Body or Lens

ccallana · 09-17-2007, 11:26 AM

We were at our kids soccer game the other day, and a friend ours stopped by with her K10D. While she was shooting, my wife says to me -"hers shoots *alot* faster than ours" - we have an *istDL. I was like - DUH its faster...

maybe I should get a new camera

So anyway, she off-handedly said "you can get a new camera or a new lens" - I'm not sure she really meant it or not (never can tell) - but it got me thinking.... if I had ~$700 give or take to spend, would I get a higher spec'd body, or get me a (or a couple) nice lenses...

My kit currently consists of the *istDL, 18-55, 50-200, F50/1.7, M50/1.7, FA28/2.8, 16mm Zenitar, ext. tubes, 540 flash and a tripod.

Lenses I've been mulling over - 12-24, something in the 300mm (70-300 or similar) range for soccer, a dedicated Macro (DFA100 or similar), Sigma 17-70 to replace the kit, oh, the list goes on and on..

I'm not unhappy with my DL for the most part. Sure, I'd like faster focusing, and some of the more flexible modes.... but would I like them more than a Bigma?

I'm getting close to 20k shots on the DL - not sure of its projected life... and if Pentax is really coming out with a new upper model soon, the K10 will drop in price

I'm not in a hurry to do anything, just musing over things -

Any thoughts?

AVANT · 09-17-2007, 11:39 AM

What situations are you missing photo opportunities in? After all, the purpose of grabbing better gear is to reduce our limitations, right?

ccallana · 09-17-2007, 11:45 AM

Thats the thing, I'm not really *missing* anything.... or maybe I don't know what I'm missing

Some things that I notice right now -
==I'm tired of working distance extension tubes+50mm gives me - I have to be on top of what I'm shooting to make it work, typically something like 2" give or take - makes it hard to work sometimes!

==While my 50-200 does pretty good at the soccer games, for the most part, can't get close ups without running around the edge of the field *alot*
==Low light autofocus is lacking - not sure a new body would even help with that.

Partly I'm a gear head who just wants more gear to play with

Chako · 09-17-2007, 02:22 PM

A lot of people would recommend a new lens, as they are an investment that could, theoretically, outlast several camera bodies.

Only go with a new body if there is something you dislike about your current one, or need new capabilities that only a new body can give you.

WMBP · 09-17-2007, 02:42 PM

Originally posted by ccallana

I'm not unhappy with my DL for the most part. Sure, I'd like faster focusing, and some of the more flexible modes.... but would I like them more than a Bigma? I'm getting close to 20k shots on the DL - not sure of its projected life... and if Pentax is really coming out with a new upper model soon, the K10 will drop in price I'm not in a hurry to do anything, just musing over things -

Any thoughts?

I agree that you should not buy a new body until you really feel like the body you've got is cramping your style. (I mean a new camera body. My personal body has been cramping my style for a couple of decades now but there doesn't seem to be much I can do about it.)

I shot volleyball last weekend with my backup camera, the *ist DS. Almost impossible to get auto-focus to work fast enough for me to take a shot, so I ended up using manual focus almost entirely. It was a fun challenge, but I missed some shots I would have gotten with my K10D. On the other hand, the shots I did get were not as damaged by the high ISO as they would have been on the K10D (I was shooting almost entirely at 1600) so perhaps it's a wash.

My general take on this however is, buy when you feel like buying. Some people don't feel like buying until they absolutely have no choice in the matter (for example, their old camera breaks). I respect and admire the self-discipline of these people. Other people feel like buying whenever something new appears and are able to act on that impulse. I envy their resources. Me, I am affected by a lust for everything new that appears, but as I'm not a millionaire, I'm forced to use SOME discipline. I reckon at this point I won't be buying another camera body until late 2008. And it remains to be seen then whether I'll stay with Pentax or switch. I'm going to try not to buy any more lenses in the meantime, although we'll see how long that moratorium lasts.

Will

PS If you're interested in buying a Tamron 70-300 that's in very good condition, contact me via private message. I am getting ready to list it on eBay but as always would prefer to sell it to someone here who I know will give it a good home.

regken · 09-17-2007, 02:50 PM

Originally posted by ccallana

So anyway, she off-handedly said "you can get a new camera or a new lens" - I'm not sure she really meant it or not (never can tell) - but it got me thinking.... if I had ~$700 give or take to spend, would I get a higher spec'd body, or get me a (or a couple) nice lenses...

