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Class A · 12-04-2019, 05:06 AM - **1 Like**

Youtu.be

He missed one of the best improvements which is that copying layers to other images that already have layers, does not replace the existing layers anymore. Instead, the source layers are added as additional layers.

He did not talk about the updated noise reduction either.

N.B., the crop tool already allowed adjustments of the edges only. Seems odd that he thinks that one could only manipulate the corners before. Although only the corners showed handles, manipulating the edges has always been possible.

I love that the crop tool now supports free hand rotation. Previously, one always had to employ both crop and rotation tool. Now, it's just a one-stop shop for most cropping/rotation needs.

EDIT: Here are the Version 20 release notes.
There is a Version 20 FAQ as well which reveals that, at last, the K-1 II is now officially supported.

Last edited by Class A; 12-04-2019 at 09:41 AM.

Class A · 12-04-2019, 05:31 AM - **1 Like**

I guess this one here is a good complement:

You Tube

**iheiramo** · 12-04-2019, 05:58 AM

So minor tweaks, nothing major, compared to 12. Kind of a let down to big chance in version number. I'll save money, skip this and continue an other year with 12.

**iheiramo** · 12-04-2019, 06:05 AM - **1 Like**

It says here that K1ii support added: Capture One 20 FAQ ? Capture One

Q: What new cameras/lenses are supported?

New camera support:

Canon 90D
Canon M6 II
Nikon Z50
Leica V-LUX 5
Panasonic Lumix DC-S1H
Pentax K-1 II
Olympus E-M5 III
Ricoh GR III
Generic GoPro HERO RAW support

Does that bring in PEF files and upgrade IQ?

Class A · 12-04-2019, 09:33 AM

Originally posted by iheiramo

So minor tweaks, nothing major, compared to 12.

I find the improved support for copying layers between images rather significant.

I'll be using this feature extensively and it will make a big difference to my productivity.

I'm optimistic that the new "HDR" controls will also speed up certain editing scenarios.
Minor things like being able to rotate an image through pressing a modifier key while using the crop tool are not headline features but, again, will make a big difference to my productivity.

I'd agree, overall, that there are no dramatic feature additions.

Originally posted by iheiramo

Kind of a let down to big chance in version number.

Well, the change from "12" to "20" was not meant to be indicative of a respective increase in features. They just changed the version number so that the current version number is aligned with the last two digits of the current year.

Originally posted by iheiramo

I'll save money, skip this and continue an other year with 12.

That's the advantage of not being enslaved by a subscription scheme.

Class A · 12-04-2019, 09:38 AM

Originally posted by iheiramo

Does that bring in PEF files and upgrade IQ?

K-1 II PEF files will now be officially supported.

Potentially that could mean better IQ out of the box, but I wouldn't get my hopes up too high.
For other camera brands Phase One advertise that they are going through a lengthy calibration process to come up with an exceptionally good camera profile.
For Pentax, Phase One had a number of camera profiles that were either flawed (adapted from older versions without much care) -- which to their credit were fixed after a while -- or not distinguishable from the standard Pentax profile that is embedded in DNG files.

However, it is probably worth trying to see whether the K-1 II profile delivers great images right after importing.

Since the generic DNG support has been improved in V20 as well, I wouldn't expect the PEF support to be significantly better, though, if it is different at all.

**iheiramo** · 12-04-2019, 11:52 AM

Originally posted by Class A

K-1 II PEF files will now be officially supported.

Potentially that could mean better IQ out of the box, but I wouldn't get my hopes up too high.
For other camera brands Phase One advertise that they are going through a lengthy calibration process to come up with an exceptionally good camera profile.
For Pentax, Phase One had a number of camera profiles that were either flawed (adapted from older versions without much care) -- which to their credit were fixed after a while -- or not distinguishable from the standard Pentax profile that is embedded in DNG files.

However, it is probably worth trying to see whether the K-1 II profile delivers great images right after importing.

