[skyer]

I like the default colour profile of my Pentax K-1 ("Bright"). Such colours one also can get in PDCU. However, everyone knows that PDCU is not the most advanced converter in the world. If it was only possible to get the same colors in Lightroom or C1 or Silkypix, it would be just great! Lightroom has a very close color profile that is called "Camera Bright" but it is still worse in comparison to OOC jpegs (in my opinion).
So I thought to myself that maybe there is a solution to the problem. Maybe somehow it's possible to use a spectrophotometer that I have (ColorMunki Photo). At first, I should meter the colors from an OOC image, then I should meter the colors from the raw image in Lightroom/C1/etc. Then I must upload the data to a somewhat software so that it could create me a color profile for my converter. All it's left is to find out the software that has such a functionality.
Could anyone help me in my search?

P.S. I should stress that I don't need "correct" colours, I need the exact colours that can be found in OOC jpegs.

[BigMackCam]

If you have a colour reference chart (something like the ColorMunki Passport), it isn't all that difficult to produce your own colour preset in Lightroom. A few months ago, I wrote a short article on reproducing the K10D's CCD-sensor colours with a K-3 and Lightroom. You can use the same approach to achieve what you want, by comparing two shots of the colour reference chart - one as a JPEG in "Bright" setting, and the other as a RAW file. The process I describe in the article for matching the colours applies just the same. It takes some time, but it's a worthwhile exercise. If you can't find a ready-prepared colour profile for what you want, I'd recommend trying this approach

[TonyW]

Another approach would be to actually produce a camera profile Adobe DNG Profile editor (ADP) will do what you want without the need to be trying to read colours - you should be able to match the rendering very closely to what you consider to be a standard side by side
http://www.adobe.com/content/dam/acom/en/products/photoshop/pdfs/cs6/DNGProf...umentation.pdf

Just be aware that this will only produce DNG profiles and can only be used with those products that support .dcp e.g. Adobe. If you need a profile for Capture One it will have to be an ICC profile and this will need to be produced with something like Lumariver Profile designer (which handles .dcp as well). No idea what SilkyPix uses

One way to tackle this is to just open an existing DNG image or a colour chart such as colour checker (if you need to convert any raw to DNG first) in ADP and tweak the image to taste or to mimic the look of your JPEG SOOC. Using a colour checker chart is ok but is often more useful if you actually use it including real world subject matter.

So for example a portrait the subject would hold the chart in the frame and while you could use the chart solely to produce the profile you may find more pleasing results tweaking the profile to taste. By doing this you will still retain the neutrals pretty close but introduce slight hue twists to get the JPEG look you are after with hopefully only minimal post work required

[skyer]

Thank you, guys!
BigMackCam, you've got a cool Avatar! I tried to adjust the sliders in the Camera Calibration section in Lightroom. It does help but still, the adjustments are too rough to my taste.

TonyW, I guess, your advice on trying the Adobe DNG Profile Editor really can help. I looked through the .pdf file you linked and noticed that the adjustments can be done very precisely. I should give it a try. If it works, I'll have to stick to the Lightroom or Photoshop with its ACR. Although I don't like them very much, it'll be OK.
As for the Silkypix, I would really like to use it more. Sometimes it seems that only minor adjustments should be applied and the colours will be 100% equal. Alas, it looks like there aren't corresponding all the sliders so that I could make the correct adjustments. At the same time, there is a very interesting instrument - "Contrast center" (along with the ordinary "Contrast"). I suppose that Pentax also uses such an instrument in its OOC jpegs but all other converters, except for the Silkypix, lack it. Also, the sharpness in the Silkypix is phenomenal!

[TonyW]

I have never looked at Sikypix but assume that it has some method of including camera profiles or at least a method of saving a preset? Perhaps a little play and saving as preset may work?

The two common camera profiles appear to be Adobe DNG or ICC profile as used in C1 and I think DXO. If you are really keen to make a profile AND Silkypix supports only ICC profiles then the easiest way is probably using Lumariver Profile Designer but that comes at a cost of € 100. Meant to include link in last post
Lumariver

I would not worry about sharpness from one raw editor to another too much. It all depends on how much the developer wishes to sharpen a particular image as default after demosaicing - even though the sliders may be zero suggesting no sharpening it may have already been applied. Examples would be C1 to Lightroom - C1 applies more sharpening as default compared to LR modest settings. Canons DPP software also applies more sharpening as default.

[skyer]

Ofcourse, Silkypix supports presets. Unfortunately, I haven't created a preset that would systematically be equal or better than the OOC jpegs yet.
As for the sharpening, I disagree that it doesn't matter too much. Silkypix has not one but four types of sharpening algorythms. Lightroom has only one of them.

I'll try to know more about the Lumariver, thank you!

[TonyW]

Perhaps I did not express about sharpening too well and I cannot comment about Silkypix as I have not used it or seen any comparisons against others.

