A couple questions

Tokm · 04-23-2012, 11:07 AM

I'm a bit new to photography, and while I have made some pictures that i would consider to be fairly good, I still have a lot to learn. My first question has to do with color, how can I get some really vibrant colors? I have seen pictures taken on drab days that look amazing, but all I get is something that looks drab. The sharpness and detail of things such as the grain of wood on an old barn, how can I get these to be better? Is this a matter of technique, camera, glass, or a mix? I'm currently shooting with a canon 350D and tamron 28-300 f3.5

benhai · 04-23-2012, 11:27 AM

I think first you might need to use smaller aperture like 5.6 or 8 to see if the sharpness goes up. Second, you can set your camera's mode to vivid and increase your saturation level. Third make sure you can hold your camera steady. And after all that you'll need to find a better galss. I think Tamron 28-300 f3.5 may not be enough.

For canon lenses, my friends are mostly happy with Canon 24-105mm f4 L and the Canon 70-21mm f2.8 IS L. For lenses, you'd get it right the first time, otherwise you'll be spending whole lot of time to do LBA and try to decide which one to keep. I'd like to spend more time on taken pictures right at first time not spend my time on PS or lightroom with raw.

Happy shooting!

reed_page · 04-23-2012, 11:34 AM

When I take photos in less than optimal conditions. I usually put them through a color enhancer, it tends to get rid of, ' the drab'. Most photo tools will have the ability to manually or automatically change the color settings of your photos. If software came with the camera, you can try that. If not there are freeware programs (i.e. irfanview) that have that functionality. I had an old canon s1-is that every picture came out kind of 'hazy', but the auto correction software that came with it (Photo Studio 5) would correct everything to the point that the photos looked amazing (even under water photos). I try using as little Post Processing as possible, but a lot of photos need it to get the 'Pop' effect.

Tokm · 04-23-2012, 11:42 AM

As far as vivid mode goes, I'm not aware of the canon xt having that, at least under that name. If it doesn't have it, is there a workaround with the settings? Or is this a generic term? As far as the glass goes, I don't plan on getting any more canon lenses, as I'm saving up to get a K5. And I'm talking more about SOOC, as I'm trying to use photoshop less.

Anvh · 04-23-2012, 11:44 AM

Lighting is pretty much key to colours.
Also the camera has an effect, Canon is often describe as cool while Nikon and Pentax have bit more vibrant colour also lenses render colours different.

For sharpness most lenses are pretty sharp at f/8 however zooms with long range never will be sharp at each ends for real sharpness get a prime lens.
Beside that also camera technique is important.

L33tGreg · 04-23-2012, 12:59 PM - **1 Like**

My suggestion would be learn to shoot in raw and use a raw converter (Aftershot Pro, Lightroom, Aperture, Darktable, etc.). This will give you control of the digital "development" process. Leaving it to the camera is severely limiting.

**TER-OR** · 04-23-2012, 01:13 PM

I tried bumping up the saturation, vibrancy etc. in the K-5 JPG processing and I found the colors were artificial-looking, particularly the reds. Everything was too red for my taste and purple burned with reds... So now I shoot mostly neutral and try to make sure I'm stopped down a bit with most lenses in most conditions - f8 seems like a good compromise.

I have found some old glass gives great colors- the M50 f/2 gives great color response. I'm keeping my eyes open for an A50 1.7 to see if that's a "grail lens" for my style.

benhai · 04-23-2012, 05:14 PM

Originally posted by Tokm

As far as vivid mode goes, I'm not aware of the canon xt having that, at least under that name. If it doesn't have it, is there a workaround with the settings? Or is this a generic term? As far as the glass goes, I don't plan on getting any more canon lenses, as I'm saving up to get a K5. And I'm talking more about SOOC, as I'm trying to use photoshop less.

I'm sure Canon have an option somewhere especially with 350T. Cause my P&S S60 has that option. Canon can boost saturation over other brands. The color will be very strong to most serious photographers but works fine to me for snapshoots.