If you spend the money on lenses and 3 months from now your camera dies you can use the fact you can't use all those lenses unless you buy a new one.LOL

ken

**Mallee Boy** · 09-17-2007, 03:05 PM

I would go with the lens, regken is spot on.
The beauty of our Pentax system is its compatibility, so any thing you spend on lens' now is not wasted money...it's forever.

Just another thought...is your wife giving you a hint she wants her own camera?

Good luck with it all.
Grant

Arpe · 09-17-2007, 05:11 PM

I'd buy Will's Tamron.

**Lowell Goudge** · 09-18-2007, 05:47 AM

If it was me, I would take $700 and get new lenses.

While I understand clearly the difference in processing speed of the K10D (My other DSLR is the *istD), I never had a complaint about shooting speed, or performance until I got the K10D. Now that I am accustomed to the speed, I do notice from time to time the *istD is slower, but unless you are making a movie of 3.3 frame / second 10MP images, does it really matter that much.

The reason I would get lenses is that you can do more with them, than you can with a new body.

Given your list, and your desire for either ultra wide, or tele, would only make one change, that is go for a fixed focal length fast (f/4) 300mm, not a zoom unless you are displeased with the low light performance of your existing 200mm zoom. The other option would be to trade your present zoom for a faster one. a 70-200 f2.8 plus 1.4x TX make a great way to get to 300 mm, and you get a much faster lens in the 200 mm range as well. It is just out of your budget a little.

On the ultra wide side, either the 12-14 pentax / tokina or the zigma 10-20 is a good selection. I have the sigma, my brother in law (who shoots N&%#n) has the tokina.

There is another thread on how big you can print from 6 MP. Take a look at it, lenses are worth more than megapixels at this point, and the price of the K10D is on a slippery slope down any way. Lenses will never drop much in price.

Tom M · 09-18-2007, 12:47 PM

Get the K10D man!!

Make all of your current glass sing!

And of course, as you know full well, you'll still get more glass even if you get that K10D!!

smokey · 09-18-2007, 06:51 PM

Get you a new lens, unless you really want the K10D (which is awsome). Get 'em both! I picked up the Sigma 170-500 and it has been great for shooting my daughters soccer games. I can sit on the 50yd line (played on football field) and get great shots at both ends. The K10D may have better focusing and slightly faster continuous frames, but I think a good lens would be the best investment.

Mechan1k · 09-20-2007, 06:50 AM

Spend the $700 on lenses for sure.

messthetics · 09-24-2007, 03:17 AM

I highly disagree with most of you, I think in his situation having a K10D would definitely be more beneficial. First off, his lenses already are quite good. He's got a great selection of primes, flashes and accessories. About all I would recommend is maybe a faster and longer zoom?

Look at his needs- he's shooting soccer games. A K10D is significantly better at shooting action than an *ist DL with the much larger buffer. Not to mention, you will also gain the great advantage of a stabilized body, something that will improve all of your lenses.

It also hasn't been taken into account that he can simply sell his *ist DL, making the leap even less inexpensive and possibly even having some left over for lenses (the 18-250 tamron seems like a good one for his needs).

George Lama · 09-24-2007, 08:58 AM

Interesting situation here.

He is happy with the camera, yet his wife pointed out the fact someone else's camera was faster... now that's downright odd

A couple of things to consider: The existing lens collection is quite nice, and you're happy with the camera. However, the K10D would definitely be an improvement.

I would suggest getting the K10D (body only) now and keeping the *istD not only as a backup camera, but as the wife's camera too. Then, in a couple of months you can either sell the 50-200 and drop money on a bigger lens, or just buy the bigger lens, all with the excuse that it's not just a lens for you, but for her too

ccallana · 09-24-2007, 10:34 AM

Thanks everyone for the comments - The diversity of answers just underscores the complexity of the issue

We most likely wouldn't be keeping 2 camera bodies around - my wife doesn't shoot that many pictures without me being around anyhow.

My biggest problem is my list of "wants" is much bigger than my wallet

I appreciate everyone's insight into the dilema....