Just for information LR actually has more than one sharpening method the first two found in the Detail slider. USM and Deconvolution sharpening are used balanced by the Detail slider. In addition the very useful feature of masking can be used to control where the sharpening applied. Further to that Output sharpening can by applied to cater for screen or print output at various strengths

[skyer]

Well, you're right. Generally speaking, there are more than just one sharpening method in the Lightroom. However, if we're talking just about the global sharpening in the Develop module, there is only one method. Using this method, one can move 4 sliders: Amount, Radius, Detail, Masking. On the contrary, in the Silkypix there are 4 such methods:
1. Unsharp mask (Amount, Radius, Threshold sliders) - practically, the same method as in the Lightroom, but without the Detail slider.
2. Normal sharp (Outline emphasis, Detail emphasis, False outline contr. sliders) - somewhat ordinary sharpening.
3. Pure detail (Outline emphasis, Detail emphasis, False outline contr. sliders) - for the extraordinary amount of small details.
4. Natural sharp (Outline emphasis, Ringing artifact contr., Bokeh preservation sliders) - this is a new method that appeared in the 8th version of Silkypix.

The fourth new method is just phenomenal! The sharpening is really done in a very natural way and images look very-very sharp and with almost no visible noise (even at default settings)! The Lightroom sharpening looks very mushy in comparison.
Also, in the Silkypix there is another global sharpening method which is called "Demosaicing sharpening". It can be used in conjunction with all other methods but it is something different. I don't use it at all. Nevertheless, you can see how more advanced the Silkypix is regarding the sharpening issue.

[TonyW]

Interesting thank you for thr information I will take a look sometime

[skyer]

You're welcome!
I've just downloaded the Adobe DNG Profile Editor. I opened my .dng image of various colour patches. Then I tried to apply the "Camera Bright" .dcp profile from the ACR so that I could make little adjustments. Unfortunately, the Adobe DNG Profile Editor doesn't read this .dcp file. It wants a recipe (.dcpr file). I renamed ".dcp" to ".dcpr" but it didn't help. I guess, now it's time to read more about the Lumariver

[TonyW]

Currently I am away from my PC so unable to check. But from memory you need to Open your DNG file then apply a Base profile, This will be found in the Colour Tables tab as a dropdown menu labelled Base Profile. If you select the Bright or other profiles from this menu and do not see changes this suggests something wrong with the profile. The recipe files are just that a previously saved file that can be applied and further tweaks added. The Base profile is the actual ,dcp.

If the problem persists I will double check my system when I get back to make sure I have given good instruction

[BigMackCam]

BigMackCam, you've got a cool Avatar!

Спасибо

I collect Soviet lenses, and the CCCP / USSR logo is found on quite a few of them

I tried to adjust the sliders in the Camera Calibration section in Lightroom. It does help but still, the adjustments are too rough to my taste.

The trick is to make small adjustments... +1 or +2 at a time until you get the desired change. It takes practice, but it's possible to control colour HSL very finely using these sliders. It's not a quick job, though... it took me days (perhaps weeks) to get the colour reproduction exactly how I wanted it

[skyer]

Спасибо
I collect Soviet lenses, and the CCCP / USSR logo is found on quite a few of them

Yes, this logo was a sign that a product was thoroughly tested and it was up to the corresponding standards.
By the way, a few months ago I bought a Jupiter 37A 135/3.5. What a lens it is! This kind of lens could be one of the Limiteds. It is very small and lightweight, built like a tank, it is ridiculously sharp right to the very corners and has very pronounced 3D-look and clarity. It fits well in my camera bag along with the camera and 3 other Limiteds. Before when I needed a long focal range, I grabbed my FA*80-200, but it is so huge and heavy that I have to pull out all other lenses from my bag To me, the only bad side of the 37A is its default colors. They are somewhat bluish. But they can be corrected quite easily. Afterwards, they just pop out!

The trick is to make small adjustments... +1 or +2 at a time until you get the desired change. It takes practice, but it's possible to control colour HSL very finely using these sliders. It's not a quick job, though... it took me days (perhaps weeks) to get the colour reproduction exactly how I wanted it

Surely, I also make small adjustments. Usually, my photos really begin to look better but as for the 100% jpeg reproduction, this method isn't too good.

...you need to Open your DNG file then apply a Base profile, This will be found in the Colour Tables tab as a dropdown menu labelled Base Profile...

Yes, I found this! Thank you for your help! I did quite many adjustments and saved a new .dcp profile. My images began to look much closer to the original jpegs. The colors now are visibly better than from the ordinary ACR's "Camera Bright" profile. However, OOC jpegs still look better.
I then gave another try to the Silkypix. I don't know how its "engine works" but the Silkypix produces absolutely different look than any other converter that I tried (except for the PDCU). Images tend to look "natural" like in OOC jpegs or PDCU (here I'm not talking about 100% colour reproduction). After spending some time with the program, I guess, I was able to reproduce jpeg colours quite nicely. At least, now images with my "jpeg colours preset" look not worse but a bit better than OOC jpegs! Of course, by saying that I mean only the default look after opening a file and applying the preset without further corrections. However, I think that the default look is very important even for future heavy post-processing.

Thank you, guys! I think my question is closed for the moment