[metaphiston]

I've been taking some insect and flower macros recently and wondered if anyone could offer some guidance on settings and techniques for improvement.

I've been using a Yonguo YN460-II (GN ~28) flash wired off camera with a diffuser with a Sigma 24mm Super-wide II lens (a manual lens) reverse mounted on my K-5.

I typically use 1/180 second at ISO 80 to 200 and aperture f11 to 16 for deep DOF, with enough flash to expose properly and the ISO and aperture adjusted within those modest ranges to compensate for how bright I want the background (ie. more or less flash).

Do those settings strike other macro photographers as sensible? Here are some issues I have.

Some issues and observations:
I find nailing focus with a stopped down aperture very difficult, but stopping down is necessary with a reverse lens. So I shoot lots of frames, but some insects don't stick around long enough to allow me to get focus in the near dark!

In terms of technique, I wait and watch and move slowly, and try to approach slowly, taking pictures as soon as I can check my manual settings are exposing properly. I then improve composition with more frames, creep closer if necessary and take lots of shots trying to get perfect focus.

My reversed lens focused centimetres from a subject. I do have a true macro lens (100mm f4 Pentax-A), though the 24mm reversed can get higher magnification. Just going to have to put up with that issue I suppose.

One thing I have not yet (but would like to) tried is focus stacking multiple frames in photoshop. It seems impossible to do handheld. I'm thinking of using a macro rail, but that would limit my versatility of movement, stop me from getting down to the insects' level and amongst them. Any thoughts on this? Also, if you were focus stacking, what aperture would you shoot at (since DOF for any individual shot is not as much of an issue as you can take more shots to compensate). The sharpest for that lens?

Here are some of my macros with this set-up.

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[Philoslothical]

I'll preface this by saying I'm still rank amateur in macro work, but I thoroughly enjoy it, and experiment at least a few times a week.

I typically use 1/180 second at ISO 80 to 200 and aperture f11 to 16 for deep DOF, with enough flash to expose properly and the ISO and aperture adjusted within those modest ranges to compensate for how bright I want the background (ie. more or less flash).

Do those settings strike other macro photographers as sensible? Here are some issues I have.

Yes, sensible settings, since the X-Sync is 1/180th. I routinely go down to f./22 as well, but mainly to compensate for a fully manual ring flash that is hella bright.

I find nailing focus with a stopped down aperture very difficult

When I use a reversed lens, which isn't often these days, I hold the aperture arm with my finger and let it go at the instant before taking the shot. It doesn't always work, as handheld we sway a lot, but it helps. So, I set the aperture on the lens, hold the arm to keep it wide open, then let it go and shoot when I think I have focus. If you practice this, you should get decent results, but I warn you that my keeper rate with this method is still no better than 1:10.

My reversed lens focused centimetres from a subject. I do have a true macro lens (100mm f4 Pentax-A), though the 24mm reversed can get higher magnification. Just going to have to put up with that issue I suppose.

Reverse the 24 on the 100 for a ridiculous 4:1 @∞? You'd be set, since you can set the aperture on the camera body due to the A series lens. DoF would be razor thin though, too much magnification for handheld, I think.

Anything you don't need the extra magnification for, I'd use the 100mm (it's what, 1:2, right?). I've seen nice results from the 100mm f./4, but I don't own one (yet...). Also, get some A type extension tubes (the ones without contacts, but with aperture linkage - if cost is a factor). You can significantly boost either lens' magnification this way, without additional optics reducing IQ.

I'm sure some of the experts here will have more useful info for you.

[bluestringer]

I too am just an amateur at this macro stuff. I find it very challenging and enjoyable, and I like bugs. I've tried reversing lens, manual tubes and such, but the viewfinder is too dark for me to get good focus. I've got a 100 f4 macro that I use, but it is only 1:2. It is sharp enough that I can crop the image and get a lifesize image on the final jpg. I've now started working with two TC's with the glass removed. I can get the auto aperture with them and working with f8-f16 I can use catch-in-focus. I use all manual settings as I also have a manual ring flash, but for some reason I can not use 1/180 shutter speed. Mine jumps from 1/160 to 1/200, but using 1/160 works fine. I'm using a 50-A f1.7 with the TC tubes. I tried using them with the 100 macro, but I get glare right in the middle of the image for some reason. Haven't figured that one out yet. Works fine with the 50.

[yeatzee]

I'll chime in. I used to use a shutter speed of 1/40 +/- pretty much exclusively. If your using a flash you dont need any faster, and that way you get some ambient light in the shot as well as flash. Aperture wise when stacking I used to pretty much stick to F/5.6. Sometimes I'd go a little smaller but never past F/8

[Philoslothical]

I use all manual settings as I also have a manual ring flash, but for some reason I can not use 1/180 shutter speed. Mine jumps from 1/160 to 1/200, but using 1/160 works fine.

