use actual grad nd filter or digital process?

unclephil12 · 09-16-2010, 12:57 PM

Is there a difference in terms of results between using a hardware grad nd filter (such as Cokin drop in filters) and fixing the RAW files in Photoshop? If there aren't significantly better quality results using an actual filter, then there's no need to spend the money buying the hardware, which is pricy here in Canada. Thanks

VaughnA · 09-16-2010, 01:11 PM

There is a big advantage to the ND filter over PS. If it's blown out in the digital image then you can't get it back with PP. Using the ND filter will keep the bright portion of the image such as the sky from blowing out while keeping the non filtered portion correctly exposed.

Tommot1965 · 09-16-2010, 02:14 PM

the pros use ND grad filters , so id say that says something,

just about every picture that has a significant amount of sky [ landscape shots] in every photography mag Ive seen have been taken with a ND grad filter .

its actually inspired me to get my cokin filters out for a test on my new K7 , i do need a 67 mm adapter ring though

Wheatfield · 09-16-2010, 08:42 PM

I`ve moved almost entirely over to multiple exposures and digital blending rather than grad filters. I get more control this way. Obviously one needs a static subject for this, though CS5 will remove ghosting quite well.

RioRico · 09-16-2010, 09:10 PM

Digital effects cannot restore what ain't there. Sharpness cannot be restored; blown-out details cannot be restored; EMF eliminated by optical filters (UV-block, IR-block, etc) cannot be restored. GND optical filters are absolutely necessary for some shots, and greatly simplify many others. That UFO in the bright clouds over a dark landscape won't hold still for HDR's multiple exposures. A GND lets you shoot handheld what for HDR would require a tripod. GND: Don't leave home without it.

Tommot1965 · 09-16-2010, 11:58 PM

also HDR is only available in Jpeg..not Raw

VaughnA · 09-17-2010, 06:19 AM

Originally posted by Tommot1965

also HDR is only available in Jpeg..not Raw

Post processing raw for HDR is really the best way for HDR to give you any control. I never use the in camera HDR, what you get out of it is a crapshoot..

Tommot1965 · 09-17-2010, 10:14 PM

when doing HDR in post processing..do you capture three images at different exposure setting. then merge the three ?

if so have far past the cameras light readings do you go for the two other images..one stop each way ?

just interested

raider · 09-17-2010, 10:18 PM

I uses grad ND and prefer doing this in the field than on the pc, primarily because i get the satisfaction that my photos turn out the way i want to with the bare minimum post processing and also my pp skills suck!

raider · 09-17-2010, 10:19 PM

I hope i am not hijacking this thread by asking...if u guys do use grad ND, do u use the rectangular drop in type or the screw on glass type.

epqwerty · 09-18-2010, 09:31 AM

I personally don't use a ND grad filter but if you use a screw on one you might have to keep in mind that some lens swivel when autofocusing and thus you will have to reposition the filter all the time. with a rectangular type you focus and then drop in. Less hassle in most cases.

Wheatfield · 09-18-2010, 10:43 AM

Originally posted by Tommot1965

when doing HDR in post processing..do you capture three images at different exposure setting. then merge the three ?

if so have far past the cameras light readings do you go for the two other images..one stop each way ?

just interested

I haven't got a universal pinned down, but generally, I bracket 1.3 stop exposures and then use exposure comp to bias. I use aperture preferred auto for this, the camera adjusts the shutter speed, which is kinda required so that the depth of field doesn't change from shot to shot.
If you use auto bracket, you can set either 3 or 5 exposures. Three is plenty for HDR processing, five gives more options during post.
I find this method to be faster than manual exposure control most of the time, though when it fails, I move over to manual and turn off auto bracketing.

Acrylic · 09-21-2010, 02:30 PM

Originally posted by raider

I hope i am not hijacking this thread by asking...if u guys do use grad ND, do u use the rectangular drop in type or the screw on glass type.

I think you'll find that there are very few screw on graduated ND filters around, even from places like B&H. I tried to find one for myself just because it would be a lot easier to carry around a screw on filter compared to the Cokin system while travelling or tramping.
The few screw on filters I did find were only 2 stop graduated which in my opinion isn't enough, need 3 stops for it to really make a difference in strong light.