If I ever get around to finding fundage, I'll update

09-17-2007, 11:26 AM	#1
ccallana Inactive Account Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Folsom, CA Photos: Gallery Posts: 321	Body or Lens We were at our kids soccer game the other day, and a friend ours stopped by with her K10D. While she was shooting, my wife says to me -"hers shoots alot faster than ours" - we have an istDL. I was like - DUH its faster... maybe I should get a new camera So anyway, she off-handedly said "you can get a new camera or a new lens" - I'm not sure she really meant it or not (never can tell) - but it got me thinking.... if I had ~$700 give or take to spend, would I get a higher spec'd body, or get me a (or a couple) nice lenses... My kit currently consists of the istDL, 18-55, 50-200, F50/1.7, M50/1.7, FA28/2.8, 16mm Zenitar, ext. tubes, 540 flash and a tripod. Lenses I've been mulling over - 12-24, something in the 300mm (70-300 or similar) range for soccer, a dedicated Macro (DFA100 or similar), Sigma 17-70 to replace the kit, oh, the list goes on and on.. I'm not unhappy with my DL for the most part. Sure, I'd like faster focusing, and some of the more flexible modes.... but would I like them more than a Bigma? I'm getting close to 20k shots on the DL - not sure of its projected life... and if Pentax is really coming out with a new upper model soon, the K10 will drop in price I'm not in a hurry to do anything, just musing over things - Any thoughts?

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09-17-2007, 11:39 AM	#2
AVANT Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: California Posts: 426	What situations are you missing photo opportunities in? After all, the purpose of grabbing better gear is to reduce our limitations, right?

09-17-2007, 11:45 AM	#3
ccallana Inactive Account Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Folsom, CA Photos: Gallery Posts: 321 Original Poster	Thats the thing, I'm not really missing anything.... or maybe I don't know what I'm missing Some things that I notice right now - ==I'm tired of working distance extension tubes+50mm gives me - I have to be on top of what I'm shooting to make it work, typically something like 2" give or take - makes it hard to work sometimes! ==While my 50-200 does pretty good at the soccer games, for the most part, can't get close ups without running around the edge of the field alot ==Low light autofocus is lacking - not sure a new body would even help with that. Partly I'm a gear head who just wants more gear to play with

09-17-2007, 02:22 PM	#4
Chako Inactive Account Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Sault Ste Marie, Ont, Canada. Posts: 563	A lot of people would recommend a new lens, as they are an investment that could, theoretically, outlast several camera bodies. Only go with a new body if there is something you dislike about your current one, or need new capabilities that only a new body can give you.

09-17-2007, 02:42 PM	#5
WMBP Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Dallas, Texas Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,482	Originally posted by ccallana I'm not unhappy with my DL for the most part. Sure, I'd like faster focusing, and some of the more flexible modes.... but would I like them more than a Bigma? I'm getting close to 20k shots on the DL - not sure of its projected life... and if Pentax is really coming out with a new upper model soon, the K10 will drop in price I'm not in a hurry to do anything, just musing over things - Any thoughts? I agree that you should not buy a new body until you really feel like the body you've got is cramping your style. (I mean a new camera body. My personal body has been cramping my style for a couple of decades now but there doesn't seem to be much I can do about it.) I shot volleyball last weekend with my backup camera, the *ist DS. Almost impossible to get auto-focus to work fast enough for me to take a shot, so I ended up using manual focus almost entirely. It was a fun challenge, but I missed some shots I would have gotten with my K10D. On the other hand, the shots I did get were not as damaged by the high ISO as they would have been on the K10D (I was shooting almost entirely at 1600) so perhaps it's a wash. My general take on this however is, buy when you feel like buying. Some people don't feel like buying until they absolutely have no choice in the matter (for example, their old camera breaks). I respect and admire the self-discipline of these people. Other people feel like buying whenever something new appears and are able to act on that impulse. I envy their resources. Me, I am affected by a lust for everything new that appears, but as I'm not a millionaire, I'm forced to use SOME discipline. I reckon at this point I won't be buying another camera body until late 2008. And it remains to be seen then whether I'll stay with Pentax or switch. I'm going to try not to buy any more lenses in the meantime, although we'll see how long that moratorium lasts. Will PS If you're interested in buying a Tamron 70-300 that's in very good condition, contact me via private message. I am getting ready to list it on eBay but as always would prefer to sell it to someone here who I know will give it a good home.

