[Ash]

Have to say I also think the standards have gone down. There is no way I would have voted for either the firework or the yellow flower had they come up when I was doing my bit.

I was 15 away from my 100 about 3/4 weeks ago so went all out to reach the target and submitted a selection taken over a few days .. virtually every single one was accepted and I personally wouldn't have voted for many of them.

Now I have reached the 100 I am going to start deleting a few of mine so that it reflects what I think should be in there.

Precisely.
That's a good premise to go by, and I know others have mentioned they'd do the same thing too.
Thanks for sharing.

[gokenin]

Pardon me for a rather negative comment coming here but to me PPG has always been about inflating ones own ego. Once PPG was considered a good thing to get into you and you all said "look at my I got a photo in" and you linked it to your signature. Now that more people have Pentax cameras and more people are submitting you PPG all of a sudden its standards have gone down. I don't know which is worse the people who were proud to be in PPG when there were fewer Pentax users or those that are complaining that standards have gone down now that there are more users. I could be wrong about all of this but thats just my two cents. popcorn

[casil403]

So much for not chewing my head off.

However, just to point out......

In all honesty to me, I pretty much never look at others work unless it is in voting because I find the site to cumbersome, time consuming and frustrating to load....which is a shame. I honestly for that reason, do not even know why I have an account there other than curiosity to see what gets in and gets rejected. If the site were easier to access, then I would perhaps use it more, but other than here and another site In my signature, pretty much nobody else knows I have an account there as I would not want to put anybody else through the horror of navigating that site.

You are quick to try and point faults here and overlook your own - is submitting images to PPG 'just for the hell of it' any different? Why you have a PPG account is none of my business but you pointing out that you do have one despite not even wanting or valuing it is uncanny.

Your words..... not mine Ash.
Just to be clear, I never stated I did not want nor do I not value the site. I stated that I do not know why I have an account there purely for the fact that I find the site cumbersome and a disaster to navigate and Many, many people in other threads have pointed out the very same thing....maybe the curiosity sake for submitting images was a bit harsh and I admit that...probably wrong and a bit flippant but at 6am I'm not at my most eloquent. I have had pro photographers/mentors who I have referred my gallery to and they said they looked at it once and will never go back for the very same reason the horrible navigation and flash...so right now, for that reason I'm not proud of the site. I am proud of my accomplishments and of the images I have in there...all of them...even the" inappropriate {and sic} unduly demoralising ones". <-------that line still makes me laugh.
Photography is not as serious a thing for me as it is for others...for me it is purely a hobby which I enjoy and try not to take too serious.
If you want to take the fact that I think the actions seem hypocritical (not the person Ash...... the actions) personally then that is fine. I leave with no hard feelings and nor will I retract anything I said. So, I guess on this topic we will have to respectfully agree to disagree hopefully without any hard feelings and at least for me, anyhow.

Just as an FYI......I keep the site currently because I am hoping beyond hope that someday they will redo the website and make it more user friendly.
Other than that I think I'm pretty much done with commenting in this thread.

[Matjazz]

Now that more people have Pentax cameras and more people are submitting you PPG all of a sudden its standards have gone down.

I don't think that people are complaining about PPG standards because PPG has more members. The number of members is indeed growing but the number of "recently added" photos is growing much much faster. Just now there are over 4500 photos among recently added. More than ten times more than it used to be while the number of users has grown three times at most.

[Ash]

Pardon me for a rather negative comment coming here but to me PPG has always been about inflating ones own ego. Once PPG was considered a good thing to get into you and you all said "look at my I got a photo in" and you linked it to your signature. Now that more people have Pentax cameras and more people are submitting you PPG all of a sudden its standards have gone down. I don't know which is worse the people who were proud to be in PPG when there were fewer Pentax users or those that are complaining that standards have gone down now that there are more users. I could be wrong about all of this but thats just my two cents. popcorn

That would be ego talking for sure.
That's not me, though. I don't for a second wish there were fewer total acceptances, just fewer that didn't meet their own voting criteria. Of course this is subjective, although it's hard to ignore the growing number of acceptances not quite cutting it for gallery material.

[Ash]

So much for not chewing my head off.

However, just to point out......

Your words..... not mine Ash.

If you felt personally attacked by my comments - my apologies. My opinion remains unchanged though.

Just to be clear, I never stated I did not want nor do I not value the site. I stated that I do not know why I have an account there purely for the fact that I find the site cumbersome and a disaster to navigate and Many, many people in other threads have pointed out the very same thing....maybe the curiosity sake for submitting images was a bit harsh and I admit that...probably wrong and a bit flippant but at 6am I'm not at my most eloquent. I have had pro photographers/mentors who I have referred my gallery to and they said they looked at it once and will never go back for the very same reason the horrible navigation and flash...so right now, for that reason I'm not proud of the site. I am proud of my accomplishments and of the images I have in there...all of them...even the" inappropriate {and sic} unduly demoralising ones". <-------that line still makes me laugh.

Sorry Lisa, you've quoted me totally out of context and you misinterpret the intended meaning. It was a *general* comment about critiquing PPG acceptances since critique on an image deemed good enough for PPG would definitely be taken more to heart than one that was not. So again, this was not directed just to you.

Good for you for your PPG acceptances, and if you're pleased with them, that's all that matters. Let's leave it at that, shall we?

Photography is not as serious a thing for me as it is for others...for me it is purely a hobby which I enjoy and try not to take too serious.

That's good. Then my opinion means nada.

If you want to take the fact that I think the actions seem hypocritical (not the person Ash...... the actions) personally then that is fine. I leave with no hard feelings and nor will I retract anything I said. So, I guess on this topic we will have to respectfully agree to disagree hopefully without any hard feelings and at least for me, anyhow.

