Smug Mug vs Flickr

**BruceBanner** · 07-09-2018, 04:31 AM

Originally posted by boriscleto

It has former but not the latter.

LMGTFY

Thank you my minion! Shame, dehaze is actually quite good to have. So will there be a LR7 released that will have it? If you buy LR6 will you (for a price) be able to upgrade to 7 (at a discounted price)... hmm... I wonder how to find that out

**boriscleto** · 07-09-2018, 06:34 AM

Originally posted by BruceBanner

Thank you my minion! Shame, dehaze is actually quite good to have. So will there be a LR7 released that will have it? If you buy LR6 will you (for a price) be able to upgrade to 7 (at a discounted price)... hmm... I wonder how to find that out

No. Lightroom as a stand alone product is dead. The subscription product is Lightroom "Classic" now and is on life support...

Lightroom CC as a cloud based service is the future. You are really paying for the cloud storage, not the software...

emalvick · 07-10-2018, 01:31 PM

I am a SmugMug user, and I actually went there after the original Flickr network was lost (I guess when Yahoo bought it).

Smugmug is not a social media site in the way Flickr is. I find it more user contained. I recall from when I switched off of Flickr, the key items drawing me to Smugmug was the flexibility in presenting my photos, a more professional appearance, the ability to make galleries private / public / etc, and the ability to upload and download original photos. Zenfolio was another site I browsed at the time, and I remember the features were comparable, but were more geared towards sellers than what I needed. For my money, I chose Smugmug.

It hasn't been a perfect experience as they revamped their web-page to be more modern, and many customizations were removed at one point, but in the past couple of years, Smugmug has been solid for me. I would love it to be cheaper, but based on the features and pricepoint, nothing really compares at a cheaper price point.

What it does lack is the ability to easily use it as a blog or in any more social format, but I find Smugmug has worked well for me in combination with other blogging and social media sites, i.e. I can link to smugmug images (I don't link galleries or pages but the jpgs directly) from the blogs.

**BruceBanner** · 07-10-2018, 02:38 PM

Originally posted by boriscleto

No. Lightroom as a stand alone product is dead. The subscription product is Lightroom "Classic" now and is on life support...

Lightroom CC as a cloud based service is the future. You are really paying for the cloud storage, not the software...

I have tried to use LR as a full system for my editing/culling process, but I gave up on it. I felt I had a better more fluid culling experience using Faststone Image Viewer than LR, and then I found the Library access a bit redundant (I tend to move my files around a fair bit which doesn't help I imagine). Currently with my CC subscription I have actually rolled back and resisted updating to newer versions because I have found this particular version of LR to do an excellent 'Auto Settings' preset that gets me close to where I want to be as a first round of editing. The changes that one click makes to Exposure, Highlights, Shadows, Blacks, Whites and Contrast is excellent. It's not perfect, typically a few sliders still need adjusted but it gets me to a great starting point. I found that when I updated LR passed this version that the 'Auto Settings' was not working as well, it wasn't taking me to a place that I felt worked with the K-1 DNG files. So I rolled back.

After messing around with fine tuning Auto Settings I typically Edit In>Photoshop, from there I then use my Topaz Plugins to enhance the image as well as apply masking. I can apply masking within the Topaz Plugins but PS is a lot simpler (as well as my lower pc specced machine seems to prefer, far more fluid). After the PS and Topaz effects applied I tend to 'Save' and return to LR for any last minute editing before Exporting as Jpg.

I can launch my Topaz plugins direct from LR, hence why I am pondering the idea of ditching the subscription and buying a stand alone copy of LR... I'm just trying to see if I can crawl back on subscription fees. I think Zenfolio is the direction I should be heading in, being able to direct clients to my site, take payments and deposits for events etc, it's just gonna push my monthly expenses to $50/month!, currently I am still in the setting up phase, I'll be lucky to break even over a year of paid work for those kinda expenses lol.
But the idea of not having PS does leave my stomach feeling queasy... and although I like the look that Topaz Plugins give (Adaptive Exposure etc), they do however have major drawbacks in terms of lacking the ability to 'sync' the effects from multiple images (not like LR can do, which is really helpful). Leaving Topaz might be the first step to ditching LR/PS and find another 3rd party Editor that is not subscription based.

