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05-24-2020, 09:33 AM   #16
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QuoteOriginally posted by fuzzyphotos Quote
It looks like it was my "shadow:" luma mask that causes the ghosting.
You may just have to trigger a new mask calculation; just bring up the mask dialogue again and make a small change (which you can immediately nullify).

Even a parametric luminosity mask will not automatically update if the image changes (due to a healing brush change, for instance).

05-24-2020, 04:24 PM   #17
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Class A, Thanks for the tip, however it didn't fix the issue. So far the only way I can not have the ghosting is to make sure the heal layer(s) go down first. This isn't a huge deal but it is a pain when you notice something you'd like to fix after adding and adjusting a luma mask.

I am pretty new to this stuff, just messing around a little here and there trying to learn. What I did to try your suggestion was create a luma layer mask (first mask), basically just raising the shadows a little and pushing the black down to keep the blacks dark. Then I created a heal layer, just getting rid of some power poles on the crest of a hill, I get a shadow where the poles were. Then I adjusted the shadow slider in the HDR tool, FWIW taking back to zero gets rid of the shadow. I then put the shadow slider back to almost where it was, no difference in the ghosting. I then changed the parameter of the mask it self, adjusting the luminosity range. I still got the ghosting,


Can you try a luma layer mask and heal layer to see if you have the same result. Luma first then a heal layer? For what its worth I'm running Windows 10 for better or worse.


I still haven't heard from C1 on my support case but I'll bet they are pretty busy right now,

Thanks

Tim
05-26-2020, 06:23 PM   #18
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QuoteOriginally posted by fuzzyphotos Quote
Oh, no if you click on a layer, you still have to choose the correct brush.
"Oh, no", exactly.

Please upvote my feature request, if you also think that users shouldn't do work the software could trivially accomplish.

QuoteOriginally posted by fuzzyphotos Quote
Testing this out, looks like it moves to the last created layer for the type brush you selected.
No, it always chooses the topmost layer that fits the brush type you have selected.

This strategy will only work for a minimal number of layers, hence we need a more efficient way to select a layer and start brushing in it. The old system was efficient in that regard.
05-26-2020, 06:30 PM   #19
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Sadly, there are more bad news.

Previously, layers supported a lot of common functionality and the brush had the same behaviour in all layer types.

Now auto-masking is only supported in adjustment layers. Mask refining and mask feathering does not work in healing/cloning layers either (anymore).

Finally, copying masks between layers of different types is not possible anymore.

05-26-2020, 06:31 PM   #20
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QuoteOriginally posted by fuzzyphotos Quote
Can you try a luma layer mask and heal layer to see if you have the same result. Luma first then a heal layer?
I'll try it later today.
05-27-2020, 03:35 AM   #21
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I couldn't find any obvious problem. Perhaps I'm not using an image that provokes the problem?
N.B., I'm using a Windows machine as well.

Please feel free to give more precise instructions on how to provoke the issue.
05-27-2020, 06:55 AM   #22
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Thanks for trying, generally the problem appears when healing a dark item over a light background or a light item over a dark background. The image I have been experimenting on is dark storm clouds with light power poles in the foreground. They heal out perfectly when there in no luma mask active. It just occurred to me to try rasterizing that mask and see what happens. It’s just a pain, I’ll post a picture when on my pc later.

05-27-2020, 01:39 PM   #23
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Here's the image, it's nothing special I was just working with the clone and heal tools. the power polls on the top of the hill are what I am taking out. if you look to the left of the tree you can see a shadow and also to the right of the road you can see a shadow. I didn't take the rest out so you could see what I was getting rid of. the funny thing is, I mistakenly opened the JPG version of this file and I did not have this problem. created the luma mask followed by the heal mask and no shadows on the JPG image. I just happened to shoot Raw+ on that trip.

I did try rasterizing the mask as well but that made no difference.

Tim
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05-28-2020, 06:50 AM   #24
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@fuzzyphotos

I can confirm the bug.

If there is a luma mask first and then a healing layer on top of it, the luma mask unduly influences the healing (creates a tonal change when there shouldn't be one).
If the healing layer comes first and then a luma mask is added, no such undue influence occurs.

Do you want me to report the bug to Capture One?
05-28-2020, 04:11 PM - 1 Like   #25
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I have a case with them about this, I sent the first images when I opened the case. I sent this image to them yesterday explaining the issue. If you would like to report the bug, please go ahead. Maybe if there are more reports it will gain traction.

Thanks for looking at this, at lest I am not crazy.

Tim
06-01-2020, 02:37 PM - 1 Like   #26
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This has been officially recognized as a bug by C1. No estimated time of fix.
06-04-2020, 11:09 AM   #27
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Prominent Capture One "victim"

The new (worse) brush/layer selection design in Capture One Pro has just produced a very prominent "victim".

At the 54:46 mark of the recent "Capture One 20 Live: Talks | Edit with Joe McNally" webinar, legendary photographer Joe McNally starts creating an adjustment layer.
Just when he is about to brush on it, with the "healing brush" still active, Capture One's David Grover has to remind him to switch to the adjustment brush first.

https://youtu.be/cOVpzasdwDk?t=3286

This intervention would not have been necessary in the old (better) brush/layer selection system, in which just one brush type existed that worked uniformly on all layer types.

If you agree with me that what Joe was about to do -- keep on brushing, just on a different layer -- was intuitive and should have worked without further action, please upvote my feature request.

P.S.: Joe praises how "intuitive" C1 is, but note that he is referring to the combined "create layer & select brush" functionality. I don't argue against such a feature. It should just be possible to continue to use one universal brush tool on all layer kinds.
06-06-2020, 02:13 PM   #28
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@fuzzyphotos

Here is a workaround for your issue:

The trick is to both reorder the layer and recalculate the mask. I only tried the latter.

In my view, they should still address the issue but perhaps the described technique can tide you over until a real fix is available.
06-06-2020, 06:11 PM   #29
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@Class A, Thank you for the info, I too had tried reordering the masks but had not recalculated the luma mask.This works for now, hopefully they will place more importance on it since David had the problem as well.


Tim
06-18-2020, 07:22 AM   #30
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@fuzzyphotos

It might be the case that your prayers have been heard. The just released version 13.1.1 announced the following bug fix:
"Fixed an issue where Luma Range masks would not include Heal and Clone Layers when recalculating the range."
I haven't tested it because I'm still not prepared to update.

They made a major improvement by implementing an auto-brush selection but missed to fully address all usability issues that were introduced with the "multi-brush design". I've created a new feature request that asks for one of two ways to fix the remaining problem.
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