If no vivid option then you can crack the saturation up, like +2. You can find details here.

Canon Rebel XT

I strongly disagree with you to upgrade your camera. Your 350D with good glass can match any result you see. The money you are going to put in a K-5 will be enough for you to grab two used canon L lenses. I'm not kidding

. Here is the reason.

Blame the Equipment

I even downgrade my K-7 and get better results with used pro lenses.

Tokm · 04-24-2012, 04:09 PM

Originally posted by benhai

I'm sure Canon have an option somewhere especially with 350T. Cause my P&S S60 has that option. Canon can boost saturation over other brands. The color will be very strong to most serious photographers but works fine to me for snapshoots.

If no vivid option then you can crack the saturation up, like +2. You can find details here.

Canon Rebel XT

I strongly disagree with you to upgrade your camera. Your 350D with good glass can match any result you see. The money you are going to put in a K-5 will be enough for you to grab two used canon L lenses. I'm not kidding

. Here is the reason.

Blame the Equipment

I even downgrade my K-7 and get better results with used pro lenses.

My reasons for wanting to upgrade to a k5 are varied, here are a few:

ISO: anything I shoot above ISO 400 becomes too noisy to use. As I do some urbexing, I come across a lot of low light situations, and the noise is unacceptable.
Viewfinder: the viewfinder on my Canon is .49x the K5 is .6x. That's a big difference for me, my eyes are not the greatest. I also hear the viewfinder is brighter
Display: the display on the canon is tiny and useless. The k5's is large and has live view.
Legacy glass: I have my mothers old k1000, and her lenses. I'd like to be able to use them.

benhai · 04-24-2012, 04:53 PM

Daer Tokm:

Then you could be happy by getting a better body

. I tried m42 and pentax M lenses on pentax K-7 and K-x for about 2 years. If you don't mind the step down metering then you'll be fine. Pentax lenses are not that cheap. You'll be surprised to see how much money people wanted for a legacy pentax A, F, FA, DA* lenses. Pentax forum is the best place for pentax stuff in the world. Again what I found is with pentax you'll be involved in heavy post processing with K-7 or maybe others as well. So you'll need to spend money on PS softwares and better PC and a larger monitor. What's more you'll need to spend less of your precious time to take pictures. You might need to struggle days and nights to get the right skin tone or something else but still failed in the end.

Some chips that I have been debugging with had been used by some of the high end DSLRs. Once I tried them I realized why. The high end DSLR did so much for you in hardware rather than software. First is the best sensor, then a better low pass filter. You get a clean raw file instantly from the camera not from the PS. And they can convert the raw to .jpg with smart algorithms to address dynamic range, skin tones etc. NC might not match some features that K-5 provide but the differences are there. I saw and convinced. The difference between pentax and NC are mostly in the understanding of the light spectrum and did it right for you most of the time. An example would be Pentax K10D and Nikon D200. They should share a similar CCD sensor that K10D with 2 data channels and D200 with 4 data channels. Generally people are happier with D200 not the K10D.

I still prefer usable "direct output from .jpg". A legacy lens would help me to get a cleaner picture instantly then with a cheaper lens and PS. I like to spend more time to enjoy the picture taking. I've been doing engineering works day in and day out so I try my best to buy the time for myself. It's not a lot of money at all to get a better tool

. If you enter LBA as many people did in the future then you'll understand me better

.

All the best wishes to you!

