Lightroom or Photoshop?

roelof · 06-22-2009, 04:48 AM

I am a novice, and started out uring LR simply because it was cheaper than full PS. At the time I thought it was a subset of PS filters geared towards raw processing (similar to elements). I soon found out differently, sadly there is not much integration between the two.

I like the interface of LR a lot better, IMHO it fits closer to the workflow. But some basic stuff is missing, so you still need PS

Right now I shoot in PEF, import in LR as a DNG. I do pre-selections in LR, make subsets and selections etc. I do own PS4 by now, but always call it from within LR using the 'Open as Smart Object in Photoshop' after doing the basic wb corrections etc in LR. If you do it that way, the result will be saved inside the collection you are working in next to the original raw file. It makes it much easier to keep track. The final export to jpg or printing is done from LR.

My ideal would be to be able to add my personal selection of PS modules/filters to the LR interface to get a unified workflow. But that is probably a long way off.

ozlizard · 06-22-2009, 10:09 PM

Well after playing around with LR 2 for a while and looking at the tutorials it's really quite amazing what can be produced...and with ease and speed AND it keeps a record of all the adjustments so you can go back later and change things...it's worth it just for that! The Graduated Adjustment tool is fantastic for recovering blown out skies. (Yeah I know probably shouldn't have them anyway!) Will definately be getting it I would hardly have to use PS now.

brecklundin · 06-23-2009, 02:06 AM

I just finally upgraded to LR2.3 from LR1.4 and WOW what a difference. I have PS3 Extended (who knew owning the Extended version would turn out to be potenitally useful...as in video from the K-7!!! weeeee).

But given the vast improvements in how v2.x works I thought I would mention it in case some folks are still on v1.4...if you are get the upgrade. I bought, downloaded and installed it in under 15mins. One thing to know if you do upgrade, v1.4 is not uninstalled. This caused me no end of confusion because I just assumed the previous version would just be replaced...ummm...no, so I was trying to install the version of a SmugMug LR2 plugin and one time I could get to the settings for it then the next time I opened LR the menu to open the Plug-in manager was not there...I was, to say the least, kinda confused...then I looked closely at the icons, I have on on my XP Quick Launch bar and one on the desktop...they were freaking different and the dim blub lit up...both versions were installed still and each icon pointed to a different version...

sigh...but I am feeling much better now!! hahaha...

I will say, it sure seems to me that unless I have some really special editing needs, I do not see myself using PS very often now. Except maybe to play with the video editing side of PS CS3 Extended. Though I LOVE my Fractalius plugin by Redfield for PS...now THAT is fun!!

regken · 06-23-2009, 08:36 PM

What Jim said to a tee.

photog · 06-26-2009, 08:55 PM

Jim Royal
as usual you talk good sense.
But re: "HDR then Lightroom's tools will fall short"
Have you tried the Photomatix plugin in LR2?
Ron McDermott

ozlizard · 06-29-2009, 11:35 PM

My first real experiment with LR. Have been messing around with Photomatix etc as well...all good fun...it's amazing what you can do!

Jim Royal · 06-30-2009, 09:14 AM

Originally posted by photog

Jim Royal
as usual you talk good sense.
But re: "HDR then Lightroom's tools will fall short"
Have you tried the Photomatix plugin in LR2?
Ron McDermott

Thanks very much, Ron.

I had not tried the Photomax plugin -- I will check it out.

saostuma · 06-30-2009, 09:53 AM

What opinion the honorable forum members have of Apple's Aperture? I will be looking into both LR and Aperture in the near future, but any opinions will be warmly accepted.

From what I've read in the internets, Apple's raw support for new cameras is not so quick (or good?) as with Adobe's offerings. I'm waiting for the arrival of my K-7, which I shall be using to shoot raw -> I'll try to master a new faster workflow with images at the same time

photog · 06-30-2009, 10:26 PM

saostuma you are correct in saying that Adobe gives better support for new cameras. They are even supporting the new K7D which is not even released to the public!
LR2 (now .4) is truly excellent software and can handle 90% or more of your photo work from download to print or post to the WEB. It has changed my life!
Ron McDermott

ozlizard · 07-21-2009, 06:31 PM

Quote:

LR2 (now .4) is truly excellent software and can handle 90% or more of your photo work from download to print or post to the WEB. It has changed my l

