Dynamic Range of Pentax 16 mp sensor

Steven Chain · 01-22-2013, 09:07 AM

I've been around long enough to have learned and used Ansel Adams Zone System. The dynamic range of most B&W film was about 9 f-stops, from pure white to pure black. I have a old Zone VI modified Pentax 1 degree spot meter with the zones labeled on it. I have done some research but cannot find the dynamic range of the sensor in my K30 or for a modern CMOS sensor. I found it as being 60-70 db but that means nothing to me. Does anyone know in terms of f-stops the dynamic range of the 16mp sensor Pentax uses? Restated, at a given f-stop and shutter speed how many stops down to pure black and how many up to pure white?

Thanks

Anvh · 01-22-2013, 09:18 AM

It depends on the iso and format you shoot but in RAW at the lowest ISO it would be about 13 Evs of dynamic range captured.

panoguy · 01-22-2013, 09:28 AM

DXO did the measuring for you, but as Anvh points out above, this is under ideal conditions (and shooting in RAW format and post-processing it yourself):

DxOMark - Pentax K-30

**dms** · 01-22-2013, 09:53 AM

DXOMark values do not fit directly into zone system as there is usually considerably wide range below zone 5 than above--likely best if you take a gray card and take a range of exposures to find out for yourself and then rerate the speed/apply ev adjust. (Amazing what you can do with almost instant feedback of digital. _

Steven Chain · 01-22-2013, 09:58 AM

Originally posted by Anvh

It depends on the iso and format you shoot but in RAW at the lowest ISO it would be about 13 Evs of dynamic range captured.

My interest is landscape - camera on the tripod with lots of opportunity to fiddle with settings, so low ISO and raw is usually a given. Thanks for the info.

wombat2go · 01-22-2013, 10:02 AM

On the output monitor, if sRGB, we have a range of 8 EV on each of the 3 channels.
View the complete color range for rgb() integer values

foto guy · 01-22-2013, 10:51 AM

Keep in mind the DR of the sensor will likely differ from that of a given monitor, as well as printed on paper.

carrrlangas · 01-22-2013, 10:56 AM

Originally posted by Anvh

It depends on the iso and format you shoot but in RAW at the lowest ISO it would be about 13 Evs of dynamic range captured.

Hi Anvh. Yo seem to know a lot about this. I tried to follow this on ther threads but everyvody talks about it as a "given" (is it said like that in english?).
How do you get to play with this 13Ev? Be it on LR or PS, how exactly do you get the 13Ev on a single picture? Layers and adjusting different exposure values for each? does 13Ev means you can change exposure with acceptable noise levels increase?

thanks,
Francisco

Anvh · 01-22-2013, 11:28 AM

There are few kinks in the cable of course.

The problem is that sensor is a linear (like) capturing device so that means the darker the part gets in the image the less information there will be captured. (this answer your noise question)
So of those 13 EVs captured not everything is useful.
Then there is the format it's displayed on, most monitors give you about 9 to 10 EVs and paper is about 6 to 7 EVs

As for the adjustments.
You need to play with the curves or the exposure settings like highlight adjustments, blacks and contrast.
But you're always playing with it really.

bit about ETTR that shows you a bit about what the linear information capturing i mean.
http://schewephoto.com/ETTR/index.html

If you like HDR you can look on google for pseudo HDR, that's HDR made from 1 image.
http://layersmagazine.com/hdr-in-lightroom.html

Na Horuk · 01-22-2013, 01:21 PM

Film and digital are quite different mediums. Another problem is that different softwares will interpret your raw files differently. They handle noise and other settings differently from each other.
There are also techniques like "HDR" and tonemapping that you can use to get more data to play with or to at least give the appearance. Good luck

civiletti · 01-22-2013, 02:21 PM

Post-production allows us to adjust the 14-stop image to fit the dynamic range of a monitor or print. This is not so different from developing and printing a B+W negative to preserve shadow and highlight detail. It's just dry and less stinky. Adams would be shooting digital today.

Steven Chain · 01-22-2013, 04:20 PM

That is the final detail I needed to hear.
Thanks to everyone who helped me with my question.

