A completely new sensor design - Lytros Light Field camera

layfsphoto · 06-22-2011, 11:14 AM

Its quite impressive. Not sure where it would far in the world. It could change a few things thats for sure. As photographers here we see the signifance of the product or Idea. But a simple user might be stuck on a brand and not realize what going on here.
Could change the way we shoot. Take the apature ring of the camera and brings shooting in RAW a entirely different meaning. We could post process to the DOF that we want.
Could be a very cool produce with a pro lens.

v5planet · 06-22-2011, 01:09 PM

Originally posted by layfsphoto

Its quite impressive. Not sure where it would far in the world. It could change a few things thats for sure. As photographers here we see the signifance of the product or Idea. But a simple user might be stuck on a brand and not realize what going on here.
Could change the way we shoot. Take the apature ring of the camera and brings shooting in RAW a entirely different meaning. We could post process to the DOF that we want.
Could be a very cool produce with a pro lens.

Yes, absolutely! Control over focal plane after a shot is taken also implies we would be able to manually adjust the DOF (probably within tolerances) during post processing as well.

But more than that, I think it also opens up a lot of other interesting possibilities, like for instance:
*having multiple focal planes;
*creating different OOF effects to simulate bokeh rendering of different lens types;
*ability to use different DOFs for behind the focal plane vs ahead of the focal plane;
*ability to apply post processing filters differentially based on distance from the focal plane (imagine desaturation gradients that are based on the actual depth of field rather than anything else, or sharpening algorithms, etc.)

v5planet · 06-22-2011, 01:16 PM

Shoot, you could probably even design your own curves for focus falloff behavior. 1-5 inches behind focal plane, a smooth and gradual parabolic decay; switches to a steep linear curve for 5inches - 10 ft; then after 10 feet levels off for same degree of OOF all the way to infinity (as an example). The possibilities are staggering.

v5planet · 06-22-2011, 01:29 PM

Originally posted by Deimos

I bet you will never get the kind of interesting bokeh you see with many of the lenses popular here. That said, it would be a great feature to have.

I disagree entirely! If you have information on the entire light field and can adjust focal plane and DOF to your whims, I guarantee you people will develop a whole slew of algorithms to render OOF transitions and bokeh in whatever fashion you want.

markdesmarais · 06-22-2011, 01:36 PM

Anybody know how large the raw files from this would be? Seems like they might be BIG.

Gareth.Ig · 06-22-2011, 01:52 PM

Wow, if this guy can actually do this, its a big change to how we are going to take pictures in the future.

Light Field camera | Lytro

Clavius · 06-22-2011, 01:56 PM

Wouldn't that ruin all the fun of photography? A bit the like "future cars that steer themselves" would result in no fun in driving.

v5planet · 06-22-2011, 02:03 PM

Originally posted by Clavius

Wouldn't that ruin all the fun of photography? A bit the like "future cars that steer themselves" would result in no fun in driving.

I'm not so sure. Lighting, composition, exposure will all be as important as ever. This sounds like its greatest strength is allowing for much more creative control after the fact. This could actually seriously ramp up expectations for creativity in images.

v5planet · 06-22-2011, 02:08 PM - **1 Like**

As I mentioned in the other thread on this topic... this opens the door wide open for all sorts of interesting creative possibilities.

Think about being able to:

* alter not only the focal plane, but the depth of field

* load preset algorithms that drastically alter the nature and speed of OOF transitions and how bokeh is rendered -- or create your own by adjusting something analogous to curves (this would make having large stores of lenses of identical focal length and aperture totally irrelevant as you could simulate the rendering "flavors" of any of them)

* have MULTIPLE focal planes. Imagine scenes where there is a lot of depth. Imagine being able to creatively draw attention to two distinct areas in the photo that are at opposite ends of the depth spectrum and NOT be distracted by the intermediary space.

* digital image editing filters that are applied relative to the focal plane. Isolate a subject with a selective desaturation based on actual depth of field rather than fiddling with layer masks, etc.

These are just SOME possibilities. I think this stands a good chance of really raising the bar if it's as capable as they're advertising.

icywindow · 06-22-2011, 02:14 PM

Quote:

* have MULTIPLE focal planes. Imagine scenes where there is a lot of depth. Imagine being able to creatively draw attention to two distinct areas in the photo that are at opposite ends of the depth spectrum and NOT be distracted by the intermediary space.

