[LeoTaylor]

Ritz camera still sells Pentax and they are all over my state. OTOH, only once have I bought a camera from them. I knew my wife longed for a DSLR that could accept all her K1000 lenses. I wasn't going to mail order the just introduced istD without trying one of my manual lenses on it. So I headed to a Brick and Mortar Ritz store and tried a demo with a lens I brought with me. It worked, I bought it for an awful lot of money.

Since then I've used B&H through the mail.

Little did I know once she attached her Pentax 50mm f2.8 macro to the istD she would not remove it for fear of dust on the sensor.

Eventually I bought her a K100D so she could try her first autofocus lens after 25+ years of SLR photography! She will interchange lenses on the K100D or K1000, but the istD is her permanent macro flower/butterfly/bee/etc camera.

[ryan s]

Come here and you'll break a sweat in the comfort of your home. 150 degrees in the shade... I was going to post a smiling emote, but the more I think about it, the less funny it seems.

Perhaps this would do the job?

[lodi781]

.....And just found out that ritz photo is dropping pentax, atleast the one near me. Now it's official, there is only one store within an hour radius that will still stock pentax ( i called and checked) The store owner said that they are hoping that hoya does a better job with the company, which is why they are holding on. they said when Hoya bought pentax, they fired a whole lot of people. I guess we'll have to wait and see....

[stewart_photo]

(snip)... The absence of a real marketing strategy from Pentax has resulted in the competition (and their customers/dealers) being allowed to define the Pentax brand. ...(snip)... The camera store isn't going to support a brand that doesn't get near the return/volume the other brands give them, especially when Pentax themselves doesn't support their products (market-wise). ...(snip)... It breaks my heart not to see a great marketing strategy.

Pentax USA purchases full-page advertisements (occasionally two or three) each month in every major photography-related magazine, including Popular Photography, Shutterbug, and so on. And, like other companies, they have a program to provide publications with products for evaluation before release with feedback aggressively sought. They also purchase televison air time for commercials, often two or three simultaneously rotated through the major networks each month to reach different markets. They have a strong web presence. And finally, Pentax USA offers competitive prices with ongoing rebates. If all that isn't sufficient, what else would you have the company do?

What Pentax USA cannot do is force retail stores to carry Pentax products. Most of those stores operate on a fixed budget, already heavily allocated to Canon and Nikon products. With that investment made, adding a third major product line at this point would be a huge financial burden, especially in the face of declining sales due to competition from online retailers. To avoid that, most stores now feature one or two major product lines, a very limited selection of the latest key products (camera & one or two lenses) from other manufacturers, and whatever they can get cheap at the moment to attract customers, often offered through advertised specials. Those marketplace realities have proven to be very fustrating for Pentax reps seeking to gain product presence in those same retail stores.

stewart

[navcom]

Pentax USA purchases full-page advertisements (occasionally two or three) each month in every major photography-related magazine, including Popular Photography, Shutterbug, and so on. And, like other companies, they have a program to provide publications with products for evaluation before release with feedback aggressively sought. They also purchase televison air time for commercials, often two or three simultaneously rotated through the major networks each month to reach different markets. They have a strong web presence. And finally, Pentax USA offers competitive prices with ongoing rebates. If all that isn't sufficient, what else would you have the company do?

What Pentax USA cannot do is force retail stores to carry Pentax products. Most of those stores operate on a fixed budget, already heavily allocated to Canon and Nikon products. With that investment made, adding a third major product line at this point would be a huge financial burden, especially in the face of declining sales due to competition from online retailers. To avoid that, most stores now feature one or two major product lines, a very limited selection of the latest key products (camera & one or two lenses) from other manufacturers, and whatever they can get cheap at the moment to attract customers, often offered through advertised specials. Those marketplace realities have proven to be very fustrating for Pentax reps seeking to gain product presence in those same retail stores.

stewart

Good points, especially about the frustration for Pentax reps. Now I'm far from an expert on the inner workings of camera companies! But from my vantage point alot of the frustrations seem to come from the parent's marketing strategy. You can spend billions on ads and not say anything. Nobody said it would be easy. IMO, they just need some focus (no pun intended! ) They are up against the Nikanon juggernaut. Nikon and Canon are bigger companies with bigger war chests. They have a much more defined image and public perception in the modern day (the average consumer hasn't a clue about Pentax's history). But being the smaller guy isn't always a bad thing.