Tokm · 04-24-2012, 06:49 PM

I'll probably feel like an idiot when you tell me, but what does LBA stand for? I can't think of it. Thank you for you well thought out replies, you have given me a lot to think about, and taught me 2 new photographic techniques (uniwb and ETTR)

**TER-OR** · 04-25-2012, 08:11 AM

LBA = Lens Buying Addiction. (A grass-is-greener mindset, or a hoarding one)

Tokm · 04-25-2012, 08:26 AM

Originally posted by TER-OR

LBA = Lens Buying Addiction. (A grass-is-greener mindset, or a hoarding one)

That makes sense, thanks

benhai · 04-25-2012, 10:27 AM

Hi Tokm:

That's just my personal ideas and I like to stick with them even I'm wrong sometimes

. There are many parameters your camera provided that can help the picture quality. The camera setting of sRGB and Adobe RGB can make lots of difference with different photo software you are using. Also +2/3 or -2/3 exposure can make great deal with different brands. You'll need some time to settle down the settings you like.

I think you might try borrow a good lens, say a prime to see if you can be satisfied? Or you check a prime lens out on craigslist. DSLR is a system, once you choose a brand then it will be hard to switch.

Regards!

L33tGreg · 04-25-2012, 10:34 AM

Originally posted by benhai

Hi Tokm:

That's just my personal ideas and I like to stick with them even I'm wrong sometimes

. There are many parameters your camera provided that can help the picture quality. The camera setting of sRGB and Adobe RGB can make lots of difference with different photo software you are using. Also +2/3 or -2/3 exposure can make great deal with different brands. You'll need some time to settle down the settings you like.

I think you might try borrow a good lens, say a prime to see if you can be satisfied? Or you check a prime lens out on craigslist. DSLR is a system, once you choose a brand then it will be hard to switch.

Regards!

First, Adobe-RGB vs SRGB doesn't matter if you are shooting RAW. It is a jpeg setting only, Second, there are many great articles about why one should always choose SRGB over ARGB. Not the least of which is that ARGB photos won't show correctly in a web brower!

04-23-2012, 11:07 AM	#1
Tokm New Member Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Baltimore, MD Posts: 14	A couple questions I'm a bit new to photography, and while I have made some pictures that i would consider to be fairly good, I still have a lot to learn. My first question has to do with color, how can I get some really vibrant colors? I have seen pictures taken on drab days that look amazing, but all I get is something that looks drab. The sharpness and detail of things such as the grain of wood on an old barn, how can I get these to be better? Is this a matter of technique, camera, glass, or a mix? I'm currently shooting with a canon 350D and tamron 28-300 f3.5

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04-23-2012, 11:27 AM	#2
benhai Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: California Photos: Albums Posts: 248	I think first you might need to use smaller aperture like 5.6 or 8 to see if the sharpness goes up. Second, you can set your camera's mode to vivid and increase your saturation level. Third make sure you can hold your camera steady. And after all that you'll need to find a better galss. I think Tamron 28-300 f3.5 may not be enough. For canon lenses, my friends are mostly happy with Canon 24-105mm f4 L and the Canon 70-21mm f2.8 IS L. For lenses, you'd get it right the first time, otherwise you'll be spending whole lot of time to do LBA and try to decide which one to keep. I'd like to spend more time on taken pictures right at first time not spend my time on PS or lightroom with raw. Happy shooting!

04-23-2012, 11:34 AM	#3
reed_page Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Shrewsbury, NJ Photos: Gallery Posts: 108	When I take photos in less than optimal conditions. I usually put them through a color enhancer, it tends to get rid of, ' the drab'. Most photo tools will have the ability to manually or automatically change the color settings of your photos. If software came with the camera, you can try that. If not there are freeware programs (i.e. irfanview) that have that functionality. I had an old canon s1-is that every picture came out kind of 'hazy', but the auto correction software that came with it (Photo Studio 5) would correct everything to the point that the photos looked amazing (even under water photos). I try using as little Post Processing as possible, but a lot of photos need it to get the 'Pop' effect.

04-23-2012, 11:42 AM	#4
Tokm New Member Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Baltimore, MD Posts: 14 Original Poster	As far as vivid mode goes, I'm not aware of the canon xt having that, at least under that name. If it doesn't have it, is there a workaround with the settings? Or is this a generic term? As far as the glass goes, I don't plan on getting any more canon lenses, as I'm saving up to get a K5. And I'm talking more about SOOC, as I'm trying to use photoshop less.