Originally posted by emalvick

I am a SmugMug user, and I actually went there after the original Flickr network was lost (I guess when Yahoo bought it).

Smugmug is not a social media site in the way Flickr is. I find it more user contained. I recall from when I switched off of Flickr, the key items drawing me to Smugmug was the flexibility in presenting my photos, a more professional appearance, the ability to make galleries private / public / etc, and the ability to upload and download original photos. Zenfolio was another site I browsed at the time, and I remember the features were comparable, but were more geared towards sellers than what I needed. For my money, I chose Smugmug.

It hasn't been a perfect experience as they revamped their web-page to be more modern, and many customizations were removed at one point, but in the past couple of years, Smugmug has been solid for me. I would love it to be cheaper, but based on the features and pricepoint, nothing really compares at a cheaper price point.

What it does lack is the ability to easily use it as a blog or in any more social format, but I find Smugmug has worked well for me in combination with other blogging and social media sites, i.e. I can link to smugmug images (I don't link galleries or pages but the jpgs directly) from the blogs.

Thanks for the feedback. I'm thinking I will pull back my pro flickr status to free, just so that I can keep a social aspect going, but then concentrate on Instagram, Facebook and a single website/Zenfolio.

johnkrumm · 07-10-2018, 02:58 PM

Smugmug has been great for me over the years. I use the "Power" account since I don't need to sell. I used to have a pro account, but I only "sold" at cost to friends and relatives. It's all pretty simple and highly customizable. The main feature lacking I think is there is no blog module. You can custom code something but it's beyond me.

It's excellent for sharing photos on websites and blogs. You can even specify the size of the image down to the pixel if you change the url (it will generate one).

The business level is mainly geared towards working professionals, like wedding photographers, and the Portfolio one to artists who aren't selling "packages" and such.

Here's mine:

jkrumm

**Mikesul** · 07-11-2018, 07:34 AM - **1 Like**

The commentary here makes clear that the title of the thread presents a false dichotomy. These are two quite different services. Flickr remains a mainly social site.

emalvick · 07-11-2018, 07:53 AM - **1 Like**

Right. I think the comparison is because Smugmug bought Flickr.

From my experiences on using Flickr as a social site, the better comparison to Flickr would be 500px. Really, when you are on the business end of these websites, you aren't going to try to make your website exactly the same as another as you want to set yourself apart (unless you are going to do it by cost, which probably isn't economical).

I would think that for many more dedicated photographers (hobbyists, semi-pro, pro) that were using Flickr and want that social aspect, they might actually like 500px better. I can't say for certain as I've not really used it myself except to browse and enjoy photographs. I moved to more of a blog format for socially sharing my photos, but 500px is nice.

The only thing I never cared for in the few times I tried using 500px is that there is a competitiveness to the site as they score photos, but I don't know that it matters much other than psychologically and getting more views. You can try it for free with certain limits, and I mostly only gave up because I again really quit caring about having that (kind of) social aspect.

**Mikesul** · 07-11-2018, 08:04 AM

Yes, 500px seems closer for most people.

**babywriter** · 07-13-2018, 08:16 AM

I tried 500px in a limited way. What turned me off was what appeared to be an algorithm "gaming" of the first photo or two that I posted there, where it went artificially high compared to others that I posted later. The trend seemed clear to me (although, admittedly, I have no proof), and it just left a bad taste in my mouth.

**Mikesul** · 07-13-2018, 09:12 AM

Originally posted by babywriter

I tried 500px in a limited way. What turned me off was what appeared to be an algorithm "gaming" of the first photo or two that I posted there, where it went artificially high compared to others that I posted later. The trend seemed clear to me (although, admittedly, I have no proof), and it just left a bad taste in my mouth.

I have not used 500px enough to be sure but I had the same sense when I first used it. It seemed kind of joke more than a serious photo site.