09-17-2007, 02:50 PM	#6
regken Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Bangor, Maine Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,377	Originally posted by ccallana So anyway, she off-handedly said "you can get a new camera or a new lens" - I'm not sure she really meant it or not (never can tell) - but it got me thinking.... if I had ~$700 give or take to spend, would I get a higher spec'd body, or get me a (or a couple) nice lenses... If you spend the money on lenses and 3 months from now your camera dies you can use the fact you can't use all those lenses unless you buy a new one.LOL ken

09-17-2007, 03:05 PM	#7
Mallee Boy Site Supporter Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: South Australia Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 3,904	I would go with the lens, regken is spot on. The beauty of our Pentax system is its compatibility, so any thing you spend on lens' now is not wasted money...it's forever. Just another thought...is your wife giving you a hint she wants her own camera? Good luck with it all. Grant

09-17-2007, 05:11 PM	#8
Arpe Pentaxian Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: New Zealand Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 4,452	I'd buy Will's Tamron.

09-18-2007, 05:47 AM	#9
Lowell Goudge Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Toronto Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 17,888	If it was me, I would take $700 and get new lenses. While I understand clearly the difference in processing speed of the K10D (My other DSLR is the istD), I never had a complaint about shooting speed, or performance until I got the K10D. Now that I am accustomed to the speed, I do notice from time to time the istD is slower, but unless you are making a movie of 3.3 frame / second 10MP images, does it really matter that much. The reason I would get lenses is that you can do more with them, than you can with a new body. Given your list, and your desire for either ultra wide, or tele, would only make one change, that is go for a fixed focal length fast (f/4) 300mm, not a zoom unless you are displeased with the low light performance of your existing 200mm zoom. The other option would be to trade your present zoom for a faster one. a 70-200 f2.8 plus 1.4x TX make a great way to get to 300 mm, and you get a much faster lens in the 200 mm range as well. It is just out of your budget a little. On the ultra wide side, either the 12-14 pentax / tokina or the zigma 10-20 is a good selection. I have the sigma, my brother in law (who shoots N&%#n) has the tokina. There is another thread on how big you can print from 6 MP. Take a look at it, lenses are worth more than megapixels at this point, and the price of the K10D is on a slippery slope down any way. Lenses will never drop much in price.

09-18-2007, 12:47 PM	#10
Tom M Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Lincoln Park, NJ Photos: Gallery Posts: 780	Get the K10D man!! Make all of your current glass sing! And of course, as you know full well, you'll still get more glass even if you get that K10D!!

09-18-2007, 06:51 PM	#11
smokey Forum Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Salina, KS Posts: 92	Get you a new lens, unless you really want the K10D (which is awsome). Get 'em both! I picked up the Sigma 170-500 and it has been great for shooting my daughters soccer games. I can sit on the 50yd line (played on football field) and get great shots at both ends. The K10D may have better focusing and slightly faster continuous frames, but I think a good lens would be the best investment.

09-20-2007, 06:50 AM	#12
Mechan1k Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 2,891	Spend the $700 on lenses for sure.

09-24-2007, 03:17 AM	#13
messthetics Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Oakland, CA Posts: 137	I highly disagree with most of you, I think in his situation having a K10D would definitely be more beneficial. First off, his lenses already are quite good. He's got a great selection of primes, flashes and accessories. About all I would recommend is maybe a faster and longer zoom? Look at his needs- he's shooting soccer games. A K10D is significantly better at shooting action than an ist DL with the much larger buffer. Not to mention, you will also gain the great advantage of a stabilized body, something that will improve all of your lenses. It also hasn't been taken into account that he can simply sell his ist DL, making the leap even less inexpensive and possibly even having some left over for lenses (the 18-250 tamron seems like a good one for his needs).

09-24-2007, 08:58 AM	#14
George Lama Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Buffalo/Rochester, NY Photos: Albums Posts: 1,133	Interesting situation here. He is happy with the camera, yet his wife pointed out the fact someone else's camera was faster... now that's downright odd A couple of things to consider: The existing lens collection is quite nice, and you're happy with the camera. However, the K10D would definitely be an improvement. I would suggest getting the K10D (body only) now and keeping the *istD not only as a backup camera, but as the wife's camera too. Then, in a couple of months you can either sell the 50-200 and drop money on a bigger lens, or just buy the bigger lens, all with the excuse that it's not just a lens for you, but for her too

09-24-2007, 10:34 AM	#15
ccallana Inactive Account Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Folsom, CA Photos: Gallery Posts: 321 Original Poster	Thanks everyone for the comments - The diversity of answers just underscores the complexity of the issue We most likely wouldn't be keeping 2 camera bodies around - my wife doesn't shoot that many pictures without me being around anyhow. My biggest problem is my list of "wants" is much bigger than my wallet I appreciate everyone's insight into the dilema.... If I ever get around to finding fundage, I'll update