04-23-2012, 11:44 AM	#5
Anvh Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2011 Posts: 4,616	Lighting is pretty much key to colours. Also the camera has an effect, Canon is often describe as cool while Nikon and Pentax have bit more vibrant colour also lenses render colours different. For sharpness most lenses are pretty sharp at f/8 however zooms with long range never will be sharp at each ends for real sharpness get a prime lens. Beside that also camera technique is important.

04-23-2012, 12:59 PM - 1 Like	#6
L33tGreg Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Charleston, SC Photos: Gallery Posts: 369	My suggestion would be learn to shoot in raw and use a raw converter (Aftershot Pro, Lightroom, Aperture, Darktable, etc.). This will give you control of the digital "development" process. Leaving it to the camera is severely limiting.

04-23-2012, 01:13 PM	#7
TER-OR Site Supporter Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Dundee, IL Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 6,699	I tried bumping up the saturation, vibrancy etc. in the K-5 JPG processing and I found the colors were artificial-looking, particularly the reds. Everything was too red for my taste and purple burned with reds... So now I shoot mostly neutral and try to make sure I'm stopped down a bit with most lenses in most conditions - f8 seems like a good compromise. I have found some old glass gives great colors- the M50 f/2 gives great color response. I'm keeping my eyes open for an A50 1.7 to see if that's a "grail lens" for my style.

04-23-2012, 05:14 PM	#8
benhai Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: California Photos: Albums Posts: 248	Originally posted by Tokm As far as vivid mode goes, I'm not aware of the canon xt having that, at least under that name. If it doesn't have it, is there a workaround with the settings? Or is this a generic term? As far as the glass goes, I don't plan on getting any more canon lenses, as I'm saving up to get a K5. And I'm talking more about SOOC, as I'm trying to use photoshop less. I'm sure Canon have an option somewhere especially with 350T. Cause my P&S S60 has that option. Canon can boost saturation over other brands. The color will be very strong to most serious photographers but works fine to me for snapshoots. If no vivid option then you can crack the saturation up, like +2. You can find details here. Canon Rebel XT I strongly disagree with you to upgrade your camera. Your 350D with good glass can match any result you see. The money you are going to put in a K-5 will be enough for you to grab two used canon L lenses. I'm not kidding . Here is the reason. Blame the Equipment I even downgrade my K-7 and get better results with used pro lenses.

04-24-2012, 04:09 PM	#9
Tokm New Member Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Baltimore, MD Posts: 14 Original Poster	Originally posted by benhai I'm sure Canon have an option somewhere especially with 350T. Cause my P&S S60 has that option. Canon can boost saturation over other brands. The color will be very strong to most serious photographers but works fine to me for snapshoots. If no vivid option then you can crack the saturation up, like +2. You can find details here. Canon Rebel XT I strongly disagree with you to upgrade your camera. Your 350D with good glass can match any result you see. The money you are going to put in a K-5 will be enough for you to grab two used canon L lenses. I'm not kidding . Here is the reason. Blame the Equipment I even downgrade my K-7 and get better results with used pro lenses. My reasons for wanting to upgrade to a k5 are varied, here are a few: ISO: anything I shoot above ISO 400 becomes too noisy to use. As I do some urbexing, I come across a lot of low light situations, and the noise is unacceptable. Viewfinder: the viewfinder on my Canon is .49x the K5 is .6x. That's a big difference for me, my eyes are not the greatest. I also hear the viewfinder is brighter Display: the display on the canon is tiny and useless. The k5's is large and has live view. Legacy glass: I have my mothers old k1000, and her lenses. I'd like to be able to use them.

