[Class A]

The best feature in the new Capture One Pro upgrade (free for existing license owners or subscribers) is that heal/clone layers can now feature an unlimited number of source points:

You Tube

You Tube

However, not all is well. Unfortunately, a new brush access system was introduced as well.

Previously, one used one universal brush (keyboard shortcut "B") that did the right thing, depending on the type of the layer that was selected.

Now there are are three different type of brushes: Adjustment ("B"), Healing ("Q"), and Cloning ("S").

While it is cool that one can just select one of these and start drawing -- a corresponding layer of the right type will either be created or automatically selected -- there are also two serious downsides:

First, previously one could assign the same key to both universal brush and the Eraser brush with the only difference being a modifier key such as "Alt" or "Option" for the Eraser brush shortcut. This made it very simple to switch back and forth between positive brushing (one of the none-erasing types) and negative brushing (Eraser brush).

Now one has to choose "E" for erasing and then one of "B", "Q" or "S" to go back to positive brushing.
This is way less efficient.

Second, now, when revisiting a layer to tweak its mask, one has to manually select the right brush type after having selected the layer. If one has the wrong brush type activated, Capture One will jump away from the targeted layer to the topmost layer that is of the type that fits the currently selected brush.

Selecting the brush first does not help, as now, whenever one changes the brush type, an automatic layer selection will take place and one then has to subsequently select the target layer. With a bit of tough luck the automatically selected layer and the target layer won't both fit into the layer list panel so one possibly doesn't see the layer that has been automatically selected.

Either way, what once was a simple one-step selection now needs two steps (if a change of layer type is involved).

All the above downsides would be very easy to fix by simply bringing back a universal brush type again.
This (additional) brush would have the correct (adjusting, healing, cloning) behaviour depending on the type of the currently selected layer.
With such a universal brush the above multi-step layer tweaking would become a simple step action again, and one could use one shortcut key for brushing and erasing again, with erasing just requiring a modifier to be pressed when selecting the brush.

If you support the resurrection of the current "universal" brush behaviour (which could perfectly coexist with the new design), please consider upvoting my respective feature request.

N.B., the other changes are a new introduction tour for beginners, improved importing of Lightroom catalogues, a special (cheaper) version for Nikon cameras, and a new "before/after" tool (which I find pointless in its current form, but at least it doesn't hurt any existing functionality like the new brush design does).

---

Last edited by Class A; 05-19-2020 at 03:11 AM.

[fuzzyphotos]

I can’t get the new clone tool to clone out a branch on the edge of a picture. Pro 13.0 worked like a charm. This not so much. It’s just a twig, should be pretty easy. Seems like it’s hard coading the twig area And that doesn’t change when moving the source point. Then also the exposure doesn’t work as well either. I opened a support case this afternoon but it feels like the clone/heal was not ready for prime time. I’ve attached the cropped area of the twig. It runs up to the cloud in the background . When I mask it the area over the twig becomes cloud no matter where the source point is the laced

[Class A]

I can’t get the new clone tool to clone out a branch on the edge of a picture.

Are you using "cloning" or "healing"?

N.B., as a workaround, you may try to remove the twig in two steps:

1. address the area where the twig overlaps with the cloud.
2. address the rest of the twig.

I'm not saying that such workarounds should be necessary, just pointing out a potential solution.

FWIW, I haven't tried the new healing yet beyond simple tests, because I'm too upset about the steps they've made backwards with the brush selection design. I may not even upgrade on my main machine. Remains to be seen whether a soon to arrive controller can mitigate the problems they've created.

There was and is no reason to make the lives of users like me harder, yet here were are.
I hope they'll get more feedback from others and come to the realisation that adding a universal brush back again is a win-win move.

[acoufap]

I can’t get the new clone tool to clone out a branch on the edge of a picture. Pro 13.0 worked like a charm. This not so much. It’s just a twig, should be pretty easy. Seems like it’s hard coading the twig area And that doesn’t change when moving the source point. Then also the exposure doesn’t work as well either. I opened a support case this afternoon but it feels like the clone/heal was not ready for prime time. I’ve attached the cropped area of the twig. It runs up to the cloud in the background . When I mask it the area over the twig becomes cloud no matter where the source point is the laced

Did you check the parameters Size, Hardness, Opacity and Flow (you get the context panel using the control key (Mac)?

[fuzzyphotos]

I’ve tried all the usual Hardness and brush size. I tried both clone and heal, this is heal, clone Was the same. Another very annoying thing is that the auto select point chooses an area outside the crop selection so when it doesn’t match you have to undo the crop, find the point adjust as needed then redo the crop, I’d love to go back to the previous version, the new clone heal was the only reason I upgraded. Hopefully they will make a quick change. I can’t imagine anyone is happy as it is.

