Frustrated at Not Getting Better

kenafein · 03-07-2013, 08:44 AM - **4 Likes**

Keep at it. You are your own worst critic at this stage.

**Lowell Goudge** · 03-07-2013, 08:56 AM

Originally posted by normhead

You need to cut down those bushes.... they really detract from the scene in that one, that plus the huge black area with no detail. Bracket, if you can't get shadow detail with one exposure, go HDR. In landscapes, shadow detail is important. For landscape, clutter ruins more photographs than just about anything else. In travelled areas, find the spot where everyone else has set up their tripod. In less travelled areas get off path and find "the spot". Or as I used to say to my students, move around , try high and low tripod settings, lie on the floor or climb trees, find the unique angle everyone else is too lazy to look for..

The other piece of really good advice.... "if you don't like your pictures, move closer to your subject." Who said it escapes me at the moment.

norm

good points all around. as for the quote, I also forget who said it, but I think you haven't got it quite right, I think it goes, "when you think you are close enough, move closer still" but then again, i too could be wrong.

**Lowell Goudge** · 03-07-2013, 09:02 AM

for the OP, if you want to improve, you need to force yourself to shoot what you wouldn't normally want to shoot, force yourself to use different focal lengths, lighting etc. shooting the same thing over and over will potentially degrade your skills, because you can rapidly fall into the trap of always shooting the same way.

your skills improve with the use of variety.

this is why, for example, when I shoot for myself (and i have been at it 30+ years now) i like to shoot with manual focus primes. I will take 1 or 2 out with me and I am forced to see the world through those 2 focal lengths. You get a whole different perspective on what you shoot, how you shoot, and what is important, when you have only 1 or 2 options.

mrNewt · 03-07-2013, 09:03 AM

Originally posted by kenafein

Keep at it. You are your own worst critic at this stage.

... quite an accurate graphic

D4rknezz · 03-07-2013, 09:05 AM

Hm...are you using the same post treatment for all these photos? very heavy blue and red there...
If you dont go out of your comfort zone with edits - the pictures will look similar. Even if it was a portrait, this purplish tinge to your picture is going to take main focus.

Gareth.Ig · 03-07-2013, 09:17 AM

Originally posted by chesebert

I am increasing frustrated at my lack of progress. I have been seriously getting into photography for close to a year now. Been reading through threads in this section and searching through the net on shooting/PS techniques. I think I understand basic composition rules and I do try to apply them. I can hit fairly consistent shot-to-shot exposures if I don't go too fast and my shots are generally technically ok, IMO. However, I am looking back through the shots I have taken and wonder why haven't I been able to take better photographs.

I have been trying to look more and click less, use only one lens, etc. However, I am not getting better - getting frustrated! How do I improve?

I took this shot almost a year ago, and I don't think I am any better today

I'm right there with you my friend. We should start the "Technically capable, artistically challenged" photographers club.

Docrwm · 03-07-2013, 09:50 AM

Originally posted by Nass

1 year is quite a short time, especially if you're not doing a lot of looking and just shooting. What I mean by this is that it's really worth looking at good photos and study what actually makes them work so well. Because once you know what makes photos work, then you'll know what to do yourself, what to avoid etc. This probably sounds trite and silly but it works for me.

I think that is excellent advice. Despite last weekends fiasco, I think that reviewing photos for the PEG has really helped me refine what it is that I think works, shown me things I never would have thought of before, and helped force me to articulate (sometimes) why I think a photo doesn't work as well as it could. There has been a steady stream of photos and I think I learn something from nearly every one of them (more from some).

chesebert · 03-07-2013, 10:26 AM - **1 Like**

I think I will shoot straight JPEG for a few days, so I don't dither around with PP. Will try the 5 bracket 3 stop technique. I am already only taking out 1-2 lens at a time.

The purple/blue tint is a function of the dust/smog in the air - I think it's something to do with polarization. I don't particularly wish for it, it just looks like that after a curve is applied. I don't think my portrait/street has that look

chesebert · 03-07-2013, 10:30 AM

Originally posted by Nass

1 year is quite a short time, especially if you're not doing a lot of looking and just shooting. What I mean by this is that it's really worth looking at good photos and study what actually makes them work so well. Because once you know what makes photos work, then you'll know what to do yourself, what to avoid etc. This probably sounds trite and silly but it works for me.

