[ronald_durst]

Ive done work for a this guy in the past doing photos for his sports paper covering football in season. He wants me to work for him this season since i actually have better equipment then i used to.

The field will be lit but not enough to do without flash since its at night. Does anyone have any experience with this and what are your techniques? Also what kind of equipment do you recommend?

Thanks

[daacon]

What level of Football ? Will you allowed on the sidelines or have to shoot from the grandstands.

I shot a few last year (High School Jr Team) of my son. I would recommend of course the faster lens the better. At that time (last year) I did not have my K10D , but I borrowed a rebel with a 300mm. I was allowed on the sidelines and 300mm was pretty good in most cases (occasionally when the play was at the oppiste end it got to be a bit short). These were day games with good natural light and the occasional cloudy day.

So for length I would recommend 300mm at least. As for the flash that will help for relativley close shots - but if the play if on the other side of the field - not much use in that.

For night games , sidelines , I would recommed a 300mm f4 or better.

my $0.02

[stewart_photo]

(snip) The field will be lit but not enough to do without flash since its at night. Does anyone have any experience with this and what are your techniques? Also what kind of equipment do you recommend?

Flash is seldom powerful enough to cover anything beyond midway to the other side of the field while standing on the sidelines. This might work if your friend covers one side of the field while you cover the other. But if you're expected to cover the game yourself, I'd suggest forgetting about flash.

Instead, practice capturing those dramatic moments when the action slows - the quarterback moving back as the ball is snapped, the quarterback freezing to throw the ball, the receiver slowing down to catch the ball, the two players nearly stopping during a tackle, the two players hitting the ground following a tackle, etc.

For your nighttime games, use the fastest ISO setting available on your camera (to allow the fastest shutter speeds) and be prepared to deal with image noise afterwards. Software is available to remove such noise. Buy something now and learn how to use it to the best effect.

Pay careful attention to exposure metering. The field lights are going to throw some very harsh shadows. In the huddle, for example, the faces of the players leaning downward away from the lights are going to be very dark. If you want an image of this, be prepared to add some exposure compensation (remembering to turn it off afterwards for subsequent shots - forgetting this is a common mistake).

As for the lens, I'd stick to a standard to short long telephoto (200 or 300mm max). Since you friend's sports paper is not likely going to use huge images, you can easily crop images downward to get tighter shots of the action. At the same time, a shorter telephoto would allow faster apertures, hence faster shutter speeds.

Well, that's about it (the basics). Practice is the most important thing. Study your images afterwards to discover what needs to be done to correct any problems. That could be changes in your equipment or just changes in your shooting habits. Good luck.

stewart

[dantuyhoa]

"..Software is available to remove such noise. Buy something now and learn how to use it to the best effect. "

Stewart

What "noise" software would you suggest ?

Thanks

[stewart_photo]

Most seem to recommend either NeatImage or Noise Ninja. However, I honestly have no real experience with either. Up until now, I've been using the noise filter built into Paintshop Pro. But that just isn't cutting it, and neither is PSP for some tasks, so I just ordered Photoshop and will be choosing between NeatImage and Noise Ninja myself.

If you don't have Photoshop (or plug-in compatible graphics software), both noise programs appear to be available in stand-alone versions. My move to Photoshop has nothing directly to do with these noise programs. I'm just attempting to solve all my problems at once.

By the way, I don't shoot American football games. Soccer (called football here) is obviously the big sport in Europe. But I have done American football in the past and the two (from a photographer's perspective - lighting, shooting distances, equipment, etc) are similar enough to easily make comparisons.

stewart

[mcleoud151]

Just my way of sayin' it's not necessary to have two photohounds on the shot. Plan it out, adjust your flash, your ISO, and your shutter speed, and shoot away. ISO 800 is generally more than enough for a newspaper shoot. SO hit 1/250, with 800, (or even 1/350), and 5.6 0r 6.0, and you're good to go. Happy shooting.

[mcleoud151]

Here's a shot w/ the 540 (recently back from the shop for the SECOND TIME):

[stewart_photo]

Just my way of sayin' it's not necessary to have two photohounds on the shot. Plan it out, adjust your flash, your ISO, and your shutter speed, and shoot away.(snip)

From 45 or so feet

At 45 feet or so, those are nice pictures. However, a football field is 100 yards/300 feet long, 120 yards/350 feet with end zones, and 53.3 yards/160 feet wide. Of course, he's entirely free to try flash at these distances. I have and likely others have as well. I was never satisfied with the results, but perhaps he will be.

stewart

[ronald_durst]

I keep reading about shutter speeds....my problem is that with either of my flashes attached, my camera will only do 1/180. A lot of my problem is not having the appropriate equipment nor the budget to acquire it but i gotta start somewhere. So i gotta make do with what i have. I of course have access to the sidelines and behind the goal post(?). (Not to much into sports).