Switch your EV steps from 1/3 stop to 1/2 stop.

[baro-nite]

I find nailing focus with a stopped down aperture very difficult, but stopping down is necessary with a reverse lens. So I shoot lots of frames, but some insects don't stick around long enough to allow me to get focus in the near dark!

Insects are skittish little creatures; this is an issue no matter what the setup. Early morning for cold and/or dew is one way to get them to cooperate more. Finding someplace they gather (food source) and letting them come to you is another.

In terms of technique, I wait and watch and move slowly, and try to approach slowly, taking pictures as soon as I can check my manual settings are exposing properly. I then improve composition with more frames, creep closer if necessary and take lots of shots trying to get perfect focus.

Sounds familiar!

My reversed lens focused centimetres from a subject. I do have a true macro lens (100mm f4 Pentax-A), though the 24mm reversed can get higher magnification. Just going to have to put up with that issue I suppose.

Going beyond 1:1 you are going to have a small working distance with most setups; I suppose the exception would be a 200mm macro lens on extension. With your Pentax-A you'd need lots of extension to get beyond 1:1 and at that point I suspect the viewfinder would get pretty dark also, given the lens's f/4 max aperture. I've done some experimenting with my 70mm and 90mm macro lenses on moderate extension (25 to 50mm) and this is a fair compromise for me. It gets me moderately beyond 1:1 magnification, VF still reasonably bright (lenses are 70/2.8 and 90/2.5), working distance with the 90 on extension somewhat better than a reversed lens.

One thing I have not yet (but would like to) tried is focus stacking multiple frames in photoshop. It seems impossible to do handheld.

On the contrary, it is very possible. Helps if you can prop yourself against something (e.g., the ground) to make it easier to control the camera movements. Take lots of shots. Some (all?) dedicated focus-stacking software will automatically align the images for you. As you say, use the sharpest aperture for the lens, assuming you can take enough shots to get good overlapping coverage with the thinner DOF.

[metaphiston]

Thanks baro-nite, Philoslothical, yeatzee and Bluestringer for your thoughts.

When I use a reversed lens, which isn't often these days, I hold the aperture arm with my finger and let it go at the instant before taking the shot.

Good idea, I'd thought about trying that so will give it a go. Sometimes I can't even find an insect through the dark viewfinder, let alone focus! So holding the aperture arm will help with the broad stuff then I can let go to take shots.

On the contrary, it is very possible. Helps if you can prop yourself against something (e.g., the ground) to make it easier to control the camera movements. Take lots of shots. Some (all?) dedicated focus-stacking software will automatically align the images for you. As you say, use the sharpest aperture for the lens, assuming you can take enough shots to get good overlapping coverage with the thinner DOF.

I'll give this a try too. I reckon it'll take some practice and patience! I'd suspected that a stacking programs auto-alignment function would get messed up by parallax caused by little changes introduced from handholding the camera, but suppose there is a small margin for this without the image being affected and looking weird - experimentation will tell!

[panoguy]

One thing I have not yet (but would like to) tried is focus stacking multiple frames in photoshop. It seems impossible to do handheld.

As baro-nite said above, yes it is quite possible to do handheld. I'm also a rank amateur at macro (okay, I'm below even that), but I've been on the software side of image-processing for decades. Automatic alignment for stacks is easily done these days, but you'll lose some of your image edges to shift (which is usually fine for subjects in the middle of the frame). Another easy thing to do is to set your K-5's Drive Mode to "Continuous Hi(gh)" and actually sway toward your subject while machine-gunning a bunch of frames, rather than manually adjusting the focus or using a rail. Takes some practice (and it helps to use an LED light, not flash), but I've gotten good at it since it's also the way I use fast manual portrait lenses.

[metaphiston]

As baro-nite said above, yes it is quite possible to do handheld. I'm also a rank amateur at macro (okay, I'm below even that), but I've been on the software side of image-processing for decades. Automatic alignment for stacks is easily done these days, but you'll lose some of your image edges to shift (which is usually fine for subjects in the middle of the frame). Another easy thing to do is to set your K-5's Drive Mode to "Continuous Hi(gh)" and actually sway toward your subject while machine-gunning a bunch of frames, rather than manually adjusting the focus or using a rail. Takes some practice (and it helps to use an LED light, not flash), but I've gotten good at it since it's also the way I use fast manual portrait lenses.

Thanks panoguy,

I do portraits with manual lenses too and find I get a slightly frightened looking subject if I machine gun them

My frame rate is indeed limited by my flash's recycle rate, so perhaps continuous light is the way to go here, though the power would be lower. I'll experiment with flash and then see if I need to get one of those LED blocks. I also do video so it would be useful for that too.