For decades, Apple Computers has had to fight against the IBM-compatible juggernaut. It's not because they have inferior products. I'm not positive, but I'm willing to bet their marketing budget is not as high as several other of their larger PC competitors (iPhones not included). But everyone knows Apple. They have done a great job targeting their nitche and driving home their brand name. And if you ask anyone who owns a Mac, they are fiercely loyal (not unlike us Pentaxians, eh?). Why? Yes, they think their Mac is superior, but there is also this sense to them that they are a bit rebellious. They view themselves as being an intelligent consumer (comparing and buying based on value), not just a fad follower. Sound familiar fellow Pentaxians? I love their new ads comparing themselves to the error-prone PC guy! That's brand marketing with a focus!

When a large company begins to lack focus, the competitors are left to define them. IMO, this is what has happened with Pentax. Maybe it's just the area I live in, but I've never seen a Pentax TV ad. I have seen Canon and Nikon ads. To anyone living in my neck of the woods, Nikons and Canons are cameras. Pentax? Who are they? Oh, that's right...that third-rate company that makes inferior products...at least that's what my Nikanon sales rep tells me.

Pentax should be the "Apple" of the camera world. Make their distinction, find their absolute nitche, craft a "get-to-know-us" marketing strategy, and DRIVE IT HOME! Retailers will want to sell them. They already have great products! And great products produced WITHOUT the Nikanon budgets! They have an advantage already!

[ftpaddict]

Yes, they think their Mac is superior, but there is also this sense to them that they are a bit rebellious. They view themselves as being an intelligent consumer (comparing and buying based on value), not just a fad follower.

I see them as snobby hipsters, because that's exactly how their ads portray their image. (seriously.. how many videos can a person make before replacing their eyes with Cadbury eggs out of sheer boredom?)

An intelligent consumer would pick Linux over everything else because it's just as (if not more) powerful than any Windows or OS X, is even LESS mainstream, and it makes you feel rebellious by not having to pay for squat and still get a fully functional computer!

Scratch that last part, it makes people say "HA HA, what a dork!"
also
Using a Pentax makes Canikonians say "HA HA, what a dork!"

hint hint hint

Pentax needs to poke their head out a little more, saying "Lookie what I can do! Betcha you ain't never seen that anywhere else before. I'm a loaded battleship and cost as much as an inflatable raft". Because nowadays saying "Lookie what I used to do!" doesn't stretch as far as it did back in the day.

Basically Pentax must not go the way of the Jaguar(those that go vroom vroom) who struggled to preserve whatever heritage they had. Forward thinking and aggressive elbow shuffling is the only way to go in the world of today.


Just my 2 cents worth; VAT included.

PS: PLEASE let's not start a Mac VS PC vs Linux analogy in this thread.

[séamuis]

I'm a loaded battleship and cost as much as an inflatable raft".

honest to god I just lost some of my mountain dew reading that line. thats funny as hell and oh so true. very clever Dan, very clever.

[reeftool]

The Ritz store near me is also no longer stocking Pentax even though they always sold out almost as soon as they got them in stock. Makes a lot of sense to no longer sell a good moving product. If you want one they will order it but how many people are going to buy something they have never seen or picked up? My guess is that Pentax isn't giving them as much kickback.

