[BruceBanner]

I occasionally get the odd email from them regarding updates bla bla bla....

I would put myself in the above average PP user, I use LR and PS, layers in PS, Frequency Separation techniques etc, bla bla bla...

Just wondered if any semi advanced PP users who shoot Pentax use SILKYPIX and have any good things to say about it?

That's all!


TIA

BB

[pschlute]

Just wondered if any semi advanced PP users who shoot Pentax use SILKYPIX and have any good things to say about it?

I have used Silkypix for 10 years. I currently use SIlkypix DSPro 7.

A very deep raw converter that has more controls than you will ever need. The Japanese-English description of some of the tools may be a bit quirky.

The way you can apply WB (or indeed any setting) from one raw file to a whole load of others through the copy/paste function is genius. Batch processing 20 or more raw files into jpeg or 16 bit TIFFS is as easy as pie.

I use LR/PS too but won't give up on my favourite converter.

[veato]

No. But that's because I can't find my original installation media!

[BruceBanner]

I have used Silkypix for 10 years. I currently use SIlkypix DSPro 7.

A very deep raw converter that has more controls than you will ever need. The Japanese-English description of some of the tools may be a bit quirky.

The way you can apply WB (or indeed any setting) from one raw file to a whole load of others through the copy/paste function is genius. Batch processing 20 or more raw files into jpeg or 16 bit TIFFS is as easy as pie.

I use LR/PS too but won't give up on my favourite converter.

That's what I use LR mainly for, mass batch editing/syncing. Good to know Silky can do this too. I'll check it out again.

One of the things I'm curious about is the pixelshift handling and Custom Image settings if carried across from RAW? I'm aware that RawTherapee does a better job than Silky for pixelshifting, I have in the past compared and tested and confirmed myself, but... I could handle a little less quality if I could apply the motion correction and still stay within the same program for a heap of other tweaks, lens profiling perhaps, or even changing from Landscape to Reverse Film if it supported it. With LR we only get 5 Camera Matching profiles from RAW...

[Robin]

Nope... it crashed on me once or twice, which was enough motivation to buy Lightroom 6

[ogunturkay]

Silkypix and PENTAX Digital Camera Utility (DCU) both developed by Ichikawa Soft Laboratory Co.,Ltd.

DCU is PENTAX’s very own PP solution and has all abilities and knowledge such as company’s color science etc. (So it means Ichikawa has all of those data.)

DCU works like LR in somehow and it makes it kind of slow especially on browser mode. (Better to switch it to laboratory mode. I mean if you have TBs of photo archive.)

LR is quite popular but it kills the color characteristics of PENTAX on RAWs. When it adds photos to its catalog, removes “embed color profile” from files. So you get well-cataloged “muted RAW” files at the end. (That’s why quite a many people thinks “Camera brand doesn’t really matter actually; because RAW is RAW and suppose to be the same at the end; you will fix on PP anyway...”. Big mistake.)

(You can see the difference with an another software called “Fast Picture Viewer”. Just open an already cataloged file by LR and another from directly memory card. So you will see the difference, what do you lose actually by using LR. I could show this with printscreen shots but I never install LR on my system.)

Silkypix keeps all adjustments on tiny xml files for each photo as separate files. So doesn’t take some GBs on HDD/SSD like others does.

Silkypix doesn’t support “Pixel Shift Resolution”. DCU is the best option to handle those files. Also DCU can export PEFs to DNG.

LR has some “good” stuff like one-click auto CA/purple fringing remove etc. but every easy solution comes with the price. (You never get 100% best result.) You can make it better on Silkypix or on PS later.

About DR... There is nothing can compete with the Silkypix...

Best!

[rubenr]

I remember I tried out with the one that came with my K-x (or maybe my k-5) but no... there wasn't enough love

[Madaboutpix]

DCU remains installed to my hard drive just in case I want to access full EXIFs or want support for features like in-camera HDR or Pixel-shift resolution, but I've never got over their clunky 1990s-look user interface and do almost all my post processing in DxO PhotoLab and in the Nik Collection.

That said, DCU strikes me as pretty capable, and it's probably also due to lack of time that I've never dived deeper into it. I certainly appreciate that Ricoh bothers to put a full-blown native RAW processing solution in the box.

[ecostigny]

I dabbled with it briefly, but then I got my hands on a student discount of Photoshop Extended and went with that instead.

[MossyRocks]

I'm aware that RawTherapee does a better job than Silky for pixelshifting

Interesting, now if I only had a camera that supported pixelshift.

[Walkingwolf]

Silkypix and PENTAX Digital Camera Utility (DCU) developed by Ichikawa Soft Laboratory Co.,Ltd.

DCU is PENTAX’s very own PP solution and has all abilities and knowledge such as company’s color science etc. (So it means Ichikawa has all of those data.)

DCU works like LR in somehow and it makes it kind of slow especially on browser mode. (Better to switch it to laboratory mode. I mean if you have TBs of photo archive.)

