shooting infrared

ruemiser · 12-22-2007, 01:38 PM

I tried a few experiments with my K10d with a Hoya 72 infrared filter today. I adjusted the white balance for manual mode and placed it more towards the blue green spectrum. Took a 20 second exposure using my 18-55mm lens kit at about F4. Tried this with varying degrees of exposure, but I still get mostly red results. What am I doing wrong here?

ruemiser · 12-22-2007, 01:51 PM

If I cannot get good results with the K10d with IR photography, does anyone recommend I also get a K100 as a dedicated IR Camera?

**LeoTaylor** · 12-23-2007, 06:02 PM

Hello Ruemiser,

From your posts your aim seems to be getting balanced color with an IR filter. I used to think it could not be done, but a few people on this forum come close to it. It takes both color balance and post processing.

Many display their IR in Black and White rather than try to simulate color. Myself, I just extract the red channel from the Bayer encoding then display that as B&W. Some would call me an IR purist, where others are more artistic than I.

The K10D can do IR, but the exposures are long. These days a new K100D or used istD could make a good second camera for IR.

zntgrg · 12-24-2007, 06:15 AM

I hear many shooting at f8: there are problem shooting wide open? using f/3.5 and 800 ISO will get more confortable shutter times [i don't have a tripod, handheld fanatic

]

ruemiser · 12-24-2007, 01:03 PM

Leo,

Thanks. So am I correct in assuming here that because there is allready such high Infrared blocking on this camera, that the extreme red experienced in my exposures is a result of this?

On the K100 for example, will the outcome of the same type of exposures with a R72 filter yield raw photos with less Red in the shot? Also, those with more infrared sensitivity need less post processing?

Sorry for all the questions. Just fascinated with IR photography at the moment. I am planning to do a photo shoot of a park near us that has been sold off for development purposes and and trying to take different types of photos of the grounds and also there is a beautiful mansion on the hill. If any of you are from the area, the place is called Burholme Park.

Thanks
David

Originally posted by LeoTaylor

Hello Ruemiser,

From your posts your aim seems to be getting balanced color with an IR filter. I used to think it could not be done, but a few people on this forum come close to it. It takes both color balance and post processing.

Many display their IR in Black and White rather than try to simulate color. Myself, I just extract the red channel from the Bayer encoding then display that as B&W. Some would call me an IR purist, where others are more artistic than I.

The K10D can do IR, but the exposures are long. These days a new K100D or used istD could make a good second camera for IR.

**LeoTaylor** · 12-25-2007, 02:47 PM

Originally posted by ruemiser

Leo,

Thanks. So am I correct in assuming here that because there is already such high Infrared blocking on this camera, that the extreme red experienced in my exposures is a result of this?

On the K100 for example, will the outcome of the same type of exposures with a R72 filter yield raw photos with less Red in the shot? ...

I think you are stating it backwards. Your K10D has less red reaching the sensor due to a stronger filter. I don't have that model, but many on this Forum say it does. My K100 and my wife's istD are about equal and allow more red to reach the sensor due to a weaker filter. This makes them more sensitive to IR thus can use a shorter exposure with our Hoya R72. I posted IR exposure times for the istD, K100, and filterless K110D a few months ago.

All three camera will produce images that look very red with normal white balance, The sensor is very sensitive to IR and the camera interprets that as red. The Hoya blocks most visible light thus the blue and green channel get a weak signal that "leaks" through the Hoya (which is why it looks black). As mentioned people have success using Custom White balance plus post processing to make a simulated color photo. xs700 has some stunning photos on this thread, but no one expects the trees to look green! The K10D should be easier to compensate since it has less IR red.

Since the Hoya filter is around $44 and a second camera around $350 I'd spend more time with your K10D experimenting. If you like IR but tire of the long exposures then buy a spare camera. But remember the photos won't look MUCH different, just take less time to image. Since pentkon52 said 8-10 seconds for his K10D the exposure time is still short compared to the setup and processing time.

ruemiser · 12-25-2007, 03:03 PM

Here are a few tests I ran today. Both photos needed post processing in Photoshop. I removed as much red as possible. Both photos were using the 18-55 mm lens of the K10d with A at F8. ISO 400, Shutter open for about 14 seconds, using the Hoya72 filter.

Last edited by ruemiser; 12-27-2007 at 10:46 AM.

zntgrg · 12-27-2007, 02:03 AM

Ruemiser, you can open the shutter up to 30 seconds without using bulb mode. Also. using auto shutter release will prelift the mirror avoiding lots of vibrations.

ruemiser · 12-27-2007, 10:47 AM

Thanks. I'll check that out. Only had the camera now for about two weeks

**LeoTaylor** · 12-27-2007, 06:47 PM

[QUOTE=xs400;136132]... Using PS CS2 to channel swap red and blue, followed by adjustments with levels, I am able to get shots like these.

Hello xs400,

I first read of using color swap for an IR image from your post yesterday. Today I'm flipping through an Infrared article in a photography magazine and they mention the same thing! I'm going to try that once we get some clear weather here in Southern New England. I don't have PS but can separate the Bayer Array RAW data with Images Plus, swap the colors around, and then combine them. Thanks for the hint.

12-22-2007, 01:38 PM	#16
ruemiser Inactive Account Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Philadelphia PA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 76	Infrared with the K10d I tried a few experiments with my K10d with a Hoya 72 infrared filter today. I adjusted the white balance for manual mode and placed it more towards the blue green spectrum. Took a 20 second exposure using my 18-55mm lens kit at about F4. Tried this with varying degrees of exposure, but I still get mostly red results. What am I doing wrong here?