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07-09-2018, 04:31 AM	#31
BruceBanner Site Supporter Join Date: Dec 2015 Posts: 5,404 Original Poster	Originally posted by boriscleto It has former but not the latter. LMGTFY Thank you my minion! Shame, dehaze is actually quite good to have. So will there be a LR7 released that will have it? If you buy LR6 will you (for a price) be able to upgrade to 7 (at a discounted price)... hmm... I wonder how to find that out

07-09-2018, 06:34 AM	#32
boriscleto Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: North Syracuse, NY Photos: Gallery Posts: 16,475	Originally posted by BruceBanner Thank you my minion! Shame, dehaze is actually quite good to have. So will there be a LR7 released that will have it? If you buy LR6 will you (for a price) be able to upgrade to 7 (at a discounted price)... hmm... I wonder how to find that out No. Lightroom as a stand alone product is dead. The subscription product is Lightroom "Classic" now and is on life support... Lightroom CC as a cloud based service is the future. You are really paying for the cloud storage, not the software...

07-10-2018, 01:31 PM	#33
emalvick Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Davis, CA Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,642	I am a SmugMug user, and I actually went there after the original Flickr network was lost (I guess when Yahoo bought it). Smugmug is not a social media site in the way Flickr is. I find it more user contained. I recall from when I switched off of Flickr, the key items drawing me to Smugmug was the flexibility in presenting my photos, a more professional appearance, the ability to make galleries private / public / etc, and the ability to upload and download original photos. Zenfolio was another site I browsed at the time, and I remember the features were comparable, but were more geared towards sellers than what I needed. For my money, I chose Smugmug. It hasn't been a perfect experience as they revamped their web-page to be more modern, and many customizations were removed at one point, but in the past couple of years, Smugmug has been solid for me. I would love it to be cheaper, but based on the features and pricepoint, nothing really compares at a cheaper price point. What it does lack is the ability to easily use it as a blog or in any more social format, but I find Smugmug has worked well for me in combination with other blogging and social media sites, i.e. I can link to smugmug images (I don't link galleries or pages but the jpgs directly) from the blogs.

07-10-2018, 02:38 PM	#34
BruceBanner Site Supporter Join Date: Dec 2015 Posts: 5,404 Original Poster	Originally posted by boriscleto No. Lightroom as a stand alone product is dead. The subscription product is Lightroom "Classic" now and is on life support... Lightroom CC as a cloud based service is the future. You are really paying for the cloud storage, not the software... I have tried to use LR as a full system for my editing/culling process, but I gave up on it. I felt I had a better more fluid culling experience using Faststone Image Viewer than LR, and then I found the Library access a bit redundant (I tend to move my files around a fair bit which doesn't help I imagine). Currently with my CC subscription I have actually rolled back and resisted updating to newer versions because I have found this particular version of LR to do an excellent 'Auto Settings' preset that gets me close to where I want to be as a first round of editing. The changes that one click makes to Exposure, Highlights, Shadows, Blacks, Whites and Contrast is excellent. It's not perfect, typically a few sliders still need adjusted but it gets me to a great starting point. I found that when I updated LR passed this version that the 'Auto Settings' was not working as well, it wasn't taking me to a place that I felt worked with the K-1 DNG files. So I rolled back. After messing around with fine tuning Auto Settings I typically Edit In>Photoshop, from there I then use my Topaz Plugins to enhance the image as well as apply masking. I can apply masking within the Topaz Plugins but PS is a lot simpler (as well as my lower pc specced machine seems to prefer, far more fluid). After the PS and Topaz effects applied I tend to 'Save' and return to LR for any last minute editing before Exporting as Jpg. I can launch my Topaz plugins direct from LR, hence why I am pondering the idea of ditching the subscription and buying a stand alone copy of LR... I'm just trying to see if I can crawl back on subscription fees. I think Zenfolio is the direction I should be heading in, being able to direct clients to my site, take payments and deposits for events etc, it's just gonna push my monthly expenses to $50/month!, currently I am still in the setting up phase, I'll be lucky to break even over a year of paid work for those kinda expenses lol. But the idea of not having PS does leave my stomach feeling queasy... and although I like the look that Topaz Plugins give (Adaptive Exposure etc), they do however have major drawbacks in terms of lacking the ability to 'sync' the effects from multiple images (not like LR can do, which is really helpful). Leaving Topaz might be the first step to ditching LR/PS and find another 3rd party Editor that is not subscription based. Originally posted by emalvick I am a SmugMug user, and I actually went there after the original Flickr network was lost (I guess when Yahoo bought it). Smugmug is not a social media site in the way Flickr is. I find it more user contained. I recall from when I switched off of Flickr, the key items drawing me to Smugmug was the flexibility in presenting my photos, a more professional appearance, the ability to make galleries private / public / etc, and the ability to upload and download original photos. Zenfolio was another site I browsed at the time, and I remember the features were comparable, but were more geared towards sellers than what I needed. For my money, I chose Smugmug. It hasn't been a perfect experience as they revamped their web-page to be more modern, and many customizations were removed at one point, but in the past couple of years, Smugmug has been solid for me. I would love it to be cheaper, but based on the features and pricepoint, nothing really compares at a cheaper price point. What it does lack is the ability to easily use it as a blog or in any more social format, but I find Smugmug has worked well for me in combination with other blogging and social media sites, i.e. I can link to smugmug images (I don't link galleries or pages but the jpgs directly) from the blogs. Thanks for the feedback. I'm thinking I will pull back my pro flickr status to free, just so that I can keep a social aspect going, but then concentrate on Instagram, Facebook and a single website/Zenfolio.