Since the generic DNG support has been improved in V20 as well, I wouldn't expect the PEF support to be significantly better, though, if it is different at all.

Thanks for the answer. It sounds like it might be wise to stick to my plan to skip every other release and give them a year to finalize the K1ii support. v12 was must have when it was released and I'm quite content with it. It made huge difference to my editing. I have no pressing need to replace it.

I agree that in general the new features sound good, but not critical for my work flow.

**mirocal** · 12-04-2019, 12:43 PM

The K1 II "generic" profile for PEF seems to work pretty well on the couple of images I have tried. The biggest improvement I am seeing is the noise control with default setting, which keeps CO one step ahead of the already improved ON1 20. Speaking of the latter, I have become quite proficient with the ON1 workflow during the CO - K1 II hiatus, and now I find I am missing on CO the ability to flip on and off the tool to quickly evaluate the effects of a change. ON1 also has a before - after general toggle, which on CO I can only achieve by cloning the original image. I wonder why CO hasn't adopted this very useful feature, as it seems like a low hanging fruit?

**manishved** · 12-04-2019, 12:47 PM

Not sure if I will ever use the PEF format over DNG.

**iheiramo** · 12-04-2019, 12:52 PM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by mirocal

I find I am missing on CO the ability to flip on and off the tool to quickly evaluate the effects of a change.

If I understand correctly CO has that. Press alt + keep left mouse button pressed on that backspace arrow on the tool box and you see the picture with that tool on default.

morenjavi · 12-04-2019, 01:13 PM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by Class A

What's New in Capture One Pro 20?

The most significant upgrade for me is the new HDR tool. I feel that I have a lot of control ever details in shadows, higlights or image contrast. I love the effect of the black control slider, and I couldn't find how to do just exactly the same with the 12 version.

But there are not enough improvements for me, I'll wait until the next version or more. Also, I spent all of my money in new lights

.
Thanks for sharing.

rawr · 12-04-2019, 07:41 PM

Originally posted by mirocal

I am missing on CO the ability to flip on and off the tool to quickly evaluate the effects of a change

Yes, in LR it is easy and very quick, using just one press on the backslash key to toggle your defaults/adjusted view of the current image. C1 lacks this one-key keyboard toggle.

But at least now in C1 (since v12, actually) C1 can automatically move to the next image once you set a rating on an image. This was a simple culling speed-booster that LR had but C1 always lacked.

PDL · 12-04-2019, 08:34 PM

Originally posted by rawr

Yes, in LR it is easy and very quick, using just one press on the "" key, to toggle your defaults/adjusted view of the current image. C1 lacks this one-key keyboard toggle.

But at least now in C1 (since v12, actually) C1 can automatically move to the next image once you set a rating on an image. This was a simple culling speed-booster that LR had but C1 always lacked.

You might be able to set the Alt-Reset to a keyboard shortcut - I haven't tried that yet.
I updated my installation today and the first thing I noticed is that when I open a catalogue for the second time - it loads files quicker then v12.

There are a few things I would like to see (not going to beat my dead horses here). The ability to see edges of sharpening (LR hold down Alt or Ctrl or shift or something), see the effect of highlight/shadow when moving the sliders (LR hold down Alt or Ctrl or shift or something) and a quicker way to switch between grid view. Pretty minor stuff but it would be nice.

Now, If we can get them to work on Pixel-Shifted images - now that would be cool.

**iheiramo** · 12-04-2019, 11:22 PM

Originally posted by PDL

a quicker way to switch between grid view.

You mean the one that goes on and off with CTRL+G or some other grid?

PDL · 12-05-2019, 01:33 AM

Originally posted by iheiramo

You mean the one that goes on and off with CTRL+G or some other grid?

Not quite.
LR has the ability of change between various grids when in Crop mode by a keyboard and cycle through grids "O" and some grid orientations (think Fibonacci spiral) sift "O". Some of us have been on Phase One's case to provide a native solution, rather than the method used in v12 and v20.