^ This. The idea of having effectively approximated focus surfaces sits very well with me.

**Deimos** · 06-22-2011, 03:43 PM

True, true. This could be completely revolutionary. Paradigm shift even.

That said, there is something about creating within the various limitations "current" photography provides that I find appealing.

It is a constant challenge, gear, light, skill, circumstances. Much of that would still come into play with this future tech but it would really then be all about PP.

Come to think of it, im sure you can create an algorithm to simulate a skilled photographer? Who needs us?

We can just have apps that produce artful or precise images as required, perhaps instantly on demand. With a few hiend CCTV cams in cities or hires satellite images, you wouldnt even need to leave the house (or pod perhaps

)

Maybe im going to far down the rabbit hole here....

v5planet · 06-22-2011, 03:49 PM

Originally posted by Deimos

Maybe im going to far down the rabbit hole here....

Way too far! Someone still has to be there deciding the aesthetics

**Deimos** · 06-22-2011, 03:55 PM

Originally posted by v5planet

Way too far! Someone still has to be there deciding the aesthetics

Sure, another algorithm

DogLover · 06-22-2011, 05:07 PM

Originally posted by v5planet

I'm not so sure. Lighting, composition, exposure will all be as important as ever.

From the description given, I'm not sure lighting and exposure will be all that crucial with this new technology. Sounds like it will be able to compensate for that, at least to some extent.

MRRiley · 06-22-2011, 05:13 PM

Three... count em 3 threads, all from today on this one subject. All threads merged. Please remember to check before starting a new thread...

Mike
PF Moderation Team

06-22-2011, 01:52 PM	#21
Gareth.Ig Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: Cochrane, AB Photos: Gallery Posts: 508	Lytro camera, light field camera Wow, if this guy can actually do this, its a big change to how we are going to take pictures in the future. Light Field camera \| Lytro

06-22-2011, 05:13 PM	#30
MRRiley Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Sterling, VA, USA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 6,275	Three... count em 3 threads, all from today on this one subject. All threads merged. Please remember to check before starting a new thread... Mike PF Moderation Team Last edited by MRRiley; 06-23-2011 at 05:48 AM.

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06-22-2011, 11:14 AM	#16
layfsphoto Forum Member Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: JACKSONVILLE FL. Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 77	Its quite impressive. Not sure where it would far in the world. It could change a few things thats for sure. As photographers here we see the signifance of the product or Idea. But a simple user might be stuck on a brand and not realize what going on here. Could change the way we shoot. Take the apature ring of the camera and brings shooting in RAW a entirely different meaning. We could post process to the DOF that we want. Could be a very cool produce with a pro lens.

06-22-2011, 01:09 PM	#17
v5planet Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Seattle Photos: Albums Posts: 1,915	Originally posted by layfsphoto Its quite impressive. Not sure where it would far in the world. It could change a few things thats for sure. As photographers here we see the signifance of the product or Idea. But a simple user might be stuck on a brand and not realize what going on here. Could change the way we shoot. Take the apature ring of the camera and brings shooting in RAW a entirely different meaning. We could post process to the DOF that we want. Could be a very cool produce with a pro lens. Yes, absolutely! Control over focal plane after a shot is taken also implies we would be able to manually adjust the DOF (probably within tolerances) during post processing as well. But more than that, I think it also opens up a lot of other interesting possibilities, like for instance: having multiple focal planes; creating different OOF effects to simulate bokeh rendering of different lens types; ability to use different DOFs for behind the focal plane vs ahead of the focal plane; ability to apply post processing filters differentially based on distance from the focal plane (imagine desaturation gradients that are based on the actual depth of field rather than anything else, or sharpening algorithms, etc.)

06-22-2011, 01:16 PM	#18
v5planet Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Seattle Photos: Albums Posts: 1,915	Shoot, you could probably even design your own curves for focus falloff behavior. 1-5 inches behind focal plane, a smooth and gradual parabolic decay; switches to a steep linear curve for 5inches - 10 ft; then after 10 feet levels off for same degree of OOF all the way to infinity (as an example). The possibilities are staggering.