01-22-2013, 09:07 AM	#1
Steven Chain Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2013 Posts: 27	Dynamic Range of Pentax 16 mp sensor I've been around long enough to have learned and used Ansel Adams Zone System. The dynamic range of most B&W film was about 9 f-stops, from pure white to pure black. I have a old Zone VI modified Pentax 1 degree spot meter with the zones labeled on it. I have done some research but cannot find the dynamic range of the sensor in my K30 or for a modern CMOS sensor. I found it as being 60-70 db but that means nothing to me. Does anyone know in terms of f-stops the dynamic range of the 16mp sensor Pentax uses? Restated, at a given f-stop and shutter speed how many stops down to pure black and how many up to pure white? Thanks

01-22-2013, 11:28 AM	#9
Anvh Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2011 Posts: 4,616	There are few kinks in the cable of course. The problem is that sensor is a linear (like) capturing device so that means the darker the part gets in the image the less information there will be captured. (this answer your noise question) So of those 13 EVs captured not everything is useful. Then there is the format it's displayed on, most monitors give you about 9 to 10 EVs and paper is about 6 to 7 EVs As for the adjustments. You need to play with the curves or the exposure settings like highlight adjustments, blacks and contrast. But you're always playing with it really. bit about ETTR that shows you a bit about what the linear information capturing i mean. http://schewephoto.com/ETTR/index.html If you like HDR you can look on google for pseudo HDR, that's HDR made from 1 image. http://layersmagazine.com/hdr-in-lightroom.html Last edited by Anvh; 01-22-2013 at 11:45 AM.

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01-22-2013, 09:18 AM	#2
Anvh Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2011 Posts: 4,616	It depends on the iso and format you shoot but in RAW at the lowest ISO it would be about 13 Evs of dynamic range captured.

01-22-2013, 09:28 AM	#3
panoguy Pentaxian Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Washington, D.C. Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 3,327	DXO did the measuring for you, but as Anvh points out above, this is under ideal conditions (and shooting in RAW format and post-processing it yourself): DxOMark - Pentax K-30

01-22-2013, 09:53 AM	#4
dms Site Supporter Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: New York, NY Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,192	DXOMark values do not fit directly into zone system as there is usually considerably wide range below zone 5 than above--likely best if you take a gray card and take a range of exposures to find out for yourself and then rerate the speed/apply ev adjust. (Amazing what you can do with almost instant feedback of digital. _

01-22-2013, 09:58 AM	#5
Steven Chain Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2013 Posts: 27 Original Poster	Originally posted by Anvh It depends on the iso and format you shoot but in RAW at the lowest ISO it would be about 13 Evs of dynamic range captured. My interest is landscape - camera on the tripod with lots of opportunity to fiddle with settings, so low ISO and raw is usually a given. Thanks for the info.

01-22-2013, 10:02 AM	#6
wombat2go Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Michigan Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,207	On the output monitor, if sRGB, we have a range of 8 EV on each of the 3 channels. View the complete color range for rgb() integer values

01-22-2013, 10:51 AM	#7
foto guy Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Vernon, Connecticut Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 292	Keep in mind the DR of the sensor will likely differ from that of a given monitor, as well as printed on paper.

01-22-2013, 10:56 AM	#8
carrrlangas Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: Joensuu (Finland) Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,761	Originally posted by Anvh It depends on the iso and format you shoot but in RAW at the lowest ISO it would be about 13 Evs of dynamic range captured. Hi Anvh. Yo seem to know a lot about this. I tried to follow this on ther threads but everyvody talks about it as a "given" (is it said like that in english?). How do you get to play with this 13Ev? Be it on LR or PS, how exactly do you get the 13Ev on a single picture? Layers and adjusting different exposure values for each? does 13Ev means you can change exposure with acceptable noise levels increase? thanks, Francisco

01-22-2013, 01:21 PM	#10
Na Horuk Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Slovenia, probably Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 11,186	Film and digital are quite different mediums. Another problem is that different softwares will interpret your raw files differently. They handle noise and other settings differently from each other. There are also techniques like "HDR" and tonemapping that you can use to get more data to play with or to at least give the appearance. Good luck

01-22-2013, 02:21 PM	#11
civiletti Pentaxian Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Oregon Photos: Albums Posts: 1,435	Post-production allows us to adjust the 14-stop image to fit the dynamic range of a monitor or print. This is not so different from developing and printing a B+W negative to preserve shadow and highlight detail. It's just dry and less stinky. Adams would be shooting digital today.

01-22-2013, 04:20 PM	#12
Steven Chain Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2013 Posts: 27 Original Poster	That is the final detail I needed to hear. Thanks to everyone who helped me with my question.