12-04-2019, 09:33 AM	#5
Class A Pentaxian Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Wellington, New Zealand Posts: 11,251 Original Poster	Originally posted by iheiramo So minor tweaks, nothing major, compared to 12. I find the improved support for copying layers between images rather significant. I'll be using this feature extensively and it will make a big difference to my productivity. I'm optimistic that the new "HDR" controls will also speed up certain editing scenarios. Minor things like being able to rotate an image through pressing a modifier key while using the crop tool are not headline features but, again, will make a big difference to my productivity. I'd agree, overall, that there are no dramatic feature additions. Originally posted by iheiramo Kind of a let down to big chance in version number. Well, the change from "12" to "20" was not meant to be indicative of a respective increase in features. They just changed the version number so that the current version number is aligned with the last two digits of the current year. Originally posted by iheiramo I'll save money, skip this and continue an other year with 12. That's the advantage of not being enslaved by a subscription scheme. Last edited by Class A; 12-05-2019 at 09:56 PM.

12-04-2019, 09:38 AM	#6
Class A Pentaxian Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Wellington, New Zealand Posts: 11,251 Original Poster	Originally posted by iheiramo Does that bring in PEF files and upgrade IQ? K-1 II PEF files will now be officially supported. Potentially that could mean better IQ out of the box, but I wouldn't get my hopes up too high. For other camera brands Phase One advertise that they are going through a lengthy calibration process to come up with an exceptionally good camera profile. For Pentax, Phase One had a number of camera profiles that were either flawed (adapted from older versions without much care) -- which to their credit were fixed after a while -- or not distinguishable from the standard Pentax profile that is embedded in DNG files. However, it is probably worth trying to see whether the K-1 II profile delivers great images right after importing. Since the generic DNG support has been improved in V20 as well, I wouldn't expect the PEF support to be significantly better, though, if it is different at all. Last edited by Class A; 12-04-2019 at 09:55 AM.

12-04-2019, 07:41 PM	#12
rawr Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 11,913	Originally posted by mirocal I am missing on CO the ability to flip on and off the tool to quickly evaluate the effects of a change Yes, in LR it is easy and very quick, using just one press on the backslash key to toggle your defaults/adjusted view of the current image. C1 lacks this one-key keyboard toggle. But at least now in C1 (since v12, actually) C1 can automatically move to the next image once you set a rating on an image. This was a simple culling speed-booster that LR had but C1 always lacked. Last edited by rawr; 12-04-2019 at 08:34 PM.

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12-04-2019, 05:58 AM	#3
iheiramo Unoriginal Poster Join Date: Nov 2016 Location: Espoo Photos: Albums Posts: 3,182	So minor tweaks, nothing major, compared to 12. Kind of a let down to big chance in version number. I'll save money, skip this and continue an other year with 12.

12-04-2019, 06:05 AM - 1 Like	#4
iheiramo Unoriginal Poster Join Date: Nov 2016 Location: Espoo Photos: Albums Posts: 3,182	It says here that K1ii support added: Capture One 20 FAQ ? Capture One Q: What new cameras/lenses are supported? New camera support: Canon 90D Canon M6 II Nikon Z50 Leica V-LUX 5 Panasonic Lumix DC-S1H Pentax K-1 II Olympus E-M5 III Ricoh GR III Generic GoPro HERO RAW support Does that bring in PEF files and upgrade IQ?

12-04-2019, 11:52 AM	#7
iheiramo Unoriginal Poster Join Date: Nov 2016 Location: Espoo Photos: Albums Posts: 3,182	Originally posted by Class A K-1 II PEF files will now be officially supported. Potentially that could mean better IQ out of the box, but I wouldn't get my hopes up too high. For other camera brands Phase One advertise that they are going through a lengthy calibration process to come up with an exceptionally good camera profile. For Pentax, Phase One had a number of camera profiles that were either flawed (adapted from older versions without much care) -- which to their credit were fixed after a while -- or not distinguishable from the standard Pentax profile that is embedded in DNG files. However, it is probably worth trying to see whether the K-1 II profile delivers great images right after importing. Since the generic DNG support has been improved in V20 as well, I wouldn't expect the PEF support to be significantly better, though, if it is different at all. Thanks for the answer. It sounds like it might be wise to stick to my plan to skip every other release and give them a year to finalize the K1ii support. v12 was must have when it was released and I'm quite content with it. It made huge difference to my editing. I have no pressing need to replace it. I agree that in general the new features sound good, but not critical for my work flow.