09-16-2010, 12:57 PM	#1
unclephil12 New Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Toronto Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 10	use actual grad nd filter or digital process? Is there a difference in terms of results between using a hardware grad nd filter (such as Cokin drop in filters) and fixing the RAW files in Photoshop? If there aren't significantly better quality results using an actual filter, then there's no need to spend the money buying the hardware, which is pricy here in Canada. Thanks

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09-16-2010, 01:11 PM	#2
VaughnA Banned Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Virginia Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 1,363	There is a big advantage to the ND filter over PS. If it's blown out in the digital image then you can't get it back with PP. Using the ND filter will keep the bright portion of the image such as the sky from blowing out while keeping the non filtered portion correctly exposed.

09-16-2010, 02:14 PM	#3
Tommot1965 Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Perth Western Australia Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 1,026	the pros use ND grad filters , so id say that says something, just about every picture that has a significant amount of sky [ landscape shots] in every photography mag Ive seen have been taken with a ND grad filter . its actually inspired me to get my cokin filters out for a test on my new K7 , i do need a 67 mm adapter ring though

09-16-2010, 08:42 PM	#4
Wheatfield Moderator Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: The wheatfields of Canada Posts: 15,981	I`ve moved almost entirely over to multiple exposures and digital blending rather than grad filters. I get more control this way. Obviously one needs a static subject for this, though CS5 will remove ghosting quite well.

09-16-2010, 09:10 PM	#5
RioRico Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Limbo, California Posts: 11,263	Digital effects cannot restore what ain't there. Sharpness cannot be restored; blown-out details cannot be restored; EMF eliminated by optical filters (UV-block, IR-block, etc) cannot be restored. GND optical filters are absolutely necessary for some shots, and greatly simplify many others. That UFO in the bright clouds over a dark landscape won't hold still for HDR's multiple exposures. A GND lets you shoot handheld what for HDR would require a tripod. GND: Don't leave home without it.

09-16-2010, 11:58 PM	#6
Tommot1965 Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Perth Western Australia Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 1,026	also HDR is only available in Jpeg..not Raw

09-17-2010, 06:19 AM	#7
VaughnA Banned Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Virginia Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 1,363	Originally posted by Tommot1965 also HDR is only available in Jpeg..not Raw Post processing raw for HDR is really the best way for HDR to give you any control. I never use the in camera HDR, what you get out of it is a crapshoot..

09-17-2010, 10:14 PM	#8
Tommot1965 Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Perth Western Australia Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 1,026	when doing HDR in post processing..do you capture three images at different exposure setting. then merge the three ? if so have far past the cameras light readings do you go for the two other images..one stop each way ? just interested

09-17-2010, 10:18 PM	#9
raider Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Perth, Australia Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,989	I uses grad ND and prefer doing this in the field than on the pc, primarily because i get the satisfaction that my photos turn out the way i want to with the bare minimum post processing and also my pp skills suck!

09-17-2010, 10:19 PM	#10
raider Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Perth, Australia Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,989	I hope i am not hijacking this thread by asking...if u guys do use grad ND, do u use the rectangular drop in type or the screw on glass type.

09-18-2010, 09:31 AM	#11
epqwerty Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Ontario Posts: 550	I personally don't use a ND grad filter but if you use a screw on one you might have to keep in mind that some lens swivel when autofocusing and thus you will have to reposition the filter all the time. with a rectangular type you focus and then drop in. Less hassle in most cases.

09-18-2010, 10:43 AM	#12
Wheatfield Moderator Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: The wheatfields of Canada Posts: 15,981	Originally posted by Tommot1965 when doing HDR in post processing..do you capture three images at different exposure setting. then merge the three ? if so have far past the cameras light readings do you go for the two other images..one stop each way ? just interested I haven't got a universal pinned down, but generally, I bracket 1.3 stop exposures and then use exposure comp to bias. I use aperture preferred auto for this, the camera adjusts the shutter speed, which is kinda required so that the depth of field doesn't change from shot to shot. If you use auto bracket, you can set either 3 or 5 exposures. Three is plenty for HDR processing, five gives more options during post. I find this method to be faster than manual exposure control most of the time, though when it fails, I move over to manual and turn off auto bracketing.

09-21-2010, 02:30 PM	#13
Acrylic New Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Wellington Posts: 2	Originally posted by raider I hope i am not hijacking this thread by asking...if u guys do use grad ND, do u use the rectangular drop in type or the screw on glass type. I think you'll find that there are very few screw on graduated ND filters around, even from places like B&H. I tried to find one for myself just because it would be a lot easier to carry around a screw on filter compared to the Cokin system while travelling or tramping. The few screw on filters I did find were only 2 stop graduated which in my opinion isn't enough, need 3 stops for it to really make a difference in strong light.