Same here.

Just as an FYI......I keep the site currently because I am hoping beyond hope that someday they will redo the website and make it more user friendly.
Other than that I think I'm pretty much done with commenting in this thread.

Thank you.

[Eric J]

I guess a yes and a no

I never treated the PPG as a premier gallery but have always considered the Premier Collection as an outstanding set. PPG once replied to me stating that they are giving everyone a chance. So I guess everyone, from the very beginner to the very professional, has a chance to display photos there.

I personally believe the gallery features mostly decent stuff. No doubt there is the bad one, and a very good one that probably makes it to the premier, but overall it's a good collection and I hope they don't screw up the Premier Collection. On a final note, I think that PPG should limit to around 5 photos per week because it's probably creating too much traffic on their side and bad things are slipping through.

Tx.
Eric J.

[Ash]

I never treated the PPG as a premier gallery but have always considered the Premier Collection as an outstanding set. PPG once replied to me stating that they are giving everyone a chance. So I guess everyone, from the very beginner to the very professional, has a chance to display photos there.

I personally believe the gallery features mostly decent stuff. No doubt there is the bad one, and a very good one that probably makes it to the premier, but overall it's a good collection and I hope they don't screw up the Premier Collection. On a final note, I think that PPG should limit to around 5 photos per week because it's probably creating too much traffic on their side and bad things are slipping through.

Tx.
Eric J.

Welcome to the forum Eric.
Thanks for your contribution here - a good perspective to have.
I agree, the Premium Collection has been a source of inspiration for me as well, only lately having a couple of good but not excellent images (IMO) making their way into it.

I'd agree that the way to go would be to further limit the input as it's hard to regulate what people choose to submit. But ultimately it should come down to the voting panel to decide what's good enough for the regular and Premium galleries. Giving everyone a chance to get in is fine, but accepted images should still meet the standards they set.

[Eric J]

Hello Ash...I've been a member before as Irek J. (my profile still exists, totally lost the login info so I use my real name now).

Your PPG collection is pretty good...keep up the good work.

I was thinking as well that if one values photography and dedicates time, it means that the skill and the overall perception of what is good/bad has improved as well. I think back then your photo evaluating skill wasn't as good as now, I'm assuming here of course, so now you probably see more faults in a particular photograph as you vote. We all know that there are a lot of new Pentax users who have recently signed up, probably a lot of them are new to photography as well (Pentax made a lot of new friends with the multi coloured K-x body). But I guess PPG is giving everyone an equal chance, regardless of the true photographic qualities.

There are still a lot of original PPG photographers who are contributing with stunning photographs, and I think that helps the PPG to be at least levelled - not too bad and not too good.

Happy shooting

[Ash]

I was thinking as well that if one values photography and dedicates time, it means that the skill and the overall perception of what is good/bad has improved as well. I think back then your photo evaluating skill wasn't as good as now, I'm assuming here of course, so now you probably see more faults in a particular photograph as you vote.

Thanks for that.

The phenomenon you describe has been in the back of my mind when judging images now, and as such I am cognisant of the tendency to critique more harshly with time. I can appreciate PPG giving everyone a fair go, though I'd also expect that as newer PPG members come on line, so too the more longer-term members 'graduating' from their newbie status to now vote on photos more strictly - I guess then evening out the playing field and keeping standards reasonably stable. Who knows the dynamic at play? More newbies, fewer dedicated photogs... it's all hard to appreciate.

[yeatzee]

Good lord, I can't even go into the PPG acceptance thread without wincing....

So PPG is the new flickr.... only much harder to use and navigate, with the aurora of that feel good mentality because your image got in and was *accepted*.

This calls for my very first *facepalm* on a forum :ugh:

[Ash]

This calls for my very first *facepalm* on a forum :ugh:

We have a new resident PF facepalmer taking over from Gooshin!

So I guess I'm not just making all this up then...

[stevebrot]

A true embarrassment

Thanks a lot...I rather like the photos of mine that have been accepted there. Not my best work, but then those are a little more esoteric.

Care to share a link to your stuff?


Steve

[Ash]

Alan's work can be seen on his signature website.
But let's not make this personal.

It's quite unfair to call PPG a failure or embarrasing to Pentaxians, but it clearly has its issues.
Would be great to build on its strengths and make it more reputable and esteemed.

[stevebrot]

Alan's work can be seen on his signature website.
But let's not make this personal.

I missed the link, but took the time to browse around once you pointed it out. There is some beautiful and impressive work there, but in the interest of not making it personal, I will refrain from stating the percentage of the images that would have gotten my node for inclusion in PPG.

I guess I was reacting for myself and many others who have submitted our work, had a fair number of rejections, and were very pleased to get acceptance for some of those images. I have not submitted in the last six months, but still view my few accepted images as a bit of an achievement. This, despite seeing some clearly substandard images being accepted. To have someone state that the site has always been a farce and a joke and an embarrassment sort of stuck in my craw.

You may note that I don't link to my PPG in my sig. Neither do I link to my Flickr stream. I do frequently post photos to this forum, but only for the fun stuff, so I guess it is safe to say that I generally do not front with my ego as far as the artistic quality of my work is concerned. None-the-less, Alan's comment stung.

I have often expressed dismay that the quality of PPG entries and acceptance has become quite variable. I have also urged a high standard for acceptance when voting. Part of that is related to the reputation of the Pentax brand and its users. The rest is out of loyalty to those that satisfied a previously high standard only to see their achievement diluted.


Steve