I totally agree Ron, LR has completely changed the way I PP my photos and now even when I am capturing the image I am already thinking ahead to how I might tweak it in LR. It is also brilliant at file handling and organizing..just about does it all for me!

photog · 07-22-2009, 12:13 AM

ozlizard, have you used LR to print your images? I found the interface aq little daunting but once I understood the metaphor that it uses - a "no-brainer".
Ron McDermott

ozlizard · 07-22-2009, 01:27 AM

ozlizard, have you used LR to print your images? I found the interface aq little daunting but once I understood the metaphor that it uses - a "no-brainer
No Ron I havn't. I don't have photo printer as yet so get them done by a local guy who uses an A2 Epson. Bit you are right onve you look into LR and a feel for how it works everything gets a whole lot easier. One thing I can't work out is where does LR keep the images that you have edited and made into a catalogue? I want to back them up but can't find them.

Alfisti · 07-22-2009, 07:40 AM

Originally posted by ozlizard

! The Graduated Adjustment tool is fantastic for recovering blown out skies. (Yeah I know probably shouldn't have them anyway!)

Just pull the blue luminance down and bang, great skies.

What LR is missing ias distortion correction and a decent sharpening tool. Why on god's green farking earth they only have "low/med/high" settings for exporting is beyond belief.

photog · 07-23-2009, 12:28 AM

Ozlizard "I can't work out is where does LR keep the images that you have edited and made into a catalogue? "
LR is really a database with all of the corrections etc that you make to the image. They are written to the metadata in the header of the DNG file or the sidecar file if a PEF file. You have the option of simply importing the previews or the image files (they may be on the camera or a SD card) to a location of your choice.
However I use the free DNG converter which allows renaming, compression to lossless DNG which is just a little more than 1/2 the camera file in size. Between 10.3 and 15.5 depending on the amount of detail that governs how much the file can be comprressed.
LR2 is also a great image viewer.
Cheers mate.
Ron McDermott

06-30-2009, 09:53 AM	#23
saostuma New Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Finland Posts: 1	Apple Aperture? What opinion the honorable forum members have of Apple's Aperture? I will be looking into both LR and Aperture in the near future, but any opinions will be warmly accepted. From what I've read in the internets, Apple's raw support for new cameras is not so quick (or good?) as with Adobe's offerings. I'm waiting for the arrival of my K-7, which I shall be using to shoot raw -> I'll try to master a new faster workflow with images at the same time

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06-22-2009, 04:48 AM	#16
roelof Inactive Account Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Leiden, the Netherlands Posts: 26	I am a novice, and started out uring LR simply because it was cheaper than full PS. At the time I thought it was a subset of PS filters geared towards raw processing (similar to elements). I soon found out differently, sadly there is not much integration between the two. I like the interface of LR a lot better, IMHO it fits closer to the workflow. But some basic stuff is missing, so you still need PS Right now I shoot in PEF, import in LR as a DNG. I do pre-selections in LR, make subsets and selections etc. I do own PS4 by now, but always call it from within LR using the 'Open as Smart Object in Photoshop' after doing the basic wb corrections etc in LR. If you do it that way, the result will be saved inside the collection you are working in next to the original raw file. It makes it much easier to keep track. The final export to jpg or printing is done from LR. My ideal would be to be able to add my personal selection of PS modules/filters to the LR interface to get a unified workflow. But that is probably a long way off.

06-22-2009, 10:09 PM	#17
ozlizard Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Bridgetown West Australia Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 903 Original Poster	Well after playing around with LR 2 for a while and looking at the tutorials it's really quite amazing what can be produced...and with ease and speed AND it keeps a record of all the adjustments so you can go back later and change things...it's worth it just for that! The Graduated Adjustment tool is fantastic for recovering blown out skies. (Yeah I know probably shouldn't have them anyway!) Will definately be getting it I would hardly have to use PS now.