07-10-2018, 02:58 PM	#35
johnkrumm Senior Member Join Date: May 2016 Location: Duluth, MN Posts: 141	Smugmug has been great for me over the years. I use the "Power" account since I don't need to sell. I used to have a pro account, but I only "sold" at cost to friends and relatives. It's all pretty simple and highly customizable. The main feature lacking I think is there is no blog module. You can custom code something but it's beyond me. It's excellent for sharing photos on websites and blogs. You can even specify the size of the image down to the pixel if you change the url (it will generate one). The business level is mainly geared towards working professionals, like wedding photographers, and the Portfolio one to artists who aren't selling "packages" and such. Here's mine: jkrumm

07-11-2018, 07:34 AM - 1 Like	#36
Mikesul Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Phoenix, AZ Posts: 7,594	The commentary here makes clear that the title of the thread presents a false dichotomy. These are two quite different services. Flickr remains a mainly social site.

07-11-2018, 07:53 AM - 1 Like	#37
emalvick Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Davis, CA Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,642	Right. I think the comparison is because Smugmug bought Flickr. From my experiences on using Flickr as a social site, the better comparison to Flickr would be 500px. Really, when you are on the business end of these websites, you aren't going to try to make your website exactly the same as another as you want to set yourself apart (unless you are going to do it by cost, which probably isn't economical). I would think that for many more dedicated photographers (hobbyists, semi-pro, pro) that were using Flickr and want that social aspect, they might actually like 500px better. I can't say for certain as I've not really used it myself except to browse and enjoy photographs. I moved to more of a blog format for socially sharing my photos, but 500px is nice. The only thing I never cared for in the few times I tried using 500px is that there is a competitiveness to the site as they score photos, but I don't know that it matters much other than psychologically and getting more views. You can try it for free with certain limits, and I mostly only gave up because I again really quit caring about having that (kind of) social aspect.

07-11-2018, 08:04 AM	#38
Mikesul Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Phoenix, AZ Posts: 7,594	Yes, 500px seems closer for most people.

07-13-2018, 08:16 AM	#39
babywriter Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2016 Location: central Iowa Photos: Gallery Posts: 969	I tried 500px in a limited way. What turned me off was what appeared to be an algorithm "gaming" of the first photo or two that I posted there, where it went artificially high compared to others that I posted later. The trend seemed clear to me (although, admittedly, I have no proof), and it just left a bad taste in my mouth.

07-13-2018, 09:12 AM	#40
Mikesul Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Phoenix, AZ Posts: 7,594	Originally posted by babywriter I tried 500px in a limited way. What turned me off was what appeared to be an algorithm "gaming" of the first photo or two that I posted there, where it went artificially high compared to others that I posted later. The trend seemed clear to me (although, admittedly, I have no proof), and it just left a bad taste in my mouth. I have not used 500px enough to be sure but I had the same sense when I first used it. It seemed kind of joke more than a serious photo site.