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
Near Infrared	LitoNazareno	Welcomes and Introductions	5	04-21-2010 10:25 PM
Infrared	Nestos	Post Your Photos!	1	07-10-2009 01:24 PM
Two Infrared	xs400	Post Your Photos!	5	03-11-2009 01:42 PM
Shooting the photographer shooting my sons engagement photos	skinja	Post Your Photos!	13	07-04-2008 12:14 PM
Infrared	HelenEdith	Post Your Photos!	10	06-07-2007 04:58 PM

12-22-2007, 01:51 PM	#17
ruemiser Inactive Account Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Philadelphia PA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 76	If I cannot get good results with the K10d with IR photography, does anyone recommend I also get a K100 as a dedicated IR Camera?

12-23-2007, 06:02 PM	#18
LeoTaylor Site Supporter Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Connecticut Photos: Gallery Posts: 679	Hello Ruemiser, From your posts your aim seems to be getting balanced color with an IR filter. I used to think it could not be done, but a few people on this forum come close to it. It takes both color balance and post processing. Many display their IR in Black and White rather than try to simulate color. Myself, I just extract the red channel from the Bayer encoding then display that as B&W. Some would call me an IR purist, where others are more artistic than I. The K10D can do IR, but the exposures are long. These days a new K100D or used istD could make a good second camera for IR.

12-24-2007, 06:15 AM	#19
zntgrg Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Verona, Italy Posts: 202	I hear many shooting at f8: there are problem shooting wide open? using f/3.5 and 800 ISO will get more confortable shutter times [i don't have a tripod, handheld fanatic ]

12-24-2007, 01:03 PM	#20
ruemiser Inactive Account Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Philadelphia PA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 76	Leo, Thanks. So am I correct in assuming here that because there is allready such high Infrared blocking on this camera, that the extreme red experienced in my exposures is a result of this? On the K100 for example, will the outcome of the same type of exposures with a R72 filter yield raw photos with less Red in the shot? Also, those with more infrared sensitivity need less post processing? Sorry for all the questions. Just fascinated with IR photography at the moment. I am planning to do a photo shoot of a park near us that has been sold off for development purposes and and trying to take different types of photos of the grounds and also there is a beautiful mansion on the hill. If any of you are from the area, the place is called Burholme Park. Thanks David Originally posted by LeoTaylor Hello Ruemiser, From your posts your aim seems to be getting balanced color with an IR filter. I used to think it could not be done, but a few people on this forum come close to it. It takes both color balance and post processing. Many display their IR in Black and White rather than try to simulate color. Myself, I just extract the red channel from the Bayer encoding then display that as B&W. Some would call me an IR purist, where others are more artistic than I. The K10D can do IR, but the exposures are long. These days a new K100D or used istD could make a good second camera for IR.

12-25-2007, 02:47 PM	#21
LeoTaylor Site Supporter Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Connecticut Photos: Gallery Posts: 679	Originally posted by ruemiser Leo, Thanks. So am I correct in assuming here that because there is already such high Infrared blocking on this camera, that the extreme red experienced in my exposures is a result of this? On the K100 for example, will the outcome of the same type of exposures with a R72 filter yield raw photos with less Red in the shot? ... I think you are stating it backwards. Your K10D has less red reaching the sensor due to a stronger filter. I don't have that model, but many on this Forum say it does. My K100 and my wife's istD are about equal and allow more red to reach the sensor due to a weaker filter. This makes them more sensitive to IR thus can use a shorter exposure with our Hoya R72. I posted IR exposure times for the istD, K100, and filterless K110D a few months ago. All three camera will produce images that look very red with normal white balance, The sensor is very sensitive to IR and the camera interprets that as red. The Hoya blocks most visible light thus the blue and green channel get a weak signal that "leaks" through the Hoya (which is why it looks black). As mentioned people have success using Custom White balance plus post processing to make a simulated color photo. xs700 has some stunning photos on this thread, but no one expects the trees to look green! The K10D should be easier to compensate since it has less IR red. Since the Hoya filter is around $44 and a second camera around $350 I'd spend more time with your K10D experimenting. If you like IR but tire of the long exposures then buy a spare camera. But remember the photos won't look MUCH different, just take less time to image. Since pentkon52 said 8-10 seconds for his K10D the exposure time is still short compared to the setup and processing time.

12-25-2007, 03:03 PM	#22
ruemiser Inactive Account Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Philadelphia PA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 76	Here are a few tests I ran today. Both photos needed post processing in Photoshop. I removed as much red as possible. Both photos were using the 18-55 mm lens of the K10d with A at F8. ISO 400, Shutter open for about 14 seconds, using the Hoya72 filter. Last edited by ruemiser; 12-27-2007 at 10:46 AM.

12-27-2007, 02:03 AM	#23
zntgrg Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Verona, Italy Posts: 202	Ruemiser, you can open the shutter up to 30 seconds without using bulb mode. Also. using auto shutter release will prelift the mirror avoiding lots of vibrations.

12-27-2007, 10:47 AM	#24
ruemiser Inactive Account Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Philadelphia PA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 76	Thanks. I'll check that out. Only had the camera now for about two weeks

12-27-2007, 06:47 PM	#25
LeoTaylor Site Supporter Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Connecticut Photos: Gallery Posts: 679	[QUOTE=xs400;136132]... Using PS CS2 to channel swap red and blue, followed by adjustments with levels, I am able to get shots like these. Hello xs400, I first read of using color swap for an IR image from your post yesterday. Today I'm flipping through an Infrared article in a photography magazine and they mention the same thing! I'm going to try that once we get some clear weather here in Southern New England. I don't have PS but can separate the Bayer Array RAW data with Images Plus, swap the colors around, and then combine them. Thanks for the hint.