Where can I get this level of analysis from?

joe.penn · 03-07-2013, 10:53 AM - **1 Like**

Study, Study, Study!

Study other peoples work, study the effects of light and exposure, study your subject matter - spend 5x more time with study than pressing the shutter button of your camera body. Take notes out in the field, study the notes, jot down (or record) notes pertaining to your equipment (hot spots of your lenses, etc..) and study those. Pick peoples brains across different forums, take notes of their replies - frequent galleries, take notes, study those. Subscribe to photography magazines, the actual print editions, tear out pages, keep and use those as reference material, read and study often. Troll the net, find some online portfolios of top end artists, subscribe to their feeds (twitter, email, etc..) and study their work and contributions to the community.

Here's a guarantee right now -> Visualize a composition that you may want to shoot somewhere this weekend, once you visualize it, troll the net and find something similar, spend 5 STRAIGHT HOURS of study on the HOW then go out and make your work - I guarantee you that you will see an improvement.

kenafein · 03-07-2013, 11:02 AM

Originally posted by chesebert

I think I will shoot straight JPEG for a few days, so I don't dither around with PP. Will try the 5 bracket 3 stop technique. I am already only taking out 1-2 lens at a time.

The purple/blue tint is a function of the dust/smog in the air - I think it's something to do with polarization. I don't particularly wish for it, it just looks like that after a curve is applied. I don't think my portrait/street has that look

Personally, I think you are quite good. Everyone can get better. The Old Man shot is excellent. I have not delved into serious landscape photography. I know it is a different animal, but I would be happy with your sample image from the original post (for awhile at least). Take the advice offered here and don't lose your drive to improve.

I do understand your frustration. There is one photographer on here, who started after me, and she quickly progressed and takes very compelling and beautiful shots, way beyond my current capabilities; but I'm going to keep progressing at my own pace. Keep having fun, that's the important thing.

chesebert · 03-07-2013, 11:05 AM

Originally posted by joe.penn

Study, Study, Study!

Study other peoples work, study the effects of light and exposure, study your subject matter - spend 5x more time with study than pressing the shutter button of your camera body. Take notes out in the field, study the notes, jot down (or record) notes pertaining to your equipment (hot spots of your lenses, etc..) and study those. Pick peoples brains across different forums, take notes of their replies - frequent galleries, take notes, study those. Subscribe to photography magazines, the actual print editions, tear out pages, keep and use those as reference material, read and study often. Troll the net, find some online portfolios of top end artists, subscribe to their feeds (twitter, email, etc..) and study their work and contributions to the community.

Any recommendations?

**Lowell Goudge** · 03-07-2013, 11:13 AM

Originally posted by chesebert

I think I will shoot straight JPEG for a few days, so I don't dither around with PP. Will try the 5 bracket 3 stop technique. I am already only taking out 1-2 lens at a time.

The purple/blue tint is a function of the dust/smog in the air - I think it's something to do with polarization. I don't particularly wish for it, it just looks like that after a curve is applied. I don't think my portrait/street has that look

shots are not too bad, one thing you might consider, would be to use a wider aperture. the old man shot, for example is quite a good expression but I personally would prefer it if the background was not as sharp, it would isolate the old man better

i did this in a few seconds with Paint Shop Photo Pro, (Version X5) and using a selection of all but the old man (hand drawn quickly) and the shoften feature

TenZ.NL · 03-07-2013, 11:15 AM

And last but not least: have fun, enjoy your photography. Nothing is more killing than frustration. Tickle yourself, find new area`s to explore, think out of the box and enjoy.

johnyates · 03-07-2013, 11:27 AM

Originally posted by chesebert

However, I am not getting better

I think the two recent shots you show look pretty good, and that perhaps you're being too hard on yourself. Is this a case of Perfect is the enemy of good - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ?

There is no such thing as a perfect photograph--you will always find at least one fault with every image you produce--that's just the way it is.

By all means, self-critique your work and learn, and apply what you learn to your next photo. You can't help but to get better.

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03-07-2013, 08:44 AM - 4 Likes	#16
kenafein Veteran Member Join Date: May 2011 Location: Southern California Photos: Albums Posts: 4,082	Keep at it. You are your own worst critic at this stage.