[séamuis]

My guess is that Pentax isn't giving them as much kickback.

what evidence is there to prove that pentax ever gave them kickbacks?

the situation is rather simple I think. brick & mortar camera stores are quickly being pushed by the wayside by large stocking high volume online retailers and the smaller companies with smaller market share and brand recognition are going to be the first to be dropped by these traditional stores. its just not cost effective to stock and sell there products, unfortunately Pentax is currently one of those companies. with recent activity by the Hoya Corp. & Pentax USA (firing of sales reps and lack of advertising) will only help cement peoples decisions to not stock Pentax in their stores. hopefully Hoya & Pentax can help resolve this very soon.

[ftpaddict]

honest to god I just lost some of my mountain dew reading that line. thats funny as hell and oh so true. very clever Dan, very clever.

Don't drink Mountain Dew.

[stewart_photo]

(snip)... But from my vantage point alot of the frustrations seem to come from the parent's marketing strategy. You can spend billions on ads and not say anything. ...(snip)... Pentax should be the "Apple" of the camera world. ...(snip)

Actually, the parent company (Hoya/Pentax Japan) doesn't really offer a specific marketing plan. Instead, that's left up to the individual subsidiaries (Pentax USA, Pentax Germany, etc.), and the advertising agencies working for those subsidiaries, located throughout the world. The purpose is to allow each to configure their marketing approach to the individual markets. What works in Japan, for example, will not likely work in the USA. During that, the parent company is building hardware which will hopefully sell well in an international marketplace - sell as well in the USA as Europe, Japan, and elsewhere.

Several factors conspired over the last several decades to work against Pentax. In the 1980's, for example, Pentax didn't have the engineers needed to respond well to the shift from mechanical to electromechanical cameras (auto-focus, etc). They were slow to obtain the hardware and software engineers needed to introduce computer hardware into their cameras during the 1990's. And, of course, Pentax was bit late and a bit short in the switch to digital imaging during the earliest part of this decade. One can point the finger of blame for all this in many different directions, including compliancy and shortsightedness by the previous heads of the company.

And the lack of focus you describe played a role as well. During the last couple of decades, Pentax focused more on it's medical imaging division than it's camera division since many of the decision makers at the company felt medical imaging, not cameras, was the future of Pentax. As a result, the camera division took a backseat in finances for R&D, manufacturing, distribution, and marketing. Thanks to some political wrangling within the company, that changed with the introduction of the K10D. However, I don't believe we've yet seen the end to that lack of focus since Hoya, just like Pentax in the past, is more interested in medical imaging than cameras. Indeed, that (medical imageing equipment) is reported to be the very reason Hoya purchased Pentax, with rumors the camera division was slated for shutdown shortly after the merger. Strong sales of the previous models perhaps prevented that shutdown, while hopefully strong sales of the current models will do the same.

That said, to end on an upbeat tone, we must also look at the fact that Pentax sales have increased enough over the last 18 months to place the company in a strong, but wavering, third-place position - behind Canon and Nikon, but well ahead of perhaps a dozen other camera manufacturers, including financial juggernauts like Sony. That in itself is a considerable accomplishment considering the company's position two years ago as just another in the herd of wannabes.

By the way, I sincerely hope Pentax doesn't follow Apple's example. A few decades ago (1979-83), prior to and just after IBM and Microsoft's entrance into the arena, Apple totally dominated the personal computer market. A series of missteps (Apple III versus original IBM PC, etc), poor management decisions (the original Mac - B&W, limited RAM, no hard drive), bullheadedness on the part of senior management (Jobs & the original Mac versus Apple II), combined with high prices and horrible marketing, chewed away at that lead to the point where Apple remained as nothing more than a nitche player in the overall market. Apple has since made a bit of a comeback, but not nearly as impressive to me as that by Pentax over the last few months.

stewart

[séamuis]

warning, opinion below:

I hope pentax is never seen as the 'apple' of the camera world. there products are generic, bland, boring, over hyped, over priced & despite being technologically very good (though a bit behind ie: finally adopting an intel processor) they are very proprietary in their product design. they tend to put out products that are more geared to aesthetics and 'fashion' instead of functionality and simple ergonomics. beyond all that there publicly displayed view of themselves is pompus and asinine at best, and unfourtanatly a rather alarminlgly large amount of their customers adopt that attitude after getting their hands on a glossy white partially eaten apple.