12-04-2019, 12:43 PM	#8
mirocal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Washington, USA Photos: Gallery Posts: 85	The K1 II "generic" profile for PEF seems to work pretty well on the couple of images I have tried. The biggest improvement I am seeing is the noise control with default setting, which keeps CO one step ahead of the already improved ON1 20. Speaking of the latter, I have become quite proficient with the ON1 workflow during the CO - K1 II hiatus, and now I find I am missing on CO the ability to flip on and off the tool to quickly evaluate the effects of a change. ON1 also has a before - after general toggle, which on CO I can only achieve by cloning the original image. I wonder why CO hasn't adopted this very useful feature, as it seems like a low hanging fruit?

12-04-2019, 12:47 PM	#9
manishved Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: N. Calif Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 3,652	Not sure if I will ever use the PEF format over DNG.

12-04-2019, 12:52 PM - 1 Like	#10
iheiramo Unoriginal Poster Join Date: Nov 2016 Location: Espoo Photos: Albums Posts: 3,182	Originally posted by mirocal I find I am missing on CO the ability to flip on and off the tool to quickly evaluate the effects of a change. If I understand correctly CO has that. Press alt + keep left mouse button pressed on that backspace arrow on the tool box and you see the picture with that tool on default.

12-04-2019, 01:13 PM - 1 Like	#11
morenjavi Pentaxian Join Date: Jul 2016 Posts: 590	Originally posted by Class A What's New in Capture One Pro 20? The most significant upgrade for me is the new HDR tool. I feel that I have a lot of control ever details in shadows, higlights or image contrast. I love the effect of the black control slider, and I couldn't find how to do just exactly the same with the 12 version. But there are not enough improvements for me, I'll wait until the next version or more. Also, I spent all of my money in new lights . Thanks for sharing.

12-04-2019, 08:34 PM	#13
PDL Pentaxian Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: PNW USA Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,128	Originally posted by rawr Yes, in LR it is easy and very quick, using just one press on the "" key, to toggle your defaults/adjusted view of the current image. C1 lacks this one-key keyboard toggle. But at least now in C1 (since v12, actually) C1 can automatically move to the next image once you set a rating on an image. This was a simple culling speed-booster that LR had but C1 always lacked. You might be able to set the Alt-Reset to a keyboard shortcut - I haven't tried that yet. I updated my installation today and the first thing I noticed is that when I open a catalogue for the second time - it loads files quicker then v12. There are a few things I would like to see (not going to beat my dead horses here). The ability to see edges of sharpening (LR hold down Alt or Ctrl or shift or something), see the effect of highlight/shadow when moving the sliders (LR hold down Alt or Ctrl or shift or something) and a quicker way to switch between grid view. Pretty minor stuff but it would be nice. Now, If we can get them to work on Pixel-Shifted images - now that would be cool.

12-04-2019, 11:22 PM	#14
iheiramo Unoriginal Poster Join Date: Nov 2016 Location: Espoo Photos: Albums Posts: 3,182	Originally posted by PDL a quicker way to switch between grid view. You mean the one that goes on and off with CTRL+G or some other grid?

12-05-2019, 01:33 AM	#15
PDL Pentaxian Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: PNW USA Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,128	Originally posted by iheiramo You mean the one that goes on and off with CTRL+G or some other grid? Not quite. LR has the ability of change between various grids when in Crop mode by a keyboard and cycle through grids "O" and some grid orientations (think Fibonacci spiral) sift "O". Some of us have been on Phase One's case to provide a native solution, rather than the method used in v12 and v20.