06-22-2011, 01:29 PM	#19
v5planet Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Seattle Photos: Albums Posts: 1,915	Originally posted by Deimos I bet you will never get the kind of interesting bokeh you see with many of the lenses popular here. That said, it would be a great feature to have. I disagree entirely! If you have information on the entire light field and can adjust focal plane and DOF to your whims, I guarantee you people will develop a whole slew of algorithms to render OOF transitions and bokeh in whatever fashion you want.

06-22-2011, 01:36 PM	#20
markdesmarais Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Massachusetts Photos: Gallery Posts: 186	Anybody know how large the raw files from this would be? Seems like they might be BIG.

06-22-2011, 01:56 PM	#22
Clavius Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: De Klundert Photos: Gallery Posts: 4,150	Wouldn't that ruin all the fun of photography? A bit the like "future cars that steer themselves" would result in no fun in driving.

06-22-2011, 02:03 PM	#23
v5planet Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Seattle Photos: Albums Posts: 1,915	Originally posted by Clavius Wouldn't that ruin all the fun of photography? A bit the like "future cars that steer themselves" would result in no fun in driving. I'm not so sure. Lighting, composition, exposure will all be as important as ever. This sounds like its greatest strength is allowing for much more creative control after the fact. This could actually seriously ramp up expectations for creativity in images.

06-22-2011, 02:08 PM - 1 Like	#24
v5planet Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Seattle Photos: Albums Posts: 1,915	As I mentioned in the other thread on this topic... this opens the door wide open for all sorts of interesting creative possibilities. Think about being able to: * alter not only the focal plane, but the depth of field * load preset algorithms that drastically alter the nature and speed of OOF transitions and how bokeh is rendered -- or create your own by adjusting something analogous to curves (this would make having large stores of lenses of identical focal length and aperture totally irrelevant as you could simulate the rendering "flavors" of any of them) * have MULTIPLE focal planes. Imagine scenes where there is a lot of depth. Imagine being able to creatively draw attention to two distinct areas in the photo that are at opposite ends of the depth spectrum and NOT be distracted by the intermediary space. * digital image editing filters that are applied relative to the focal plane. Isolate a subject with a selective desaturation based on actual depth of field rather than fiddling with layer masks, etc. These are just SOME possibilities. I think this stands a good chance of really raising the bar if it's as capable as they're advertising.

06-22-2011, 02:14 PM	#25
icywindow Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2011 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 303	Quote: * have MULTIPLE focal planes. Imagine scenes where there is a lot of depth. Imagine being able to creatively draw attention to two distinct areas in the photo that are at opposite ends of the depth spectrum and NOT be distracted by the intermediary space. ^ This. The idea of having effectively approximated focus surfaces sits very well with me.

06-22-2011, 03:43 PM	#26
Deimos Site Supporter Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Kingdom of Wonder Posts: 1,777	True, true. This could be completely revolutionary. Paradigm shift even. That said, there is something about creating within the various limitations "current" photography provides that I find appealing. It is a constant challenge, gear, light, skill, circumstances. Much of that would still come into play with this future tech but it would really then be all about PP. Come to think of it, im sure you can create an algorithm to simulate a skilled photographer? Who needs us? We can just have apps that produce artful or precise images as required, perhaps instantly on demand. With a few hiend CCTV cams in cities or hires satellite images, you wouldnt even need to leave the house (or pod perhaps ) Maybe im going to far down the rabbit hole here....

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06-22-2011, 03:49 PM	#27
v5planet Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Seattle Photos: Albums Posts: 1,915	Originally posted by Deimos Maybe im going to far down the rabbit hole here.... Way too far! Someone still has to be there deciding the aesthetics

06-22-2011, 03:55 PM	#28
Deimos Site Supporter Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Kingdom of Wonder Posts: 1,777	Originally posted by v5planet Way too far! Someone still has to be there deciding the aesthetics Sure, another algorithm

06-22-2011, 05:07 PM	#29
DogLover Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Tennessee Posts: 2,054	Originally posted by v5planet I'm not so sure. Lighting, composition, exposure will all be as important as ever. From the description given, I'm not sure lighting and exposure will be all that crucial with this new technology. Sounds like it will be able to compensate for that, at least to some extent.