03-07-2013, 08:56 AM	#17
Lowell Goudge Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Toronto Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 17,888	Originally posted by normhead You need to cut down those bushes.... they really detract from the scene in that one, that plus the huge black area with no detail. Bracket, if you can't get shadow detail with one exposure, go HDR. In landscapes, shadow detail is important. For landscape, clutter ruins more photographs than just about anything else. In travelled areas, find the spot where everyone else has set up their tripod. In less travelled areas get off path and find "the spot". Or as I used to say to my students, move around , try high and low tripod settings, lie on the floor or climb trees, find the unique angle everyone else is too lazy to look for.. The other piece of really good advice.... "if you don't like your pictures, move closer to your subject." Who said it escapes me at the moment. norm good points all around. as for the quote, I also forget who said it, but I think you haven't got it quite right, I think it goes, "when you think you are close enough, move closer still" but then again, i too could be wrong.

03-07-2013, 09:02 AM	#18
Lowell Goudge Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Toronto Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 17,888	for the OP, if you want to improve, you need to force yourself to shoot what you wouldn't normally want to shoot, force yourself to use different focal lengths, lighting etc. shooting the same thing over and over will potentially degrade your skills, because you can rapidly fall into the trap of always shooting the same way. your skills improve with the use of variety. this is why, for example, when I shoot for myself (and i have been at it 30+ years now) i like to shoot with manual focus primes. I will take 1 or 2 out with me and I am forced to see the world through those 2 focal lengths. You get a whole different perspective on what you shoot, how you shoot, and what is important, when you have only 1 or 2 options.

03-07-2013, 09:03 AM	#19
mrNewt Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: ON, RH Posts: 2,181	Originally posted by kenafein Keep at it. You are your own worst critic at this stage. ... quite an accurate graphic

03-07-2013, 09:05 AM	#20
D4rknezz Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 1,196	Hm...are you using the same post treatment for all these photos? very heavy blue and red there... If you dont go out of your comfort zone with edits - the pictures will look similar. Even if it was a portrait, this purplish tinge to your picture is going to take main focus.

03-07-2013, 09:17 AM	#21
Gareth.Ig Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: Cochrane, AB Photos: Gallery Posts: 508	Originally posted by chesebert I am increasing frustrated at my lack of progress. I have been seriously getting into photography for close to a year now. Been reading through threads in this section and searching through the net on shooting/PS techniques. I think I understand basic composition rules and I do try to apply them. I can hit fairly consistent shot-to-shot exposures if I don't go too fast and my shots are generally technically ok, IMO. However, I am looking back through the shots I have taken and wonder why haven't I been able to take better photographs. I have been trying to look more and click less, use only one lens, etc. However, I am not getting better - getting frustrated! How do I improve? I took this shot almost a year ago, and I don't think I am any better today I'm right there with you my friend. We should start the "Technically capable, artistically challenged" photographers club.

03-07-2013, 09:50 AM	#22
Docrwm Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Somewhere in the Southern US Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 12,285	Originally posted by Nass 1 year is quite a short time, especially if you're not doing a lot of looking and just shooting. What I mean by this is that it's really worth looking at good photos and study what actually makes them work so well. Because once you know what makes photos work, then you'll know what to do yourself, what to avoid etc. This probably sounds trite and silly but it works for me. I think that is excellent advice. Despite last weekends fiasco, I think that reviewing photos for the PEG has really helped me refine what it is that I think works, shown me things I never would have thought of before, and helped force me to articulate (sometimes) why I think a photo doesn't work as well as it could. There has been a steady stream of photos and I think I learn something from nearly every one of them (more from some).

03-07-2013, 10:26 AM - 1 Like	#23
chesebert Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: Chicago Photos: Gallery Posts: 360 Original Poster	I think I will shoot straight JPEG for a few days, so I don't dither around with PP. Will try the 5 bracket 3 stop technique. I am already only taking out 1-2 lens at a time. The purple/blue tint is a function of the dust/smog in the air - I think it's something to do with polarization. I don't particularly wish for it, it just looks like that after a curve is applied. I don't think my portrait/street has that look

03-07-2013, 10:30 AM	#24
chesebert Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: Chicago Photos: Gallery Posts: 360 Original Poster	Originally posted by Nass 1 year is quite a short time, especially if you're not doing a lot of looking and just shooting. What I mean by this is that it's really worth looking at good photos and study what actually makes them work so well. Because once you know what makes photos work, then you'll know what to do yourself, what to avoid etc. This probably sounds trite and silly but it works for me. Where can I get this level of analysis from?

