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03-16-2018, 02:04 PM   #1
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Difficulty rendering true-to-life colors!

Today, I photographed 5 color filters to post on the Market Place. They are, l to r, RED, YELLOW, ORANGE, GREEN & BLUE. I could NOT get the true colors to show, regardless of what custom image mode my K-50 has to offer!


Take a look and you'll see what I mean. Do any of you have any suggestions? This was a very interesting dilemma, to be sure.


Last edited by photolady95; 03-16-2018 at 03:29 PM.
03-16-2018, 02:21 PM   #2
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The skylight filter looks right to me

It's hard to get web colors to match originals when photographing saturated colors under varying lighting conditions (with film or digitally). Even if you do get them to appear true on your monitor, they may be different on someone else's so it's pretty academic to try sending these with "the right color".

If I hold my yellow filter up to my window, I see a different yellow than if I hold it up to an incandescent light. Then it will print different than it appears by transmitted light. To get all colors right, it's a pretty complicated process - paint stores use a multicolor analyzer and multiple pigments and still have a hard time.

Bottom line, don't worry too much about your issue. As long as buyers know what filter number they are buying, it should be ok.
03-16-2018, 02:26 PM   #3
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The red and orange filters are quite vibrant on my system, but the others are not right. It almost looks as if a narrow band-pass filter was in place. Might it be part of the software used at some step?

The EXIF lists:
Make : Olympus Imaging Corp.
Camera Model Name : Pentax K-50
Software : OLYMPUS Viewer 2 1.11W
MakerNotes includes...
Raw Dev Version : 0100
Might this represent RAW development using the Olympus Viewer software?

For the benefit of other readers, here is the image in question...



The expected colors, L-to-R are: red, yellow, orange, green, blue


Steve

Last edited by stevebrot; 03-16-2018 at 02:33 PM.
03-16-2018, 02:27 PM   #4
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QuoteOriginally posted by Bob 256 Quote
The skylight filter looks right to me
There is no skylight in the lineup.


Steve

03-16-2018, 02:29 PM   #5
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QuoteOriginally posted by Bob 256 Quote
The skylight filter looks right to me

It's hard to get web colors to match originals when photographing saturated colors under varying lighting conditions (with film or digitally). Even if you do get them to appear true on your monitor, they may be different on someone else's so it's pretty academic to try sending these with "the right color".

If I hold my yellow filter up to my window, I see a different yellow than if I hold it up to an incandescent light. Then it will print different than it appears by transmitted light. To get all colors right, it's a pretty complicated process - paint stores use a multicolor analyzer and multiple pigments and still have a hard time.

Bottom line, don't worry too much about your issue. As long as buyers know what filter number they are buying, it should be ok.

There was NO skylight filter in the group. They were red, yellow, orange, green and blue. I used a 6000 degree Kelvin lighting for the shot, so that shouldn't have effected it too much.

---------- Post added 03-16-18 at 03:32 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
The red and orange filters are quite vibrant on my system, but the others are not right. It almost looks as if a narrow band-pass filter was in place. Might it be part of the software used at some step?

The EXIF lists:
Make : Olympus Imaging Corp.
Camera Model Name : Pentax K-50
MakerNotes includes...
Raw Dev Version : 0100
Steve

Steve, the colors didn't look right even when viewing them in my camera monitor screen. I tried everything imaginable and what you see is the best I could do. I use an Olympus editing program but, like I said, the colors just didn't look right from the get-go. Why is says "Raw Dev Version: 0100" I have no idea. I've never shot a RAW image in my life.... that I'm aware of!

---------- Post added 03-16-18 at 03:52 PM ----------

O.K. I feel like Gyro Gearloose when the light bulb went on over his head! I checked my camera and it was NOT set to shoot RAW, but just for S&G's, for the first time in my life, I actually shot a RAW image! Guess what? The photo came out EXACTLY like it looks in real life! Man oh man.... NOW I know what all the fuss is about concerning shooting in RAW format! If Pentax changes the colors in ALL of the images I've been shooting all these years, then I've seriously hog-tied myself! This is a perfect show-and-tell event, wouldn't you think?


For the next few weeks, I'm going to shoot nothing but RAW and see if I've really been missing out on what it appears to be the case. I'm stunned!


Note: I went back into my post in the Market Place and replaced the image with one that's more appropriate!
03-16-2018, 02:53 PM   #6
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QuoteOriginally posted by Dewman Quote
Why is says "Raw Dev Version: 0100"
The Olympus software wrote the file.

I believe you when you say that the out of camera JPEG looks the same. What are you using for light source? Might it be LED?


Steve
03-16-2018, 02:59 PM   #7
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QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
The Olympus software wrote the file.

I believe you when you say that the out of camera JPEG looks the same. What are you using for light source? Might it be LED?


Steve

Steve, I'm using a 6000 Kelvin lighting system (no LED), so it shouldn't have any effect on the colors. I re-shot the filters using RAW format and BINGO! I'm amazed at the difference.