LR is quite popular but it kills the color characteristics of PENTAX on RAWs. When it adds photos to its catalog, removes “embed color profile” from files. So you get well-cataloged “muted RAW” files at the end. (That’s why quite a many people things “Camera brand doesn’t really matter actually; because RAW is RAW and suppose to be the same at the end; you will fix on PP anyway...”. Big mistake.)

(You can see the difference with an another software called “Fast Picture Viewer”. Just open an already cataloged file by LR and another from directly memory card. So you will see the difference, what do you lose actually by using LR. I could show this with printscreen shots but I never install LR on my system.)

Silkypix keeps all adjustments on tiny xml files for each photo as separate files. So doesn’t take some GBs on HDD/SSD like others does.

Silkypix doesn’t support “Pixel Shift Resolution”. DCU is the best option to handle those files. Also DCU can export PEFs to DNG.

LR has some “good” stuff like one-click auto CA/purple fringing remove etc. but every easy solution comes with the price. (You never get 100% best result.) You can make it better on Silkypix or on PS later.

About DR... There is nothing can compete with the Silkypix...

Best!

Thanks for this explanation. You gave me a good overview and understanding.

[parinya-ekparinya]

I don't own Silkypix, but I sometimes use DCU to extract raw files from an in-camera HDR shot. Is that count?

[BruceBanner]

Nope... it crashed on me once or twice, which was enough motivation to buy Lightroom 6

DCU5 has crashed multiple times, I haven't tried SP for years tho...

Silkypix and PENTAX Digital Camera Utility (DCU) both developed by Ichikawa Soft Laboratory Co.,Ltd.

DCU is PENTAX’s very own PP solution and has all abilities and knowledge such as company’s color science etc. (So it means Ichikawa has all of those data.)

DCU works like LR in somehow and it makes it kind of slow especially on browser mode. (Better to switch it to laboratory mode. I mean if you have TBs of photo archive.)

LR is quite popular but it kills the color characteristics of PENTAX on RAWs. When it adds photos to its catalog, removes “embed color profile” from files. So you get well-cataloged “muted RAW” files at the end. (That’s why quite a many people thinks “Camera brand doesn’t really matter actually; because RAW is RAW and suppose to be the same at the end; you will fix on PP anyway...”. Big mistake.)

(You can see the difference with an another software called “Fast Picture Viewer”. Just open an already cataloged file by LR and another from directly memory card. So you will see the difference, what do you lose actually by using LR. I could show this with printscreen shots but I never install LR on my system.)

Silkypix keeps all adjustments on tiny xml files for each photo as separate files. So doesn’t take some GBs on HDD/SSD like others does.

Silkypix doesn’t support “Pixel Shift Resolution”. DCU is the best option to handle those files. Also DCU can export PEFs to DNG.

LR has some “good” stuff like one-click auto CA/purple fringing remove etc. but every easy solution comes with the price. (You never get 100% best result.) You can make it better on Silkypix or on PS later.

About DR... There is nothing can compete with the Silkypix...

Best!

Hmm... I think your information might be a little out of date.

About LR. With the K-1 at least, importing a RAW dng shot from the K-1 will offer you 5 camera matching profiles, Portrait, Landscape, Bright, Natural and Vibrant (I think). The other Custom Image profiles on the camera (such as mono and Film Reversal) are not accessible. The default for RAW files is for LR to apply Adobe Colour as the colour profile, and its actually quite nice, far from muted anyway, but you can change that anyway as I mention above.

Fast Picture Viewer (or Faststone Image Viewer) show a Jpg preview of the RAW file, I'm not sure exactly what you're saying here and how this is relevant to SP?

I thought SP did support pixelshift for motion correction? DCU is not the best option for those files, numerous sites have proven that RawTherapee is better for handling Pixelshifted files, and my own findings confirm that to be true.

DR? You mean Dynamic Range? Are you suggesting you can get even greater shadow and highlight recovery from SP than LR?

Thanks.

[ogunturkay]

Hmm... I think your information might be a little out of date.



About LR. With the K-1 at least, importing a RAW dng shot from the K-1 will offer you 5 camera matching profiles, Portrait, Landscape, Bright, Natural and Vibrant (I think). The other Custom Image profiles on the camera (such as mono and Film Reversal) are not accessible. The default for RAW files is for LR to apply Adobe Colour as the colour profile, and its actually quite nice, far from muted anyway, but you can change that anyway as I mention above.

Can you check your imported RAW files with another "viewer" after importing to LR. I am not talking about opening the file again in LR. I point that LR "removes 'embed' color profile". Of course if you open it in LR again you can get/apply those its 5 profile presets.

Fast Picture Viewer (or Faststone Image Viewer) show a Jpg preview of the RAW file, I'm not sure exactly what you're saying here and how this is relevant to SP?

The relation is that checking the "embed color profile". Is it still embed or not after LR; as I mentioned above. Not talking about JPG preview. (It doesn't show that either.) ICC profile.