04-24-2012, 04:53 PM	#10
benhai Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: California Photos: Albums Posts: 248	Daer Tokm: Then you could be happy by getting a better body . I tried m42 and pentax M lenses on pentax K-7 and K-x for about 2 years. If you don't mind the step down metering then you'll be fine. Pentax lenses are not that cheap. You'll be surprised to see how much money people wanted for a legacy pentax A, F, FA, DA* lenses. Pentax forum is the best place for pentax stuff in the world. Again what I found is with pentax you'll be involved in heavy post processing with K-7 or maybe others as well. So you'll need to spend money on PS softwares and better PC and a larger monitor. What's more you'll need to spend less of your precious time to take pictures. You might need to struggle days and nights to get the right skin tone or something else but still failed in the end. Some chips that I have been debugging with had been used by some of the high end DSLRs. Once I tried them I realized why. The high end DSLR did so much for you in hardware rather than software. First is the best sensor, then a better low pass filter. You get a clean raw file instantly from the camera not from the PS. And they can convert the raw to .jpg with smart algorithms to address dynamic range, skin tones etc. NC might not match some features that K-5 provide but the differences are there. I saw and convinced. The difference between pentax and NC are mostly in the understanding of the light spectrum and did it right for you most of the time. An example would be Pentax K10D and Nikon D200. They should share a similar CCD sensor that K10D with 2 data channels and D200 with 4 data channels. Generally people are happier with D200 not the K10D. I still prefer usable "direct output from .jpg". A legacy lens would help me to get a cleaner picture instantly then with a cheaper lens and PS. I like to spend more time to enjoy the picture taking. I've been doing engineering works day in and day out so I try my best to buy the time for myself. It's not a lot of money at all to get a better tool . If you enter LBA as many people did in the future then you'll understand me better . All the best wishes to you!

04-24-2012, 06:49 PM	#11
Tokm New Member Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Baltimore, MD Posts: 14 Original Poster	I'll probably feel like an idiot when you tell me, but what does LBA stand for? I can't think of it. Thank you for you well thought out replies, you have given me a lot to think about, and taught me 2 new photographic techniques (uniwb and ETTR)

04-25-2012, 08:11 AM	#12
TER-OR Site Supporter Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Dundee, IL Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 6,699	LBA = Lens Buying Addiction. (A grass-is-greener mindset, or a hoarding one)

04-25-2012, 08:26 AM	#13
Tokm New Member Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Baltimore, MD Posts: 14 Original Poster	Originally posted by TER-OR LBA = Lens Buying Addiction. (A grass-is-greener mindset, or a hoarding one) That makes sense, thanks

04-25-2012, 10:27 AM	#14
benhai Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: California Photos: Albums Posts: 248	Hi Tokm: That's just my personal ideas and I like to stick with them even I'm wrong sometimes . There are many parameters your camera provided that can help the picture quality. The camera setting of sRGB and Adobe RGB can make lots of difference with different photo software you are using. Also +2/3 or -2/3 exposure can make great deal with different brands. You'll need some time to settle down the settings you like. I think you might try borrow a good lens, say a prime to see if you can be satisfied? Or you check a prime lens out on craigslist. DSLR is a system, once you choose a brand then it will be hard to switch. Regards!

04-25-2012, 10:34 AM	#15
L33tGreg Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Charleston, SC Photos: Gallery Posts: 369	Originally posted by benhai Hi Tokm: That's just my personal ideas and I like to stick with them even I'm wrong sometimes . There are many parameters your camera provided that can help the picture quality. The camera setting of sRGB and Adobe RGB can make lots of difference with different photo software you are using. Also +2/3 or -2/3 exposure can make great deal with different brands. You'll need some time to settle down the settings you like. I think you might try borrow a good lens, say a prime to see if you can be satisfied? Or you check a prime lens out on craigslist. DSLR is a system, once you choose a brand then it will be hard to switch. Regards! First, Adobe-RGB vs SRGB doesn't matter if you are shooting RAW. It is a jpeg setting only, Second, there are many great articles about why one should always choose SRGB over ARGB. Not the least of which is that ARGB photos won't show correctly in a web brower!