[navcom]

warning, opinion below:

I hope pentax is never seen as the 'apple' of the camera world. there products are generic, bland, boring, over hyped, over priced & despite being technologically very good (though a bit behind ie: finally adopting an intel processor) they are very proprietary in their product design. they tend to put out products that are more geared to aesthetics and 'fashion' instead of functionality and simple ergonomics. beyond all that there publicly displayed view of themselves is pompus and asinine at best, and unfourtanatly a rather alarminlgly large amount of their customers adopt that attitude after getting their hands on a glossy white partially eaten apple.

Point taken. I would happen to agree with you regarding Apple's arrogance as well as agree that their stubbornness (especially early on) to retain proprietary "status" was a big factor in their not being the "giant". But the fact that you recognize their attitude and beliefs makes my point. You KNOW their attitude! Their marketing strategy has worked. They have succeeded in defining themselves, even if you don't like what they have defined. This rebellious and arrogant image is what they want to portray. I regret to say that 99.999% of the population does not have an opinion on what Pentax is or stands for unless they are a loyal Pentax owner. Even many photogs don't! On the flip side, I'm willing to bet a much larger percent of the population knows Apple's attitude even though they have never owned a Mac (myself included).

My comparison really wasn't intended to make the case that Pentax should become arrogant and Pentaxians should follow suit. It was more as an example of a company's marketing model...how the "underdog" can get attention. There are many examples of underdog companies taking on their monolithic competitors using creative advertising techniques...an extremely focused and obvious defining of one's-self before being defined...or more directly, taking the offense instead of constantly playing defense or settling for "just getting by".

As far as the product itself, that's a whole new discussion. I've never owned a Mac, but if it's anything like my K10D, I'm sold!

[navcom]

By the way, I sincerely hope Pentax doesn't follow Apple's example. A few decades ago (1979-83), prior to and just after IBM and Microsoft's entrance into the arena, Apple totally dominated the personal computer market. A series of missteps (Apple III versus original IBM PC, etc), poor management decisions (the original Mac - B&W, limited RAM, no hard drive), bullheadedness on the part of senior management (Jobs & the original Mac versus Apple II), combined with high prices and horrible marketing, chewed away at that lead to the point where Apple remained as nothing more than a nitche player in the overall market. Apple has since made a bit of a comeback, but not nearly as impressive to me as that by Pentax over the last few months.

stewart

Agreed.

I just think they need to define themselves better so potential customers can make a more educated choice...more focus on name recognition and distinction, not necessarily just market share (if you build it, they will come). Example: set yourself up as the "best kept secret in the photography world...haven't heard of Pentax? You should!"...make people intrigued by you. It could push them into the market position their products deserve. I don't want to give the impression that I think Pentax has done nothing right. They already have a good base to work from and great products.

Is there any data on how many brick and mortar dealers are dropping Nikon or Canon for Pentax?

Unless their strategy is to become solely an internet retail business and they don't care about the brick & mortar stores, they have to figure out a way to stop the bleeding. It is obvious, at least in the USA, that Pentax products are becoming rare at the local stores.

All my opinion.

Great thread BTW! These are all issues important to us Pentaxians!

[benjikan]

warning, opinion below:

I hope pentax is never seen as the 'apple' of the camera world. there products are generic, bland, boring, over hyped, over priced & despite being technologically very good (though a bit behind ie: finally adopting an intel processor) they are very proprietary in their product design. they tend to put out products that are more geared to aesthetics and 'fashion' instead of functionality and simple ergonomics. beyond all that there publicly displayed view of themselves is pompus and asinine at best, and unfourtanatly a rather alarminlgly large amount of their customers adopt that attitude after getting their hands on a glossy white partially eaten apple.

What???? Have you used a MAC with OSX Leopard? No viruses, No Crashes, Very Fast and Great User interface...etc etc etc.

Ben