Here you can see the screenshot of "FastPictureViewer" preview:



and here is another sc of the same file after LR with the same software:





I thought SP did support pixelshift for motion correction? DCU is not the best option for those files, numerous sites have proven that RawTherapee is better for handling Pixelshifted files, and my own findings confirm that to be true.

No it did not. Did those numerous sites complain about some strange pixelation issue?

DR? You mean Dynamic Range? Are you suggesting you can get even greater shadow and highlight recovery from SP than LR?

Yes I mean Dynamic Range. SP is better.

Thanks.

Cheers

[BruceBanner]

Hmm... I think your information might be a little out of date.



About LR. With the K-1 at least, importing a RAW dng shot from the K-1 will offer you 5 camera matching profiles, Portrait, Landscape, Bright, Natural and Vibrant (I think). The other Custom Image profiles on the camera (such as mono and Film Reversal) are not accessible. The default for RAW files is for LR to apply Adobe Colour as the colour profile, and its actually quite nice, far from muted anyway, but you can change that anyway as I mention above.

Can you check your imported RAW files with another "viewer" after importing to LR. I am not talking about opening the file again in LR. I point that LR "removes 'embed' color profile". Of course if you open it in LR again you can get/apply those its 5 profile presets.

Fast Picture Viewer (or Faststone Image Viewer) show a Jpg preview of the RAW file, I'm not sure exactly what you're saying here and how this is relevant to SP?

The relation is that checking the "embed color profile". Is it still embed or not after LR; as I mentioned above. Not talking about JPG preview. (It doesn't show that either.) ICC profile.

Here you can see the screenshot of "FastPictureViewer" preview:



and here is another sc of the same file after LR with the same software:





I thought SP did support pixelshift for motion correction? DCU is not the best option for those files, numerous sites have proven that RawTherapee is better for handling Pixelshifted files, and my own findings confirm that to be true.

No it did not. Did those numerous sites complain about some strange pixelation issue?

DR? You mean Dynamic Range? Are you suggesting you can get even greater shadow and highlight recovery from SP than LR?

Yes I mean Dynamic Range. SP is better.

Thanks.

Cheers

Ok, we might have to go back a bit here and start at the beginning as I'm a little confused over certain things.

First thing, why are we talking about FastPictureViewer at all, its totally separate from LR and SP, its simply an Image viewer software, the same as Faststone Image viewer, handy tool to quickly see RAW files usually my showing the Jpg Preview of the RAW files. Either way, why is this at all relevant in a discussion about LR and SP? When we decide to shoot RAW the intention is to edit the file in a proper RAW developer typically, is it not? Otherwise just shoot jpg and have everything embedded in the file properly at the time of the shot with whatever camera features you decide to turn on.

When importing an image (DNG) in LR for the first time, it is using Adobe Colour as its profile, you can use a pull down menu and change that to being a Camera Matching profile such as Natural, Portrait etc. You can synchronise that change across a batch of DNGs if you like. You may even be able to set LR to use a camera matching profile as standard upon all imports, I think that is an option but I don't bother with it.

I did want to know if SP can import the DNG file from the camera and apply more colour profiles from the camera than the typical five that LR can do, such as Mono, Film Reversal etc that the camera has. That would be good to know.

It sounds like your argument is that natively SP applies a better colour profile to the RAW image than what LR applies, however what version of LR are you using? Typically LR changes these things on updates, and seeing as you have about 10-20 different colour profiles to choose from and are synchronisable across a large batch I don't really see this as being a strong win for SP.

As I said before, importing a raw DNG file into RawTherapee and that software will too render the RAW (on default) differently to LR, it is even flatter and duller, but again I believe these things are changeable in RT, I have certainly done a few edits within RT to get something pleasing, it really doesn't overly stress me if the default render of the RAW is dull or lifeless, it is after all a just a canvas.

The issue with pixelshift is long and convoluted. Essentially it comes down to understanding that having the option switched on in the first place is only the beginning of fully taking advantage of the feature, there are additional steps that you should familiarise yourself with to get the best advantage of the tool. Motion Correction is often required, the recommendation is to turn it OFF in camera and let RT do the correction for you, it's typically at this stage the highest praise comes to RT with cleaner tidy ups being performed with fewer artefacts remaining. However even the motion correction in RT is quite advanced allowing a great deal of control over how its applied by the user. Lastly, a major advantage of Pixelshift is taking the Sharpness slider higher than what is normally possible with far less noise and IQ degradation than typically experienced. Usually the recommended flow is;

1) Take picture with pixelshift, motion off.
2) Import RAW file to RT and use its motion correction to achieve a cleaner image with fewer artefacts
3) Stress the file further than what non pixelshift files are deemed acceptable.

There are a lot of examples and articles on the internet showing DCU vs RT for pixelshift treatment, a google search should give you some further reading.

Interesting to hear you think a certain RAW developer handles the DR better than another. I was under the impression the sensor and camera gives the DR, it's not something that software can differ in exploiting.