06-23-2009, 02:06 AM	#18
brecklundin Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Photos: Albums Posts: 1,674	I just finally upgraded to LR2.3 from LR1.4 and WOW what a difference. I have PS3 Extended (who knew owning the Extended version would turn out to be potenitally useful...as in video from the K-7!!! weeeee). But given the vast improvements in how v2.x works I thought I would mention it in case some folks are still on v1.4...if you are get the upgrade. I bought, downloaded and installed it in under 15mins. One thing to know if you do upgrade, v1.4 is not uninstalled. This caused me no end of confusion because I just assumed the previous version would just be replaced...ummm...no, so I was trying to install the version of a SmugMug LR2 plugin and one time I could get to the settings for it then the next time I opened LR the menu to open the Plug-in manager was not there...I was, to say the least, kinda confused...then I looked closely at the icons, I have on on my XP Quick Launch bar and one on the desktop...they were freaking different and the dim blub lit up...both versions were installed still and each icon pointed to a different version... sigh...but I am feeling much better now!! hahaha... I will say, it sure seems to me that unless I have some really special editing needs, I do not see myself using PS very often now. Except maybe to play with the video editing side of PS CS3 Extended. Though I LOVE my Fractalius plugin by Redfield for PS...now THAT is fun!!

06-23-2009, 08:36 PM	#19
regken Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Bangor, Maine Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,377	What Jim said to a tee.

06-26-2009, 08:55 PM	#20
photog Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Brisbane, Qld, Australia Posts: 165	Jim Royal as usual you talk good sense. But re: "HDR then Lightroom's tools will fall short" Have you tried the Photomatix plugin in LR2? Ron McDermott

06-29-2009, 11:35 PM	#21
ozlizard Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Bridgetown West Australia Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 903 Original Poster	My first real experiment with LR. Have been messing around with Photomatix etc as well...all good fun...it's amazing what you can do!

06-30-2009, 09:14 AM	#22
Jim Royal Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Montreal Photos: Gallery Posts: 179	Originally posted by photog Jim Royal as usual you talk good sense. But re: "HDR then Lightroom's tools will fall short" Have you tried the Photomatix plugin in LR2? Ron McDermott Thanks very much, Ron. I had not tried the Photomax plugin -- I will check it out.

06-30-2009, 10:26 PM	#24
photog Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Brisbane, Qld, Australia Posts: 165	saostuma you are correct in saying that Adobe gives better support for new cameras. They are even supporting the new K7D which is not even released to the public! LR2 (now .4) is truly excellent software and can handle 90% or more of your photo work from download to print or post to the WEB. It has changed my life! Ron McDermott

07-21-2009, 06:31 PM	#25
ozlizard Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Bridgetown West Australia Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 903 Original Poster	Quote: LR2 (now .4) is truly excellent software and can handle 90% or more of your photo work from download to print or post to the WEB. It has changed my l I totally agree Ron, LR has completely changed the way I PP my photos and now even when I am capturing the image I am already thinking ahead to how I might tweak it in LR. It is also brilliant at file handling and organizing..just about does it all for me!

07-22-2009, 12:13 AM	#26
photog Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Brisbane, Qld, Australia Posts: 165	ozlizard, have you used LR to print your images? I found the interface aq little daunting but once I understood the metaphor that it uses - a "no-brainer". Ron McDermott

07-22-2009, 01:27 AM	#27
ozlizard Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Bridgetown West Australia Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 903 Original Poster	ozlizard, have you used LR to print your images? I found the interface aq little daunting but once I understood the metaphor that it uses - a "no-brainer No Ron I havn't. I don't have photo printer as yet so get them done by a local guy who uses an A2 Epson. Bit you are right onve you look into LR and a feel for how it works everything gets a whole lot easier. One thing I can't work out is where does LR keep the images that you have edited and made into a catalogue? I want to back them up but can't find them.

07-22-2009, 07:40 AM	#28
Alfisti Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Toronto (for now) Posts: 1,748	Originally posted by ozlizard ! The Graduated Adjustment tool is fantastic for recovering blown out skies. (Yeah I know probably shouldn't have them anyway!) Just pull the blue luminance down and bang, great skies. What LR is missing ias distortion correction and a decent sharpening tool. Why on god's green farking earth they only have "low/med/high" settings for exporting is beyond belief.

07-23-2009, 12:28 AM	#29
photog Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Brisbane, Qld, Australia Posts: 165	Ozlizard "I can't work out is where does LR keep the images that you have edited and made into a catalogue? " LR is really a database with all of the corrections etc that you make to the image. They are written to the metadata in the header of the DNG file or the sidecar file if a PEF file. You have the option of simply importing the previews or the image files (they may be on the camera or a SD card) to a location of your choice. However I use the free DNG converter which allows renaming, compression to lossless DNG which is just a little more than 1/2 the camera file in size. Between 10.3 and 15.5 depending on the amount of detail that governs how much the file can be comprressed. LR2 is also a great image viewer. Cheers mate. Ron McDermott