My lens is a tamrom 28-200 4.5 so not the best but i'll make due.

[stewart_photo]

When shooting with a flash, camera shutter speed means almost nothing when it comes to freezing action because the exposure is regulated mainly by the duration of the light from the flash. The flash duration of the Pentax AF-540FGZ, for example, is approximately 1/20,000 sec. That is roughly equal to a shutter speed of 1/20,000 sec (not a typo, 1/20k sec).

However, if you forgo flash as I suggested, you can expect relatively slow shutter speeds (1/125 - 1/250 sec max). That's why I suggested practicing to capture those moments when the action slows. That takes extra effort on your part, but the results are well worth it. You'll end up with all the players and field relatively evenly lit instead of the typical flash look with some players lit properly while others in the background, and the background itself, fades off into total blackness.

stewart

[dantuyhoa]

Stewart

Thanks for the advice. Some friends has highschool kids in indoor sports so they asked me to do it . This will be a good practice for me . I have both K10D , DS so 1600 and 3200 are for me to use . It will be fun

[stewart_photo]

Sounds like fun. In the end, I suggest trying it all. Take some pictures with flash and others without. Try different techniques, exposure settings, and so on. In other words, experiment as much as you possibly can and study the pictures afterwards to see what you specifically like. Good luck to you and take care.

stewart

[mcleoud151]

When shooting with a flash, camera shutter speed means almost nothing when it comes to freezing action because the exposure is regulated mainly by the duration of the light from the flash. The flash duration of the Pentax AF-540FGZ, for example, is approximately 1/20,000 sec. That is roughly equal to a shutter speed of 1/20,000 sec (not a typo, 1/20k sec).

However, if you forgo flash as I suggested, you can expect relatively slow shutter speeds (1/125 - 1/250 sec max). That's why I suggested practicing to capture those moments when the action slows. That takes extra effort on your part, but the results are well worth it. You'll end up with all the players and field relatively evenly lit instead of the typical flash look with some players lit properly while others in the background, and the background itself, fades off into total blackness.

stewart

Gah. Indeed; quite correct, unless the action comes close. I may have had a drink or two on board when the above posts were made! ANyway, If you're shooting the far side, boost up to 800, take your shutter speed down. Go for creative looks. A blurred arm and ball but a sharp face/jersey is a great shot.

[volosong]

Football is tough. Only thing more difficult I've tried is soccer. Daylight, and even dusk, is okay and our equipment is fine, but after dark, Pentax equipment is sorely lacking. Haven't tried shooting football with my K10D yet, only with a DS and K100D.

What I needed is faster focus and more fps. What I worked with was 300mm at a minimum. That limits us to f/4. When action is closer, then I went with my 70-200/2.8 or even the 28-80/2.8 when the action was really close. Had to shoot the ISO as high as it would go. High School field lighting is awful.

It is the constant battle we have between shutter speed, depth of field, and noise at high ISO. The best is to have a fast enough shutter speed to freeze the appropriate action. You want a stopped down aperture such that you have a decent depth-of-field. To get both of these, you have to shoot with a high ISO, which means a lot of noise in the images. And then, (except for possibly DA* lenses and the K10D), our cameras don't focus fast enough. That's why you need as deep of a DOF as possible. That helps minimize slight mis-focus.

It's difficult, but not impossible. Maybe I should just stick to tennis and baseball. I have noticed that shooting the sports I also play or played during my life is a lot easier than shooting a sport where I was just an occasional spectator. Knowing the sport, and where the action is going to happen, is greatly helpful. You can even go manual focus on many occasions.

[volosong]

One other thing...last year I covered the local high school football team for the weekly paper. Didn't matter how great a shot was...if it didn't show a player's face, the publisher wouldn't print it. He said faces were the most important 'thing' to show in an image.

Kind of difficult getting faces with everybody wearing helmets. One 'standard' shot I took that almost always came out good is shooting down the line, between the offense and defense, focus on the quarterback, and when he looks toward you, as he is checking the defensive alignment and where his offense players are lined up, and as he is calling the play...he is looking right at you for a brief moment. Long enough to get two or three shots. You can get a good face shot then...at least of the quarterback.