03-07-2013, 10:53 AM - 1 Like	#25
joe.penn Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Maryland (Right Outside Washington DC) Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 2,902	Study, Study, Study! Study other peoples work, study the effects of light and exposure, study your subject matter - spend 5x more time with study than pressing the shutter button of your camera body. Take notes out in the field, study the notes, jot down (or record) notes pertaining to your equipment (hot spots of your lenses, etc..) and study those. Pick peoples brains across different forums, take notes of their replies - frequent galleries, take notes, study those. Subscribe to photography magazines, the actual print editions, tear out pages, keep and use those as reference material, read and study often. Troll the net, find some online portfolios of top end artists, subscribe to their feeds (twitter, email, etc..) and study their work and contributions to the community. Here's a guarantee right now -> Visualize a composition that you may want to shoot somewhere this weekend, once you visualize it, troll the net and find something similar, spend 5 STRAIGHT HOURS of study on the HOW then go out and make your work - I guarantee you that you will see an improvement.

03-07-2013, 11:02 AM	#26
kenafein Veteran Member Join Date: May 2011 Location: Southern California Photos: Albums Posts: 4,082	Originally posted by chesebert I think I will shoot straight JPEG for a few days, so I don't dither around with PP. Will try the 5 bracket 3 stop technique. I am already only taking out 1-2 lens at a time. The purple/blue tint is a function of the dust/smog in the air - I think it's something to do with polarization. I don't particularly wish for it, it just looks like that after a curve is applied. I don't think my portrait/street has that look Personally, I think you are quite good. Everyone can get better. The Old Man shot is excellent. I have not delved into serious landscape photography. I know it is a different animal, but I would be happy with your sample image from the original post (for awhile at least). Take the advice offered here and don't lose your drive to improve. I do understand your frustration. There is one photographer on here, who started after me, and she quickly progressed and takes very compelling and beautiful shots, way beyond my current capabilities; but I'm going to keep progressing at my own pace. Keep having fun, that's the important thing.

03-07-2013, 11:05 AM	#27
chesebert Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: Chicago Photos: Gallery Posts: 360 Original Poster	Originally posted by joe.penn Study, Study, Study! Study other peoples work, study the effects of light and exposure, study your subject matter - spend 5x more time with study than pressing the shutter button of your camera body. Take notes out in the field, study the notes, jot down (or record) notes pertaining to your equipment (hot spots of your lenses, etc..) and study those. Pick peoples brains across different forums, take notes of their replies - frequent galleries, take notes, study those. Subscribe to photography magazines, the actual print editions, tear out pages, keep and use those as reference material, read and study often. Troll the net, find some online portfolios of top end artists, subscribe to their feeds (twitter, email, etc..) and study their work and contributions to the community. Any recommendations?

03-07-2013, 11:13 AM	#28
Lowell Goudge Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Toronto Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 17,888	Originally posted by chesebert I think I will shoot straight JPEG for a few days, so I don't dither around with PP. Will try the 5 bracket 3 stop technique. I am already only taking out 1-2 lens at a time. The purple/blue tint is a function of the dust/smog in the air - I think it's something to do with polarization. I don't particularly wish for it, it just looks like that after a curve is applied. I don't think my portrait/street has that look shots are not too bad, one thing you might consider, would be to use a wider aperture. the old man shot, for example is quite a good expression but I personally would prefer it if the background was not as sharp, it would isolate the old man better i did this in a few seconds with Paint Shop Photo Pro, (Version X5) and using a selection of all but the old man (hand drawn quickly) and the shoften feature

03-07-2013, 11:15 AM	#29
TenZ.NL Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Below sealevel Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 1,100	And last but not least: have fun, enjoy your photography. Nothing is more killing than frustration. Tickle yourself, find new area`s to explore, think out of the box and enjoy.

03-07-2013, 11:27 AM	#30
johnyates Pentaxian Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Saskatoon, SK Photos: Albums Posts: 1,345	Originally posted by chesebert However, I am not getting better I think the two recent shots you show look pretty good, and that perhaps you're being too hard on yourself. Is this a case of Perfect is the enemy of good - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ? There is no such thing as a perfect photograph--you will always find at least one fault with every image you produce--that's just the way it is. By all means, self-critique your work and learn, and apply what you learn to your next photo. You can't help but to get better.