 2015 Location: Bay Area California Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 798	Originally posted by boriscleto On OS X there are Adobe folders in /Library/Application Support & /Users/user/Library/Application Support. Everything else is in the Application package or application folder in /Applications. And in prefs, launchdaemons, frameworks, pdfservices, launchagents, etc. I wish it were all in those two folders. And generally it's not the stuff in there that has caused me to have to resort to Adobe's CC Cleaner Tool (the fact they need one is a bad sign); it's some obscure bit associated with AAM or something. I suppose given the complexity of the programs (and I have several besides Lr and Ps) it's necessary, but still.

03-10-2017, 10:49 AM	#130
boriscleto Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: North Syracuse, NY Photos: Gallery Posts: 16,475	Originally posted by Oakland Rob And in prefs, launchdaemons, frameworks, pdfservices, launchagents, etc. I wish it were all in those two folders. And generally it's not the stuff in there that has caused me to have to resort to Adobe's CC Cleaner Tool (the fact they need one is a bad sign); it's some obscure bit associated with AAM or something. I suppose given the complexity of the programs (and I have several besides Lr and Ps) it's necessary, but still. The only Adobe framework in the /Library/Frameworks on my system is Adobe AIR. I guess I've never paid attention to where they stick .plist files, but they aren't any worse than M$ in that regard...I don't have Acrobat, and I don't let Reader install itself in Plug-ins... Actually I do have Acrobat, but it's a really old version on my old G3 iBook...

03-25-2017, 06:06 PM	#131
GodsPetMonkey Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2015 Location: Brisbane, Australia Posts: 134	Originally posted by RichardS I tried the Pentax utility and it sort-of works, but it's lacking many features that I rely on. So, I'm looking at Lightroom again. That we still have silly regional pricing that has us paying an 'Australian tax' is ridiculous. Luckily we live in a global world where it isn't hard to get around the issue. More fool you Adobe. All you need to do to access Lightroom at US prices is to have an Adobe CC account that is registered as being resident in the US. All you need to do that is an email address that hasn't been used to create a Adobe CC account before. If you can wait it is worth holding out until B&H or Adorama have a sale (~$99 instead of ~$120).

03-26-2017, 02:55 AM	#132
Rondec Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Gladys, Virginia Photos: Gallery Posts: 27,653	Originally posted by Lloyd_Christmas So I have a stand alone version of LR, version 5.7.1. I need a profile for a new lens but all the Adobe support is about the creative cloud which is $9.99 per month. I guess if I want the lens profile I have to join this? I think you can just upgrade from version 5 stand alone to version 6 stand alone for 79 dollars and I assume that would include the lens profile you want.

03-26-2017, 03:54 PM - 1 Like	#133
beholder3 Pentaxian Join Date: Dec 2011 Posts: 3,112	Originally posted by Lloyd_Christmas So I have a stand alone version of LR, version 5.7.1. I need a profile for a new lens but all the Adobe support is about the creative cloud which is $9.99 per month. I guess if I want the lens profile I have to join this? No. All lens profiles can be used in all LR versions. You get all the newest lens profiles officially for FREE in the DNG converter software. No need to EVER leave 5.7.1.