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03-16-2018, 03:17 PM   #8
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To RAW or not to RAW?

I've resisted shooting in RAW format ever since I bought my first DSLR. Why? Just stubborn I suppose.... and I didn't think it REALLY made all that much difference. Well, today I was taken to school and boy, did I ever learn a valuable lesson!


I had some color filters I wanted to post on the Market Place, but regardless of what custom image mode my K-50 offered, I simply could NOT get the colors to look like they do in real life. I mentioned my dilemma in another post and we kicked the problem around a bit. Then, just for S&G's, I went back and re-shot the filters only this time I shot them in RAW format. Holy Cow! What an amazing difference!


Am I to understand that I've been short changing my photographs all this time by refusing to even try RAW? Sometimes being hard headed has some unforeseen consequences! I think this might be a very good show-and-tell for any of those, who like me, are stuck in the JPEG only rut!


Here's the before and after.
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03-16-2018, 03:31 PM   #9
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You might want to check in your camera and see what the jpeg settings are. The camera always shoots RAW and if set to jpeg it simply takes the RAW and 'bakes' it according to the 'recipe' that is set in the camera. There are numerous settings in that section that can make a big difference.

I'm not sure what if anything the Olympus software might also be doing but (possibly) if it is expecting an Olympus file it might do something strange. But I think the first place to look is in the camera jpeg settings. I have accidentally changed things in that section without even noticing.

---------- Post added 03-16-18 at 03:34 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by Dewman Quote
Am I to understand that I've been short changing my photographs all this time by refusing to even try RAW?
Not necessarily, your straight from camera jpegs should be capable of correct color as good as a RAW under controlled conditions. And this is a cut and dried controlled situation. Check your camera jpeg settings before going further.
03-16-2018, 03:54 PM   #10
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QuoteOriginally posted by Dewman Quote
Steve, I'm using a 6000 Kelvin lighting system (no LED), so it shouldn't have any effect on the colors. I re-shot the filters using RAW format and BINGO! I'm amazed at the difference.
Normally, I would not have expected this sort of difference. There must be some setting for your JPEG processing that is responsible. I suspect a badly munged "custom" image setting.


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03-16-2018, 04:00 PM   #11
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QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
I suspect a badly munged "custom" image setting.
To elaborate, see page 57 pages 157 and following in the K-50 manual. There you will see the default (canned) options as well as how they may be user modified. I suspect that the one you are using has been modified with almost full desaturation of both green and blue channels.


Steve

Last edited by stevebrot; 03-16-2018 at 07:26 PM.
03-16-2018, 04:28 PM   #12
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QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
To elaborate, see page 57 and following in the K-50 manual. There you will see the default (canned) options as well as how they may be user modified. I suspect that the one you are using has been modified with almost full desaturation of both green and blue channels.


Steve

Steve, I can find nothing about default options on page 57. If you know off hand where I would look, it would certainly save me some grief! Thanks for all your efforts. I appreciate it.
03-16-2018, 05:56 PM   #13
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Did you do a custom white balance????? You don't need a gray card - just a white sheet of paper works fine.

In my experience, this can make quite a difference in the colors that appear in your JPEGs. (I, too, shoot mostly jpegs, using RAW only occasionally for special occasions. Learning how to set custom white balance was a real "aha" moment for me, and I now do it ALL the time when shooting in the studio, where you have lots of time to get things right!)
03-16-2018, 07:24 PM   #14
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QuoteOriginally posted by Dewman Quote
Steve, I can find nothing about default options on page 57. If you know off hand where I would look, it would certainly save me some grief! Thanks for all your efforts. I appreciate it.
Sorry I should have typed "pages 157 and following". I also should have made a better choice of words

Your K-50 provides several image "finishing" options for JPEGs. The basic choices include choices such as Bright, Natural, Portrait, and others. Each of those may be modified further by adjustments to saturation, hue, contrast, etc.. I suspect that the one currently selected may have been set askew.

It is also possible that a digital filter or strange white balance might have been set. I don't have a K-50 in hand to try and duplicate, so I can't be of more help.


Steve
03-16-2018, 07:50 PM   #15
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QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
Sorry I should have typed "pages 157 and following". I also should have made a better choice of words

Your K-50 provides several image "finishing" options for JPEGs. The basic choices include choices such as Bright, Natural, Portrait, and others. Each of those may be modified further by adjustments to saturation, hue, contrast, etc.. I suspect that the one currently selected may have been set askew.

It is also possible that a digital filter or strange white balance might have been set. I don't have a K-50 in hand to try and duplicate, so I can't be of more help.


Steve

Well Steve, adjusting the "finishing" options is one of the very first things I tried. I tried each and adjusted every possible choice offered me.... and.... well, you saw the results. The one I selected was the very best, believe it or not. Also, there were no digital filters in effect. I didn't get anything even close to normal until I tried RAW. Strange turn of events, that. All is well that ends well.
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