On windows I think it’s a right click to bring up the brush settings, not at my pc now to check. I’ve had really good luck cloning in the past but the new layer per clone was a pain. Thought this solved that but it’s much more work now.

[fuzzyphotos]

I'm beating a dead horse here, but using a mouse to make adjustments, either sliders or clone selections it doesn't seem to keep the left click locked so I get no adjustment, a skip in adjustment, or multiple clone points/mask.

Is my mouse going bad or did they set this up with more attention to using a controller for adjustments? Any one else seeing these problems? I have no mouse problems with other programs.


Maybe I should re-download and try again.

[fuzzyphotos]

Ok. I think I figured out some of the problem, if you have a luma mask set and try to heal I get the problem above. It is a problem until I turn off the luminosity mask then the heal works as it should. If I turn on the mask the problem returns. I think I saw this on the capture one forum so will go check it out. I'll also add it to my case that I have opened. Still need to figure out why sometimes when I try to move the clone from point to a better match it doesn't move the point but creates another mask.


I'll have more posts here in this one thread than I've done all year.

Tim

[Class A]

Good on you for figuring out what caused the bad healing behaviour.

Strange that the healing isn't dealt with before any adjustments are taking place.

I take it the ordering of layers makes no difference, or does it?

[sbh]

I'm still on 11 so I haven't tried the new features. Does that mean that now there are 3 different types fo layers AND 3 different types of brushes? Or is it now 1 type of layer and 3 brushes?

[fuzzyphotos]

There are 3 layer types, clone, heal, and adjust. Then you select the brush to go with it. However, if you select the clone or heal brush it will create the correct layer, but then as Class a said, you have to name the layer after the fact.

I believe this is stated correctly as I’m not at my pc this morning.

[fuzzyphotos]

A quick test between grand-kids this afternoon, it looks like if the heal is done first it works as expected. I created a heal layer (same photo as earlier but not one posted above) healed some telephone poles out and it worked fine, I added highlight and shadow luma layers then another heal layer and the problem returned on the top heal layer, The heal layer on the bottom worked as expected.

[sbh]

There are 3 layer types, clone, heal, and adjust. Then you select the brush to go with it. However, if you select the clone or heal brush it will create the correct layer, but then as Class a said, you have to name the layer after the fact.

I believe this is stated correctly as I’m not at my pc this morning.

Interesting. If you click on one layer, does it not switch to the corresponding brush automatically? I'd expect so. Unless you can mix Healing and Edits and Cloning on one single layer.

Regarding naming, can't you just hit the Enter key and type away? That's how I'm used to name new layers...

[fuzzyphotos]

I just tested the press enter to name the layer whit layer created by using the brush. That didn't work. I selected the heal brush, started to draw a mask on the background (no other layers present) and CO created a heal layer, After that I pressed enter but it did not open up the name of the layer to edit it. Still have to click on the layer to name it. What I was doing before was right clicking on the + to add a layer then naming it before actually doing any masking. I'm certainly no expert and can use any tips to improve my editing abilities. For what its worth the brushes do automatically create a layer of the intended type. However, it only auto creates one instance of each layer type automatically. So the heal layer I created first, then an adjustment layer, then I switched back to the heal brush and it switched back to the first heal layer, then the adjustment brush went back to the previously created adjustment layer. Creating a radial or linear radiant mask automatically takes you to the original adjustment layer. If there are more than one heal, clone, or adjustment layer created then its a matter of selecting the layer you want to adjust.I don't know if this is helpful to anyone, just putting my findings here.

Oh, no if you click on a layer, you still have to choose the correct brush. So, if I'm in a clone layer and choose the adjustment brush, it switched to the adjustment layer automatically, funny thing is it switched to adjustment layer 2. Testing this out, looks like it moves to the last created layer for the type brush you selected.

[fuzzyphotos]

This evening I tested my mouse against the touch pad on my laptop. The touch pad works as it should, I guess my mouse is going bad. Also, did you know you can lock the source point for a heal and use that point for multiple corrections? Just click on the source point and turn that circle outline orange, then the auto selection is disabled. Not that this works for much but i found that out tonight.

I'll get a new mouse and see if that solves the problem of dropping the source point while trying to move it. I didn't have that problem with the last version so maybe this is more sensitive to variation with my mouse.

[fuzzyphotos]

New mouse solved the moving the selected heal point. I no longer have a problem moving the selection around. Something I did notice today, going back to the luminosity masks and the heal mask. It looks like it was my "shadow:" luma mask that causes the ghosting. When I move the opacity slider to zero the ghosting goes away on the shadow mask, it makes no difference on the highlight mask (on this image).

Just seems odd my mouse went bad on the upgrade, likely it was bad before but the new tool is more sensitive to "chatter" from the mouse.


Thanks for listening as I blunder thru this new tool.