Using filters

photolady95 · 06-25-2009, 07:47 AM

I know how to use them, and which to use where. But I have a specific question on the use of coupling two or more filters to get a certain effect.

Has anyone done this? If so, tell me what effect you got from which two or three you used, please.

**NaClH2O** · 06-25-2009, 02:37 PM

Hi PL,

I don't shoot film, so this might not be a lot of help, but when shooting waterfalls and streams etc I frequently stack a ND filter and a Circular polarizer together. I get the benefit of the reduced light so I can get better "soft" water and I think the CPL helps a bit in giving a darker non rapids water. I also tried two CPL's together once and it freaked out the auto WB in the camera and I had shots that weren't consistant except in their weirdness. One would look like it was shot under florescent light the next extremely warm, almost orange and so on.

NaCl(the 2 cpl's might be OK if you were looking for something trippy and abstract)H2O

photolady95 · 06-25-2009, 04:18 PM

I think the concept is about the same thing, except that film might interpret the light differently than digital cameras would. Does that make sense?

Thanks for the information. I still need to buy a ND filter yet.

K-9 · 06-26-2009, 04:59 AM

IMO, using two filters is best left alone unless absolutely necessary. You slightly degrade image quality the more glass/elements you keep adding. You could also wind up with vignetting, depending on the lens. They make all kinds of polarizers, so getting one with a dual function is possible and a much better option than adding a second filter.

photolady95 · 07-04-2009, 07:18 PM

I just noticed your response K-9. Thanks for the information. I'll stick with one filter at a time for now.

Duck Dodgers · 07-11-2009, 08:37 PM

They do make special thin-mount filters, mostly for use on ultra-wide lenses, but they also allow you to use two filters at once on more "normal" focal lengths. That being said, it does indeed add four more air-to-glass surfaces, so you're more prone to flare and reflections (especially shooting towards the sun). Someone posted about a filter test recently, that pretty much "proved" that Hoya HMC filters transmit the most light, with a 97% transmission rate. If you're going to use two filters, you can at least minimize the degradation.

UV filters test - Lenstip.com

little laker · 07-11-2009, 11:13 PM

Originally posted by photolady

I'll stick with one filter at a time for now.

The Cokin systems were designed so you could stack their filters for some effects.
I don't think that they'd design them that way if they figured there was much loss of IQ.

Like K-9 said, and especially since your shooting film you might have problems with vignetting on some lenses. This can often be avoided by using oversized filters, with adapters, moving the edge of the filter outwards.

**Kerrowdown** · 07-12-2009, 12:29 AM

If your using filters always buy the best optical quality you can afford, when you think about it, we all spend a small fortune on our lenses, don't degrade them with poor qualty filters.

For me, filters are for coffee machines.

flyer · 07-12-2009, 03:14 AM

Originally posted by K-9

IMO, using two filters is best left alone unless absolutely necessary. You slightly degrade image quality the more glass/elements you keep adding. .

Sometimes, using two filters is the only way to get what you want. If there is no other way, who's to say image quality is degraded? You do what needs to be done to get the image you want.

photolady95 · 07-13-2009, 10:20 PM

Thanks for the additional comments. I have a Tiffen CPL that I use most of the time when I need it. It's not one that fits any of my lenses, but with a stepup ring, I can use it on my Sigma. The Tiffen CPL is 72mm, the Sigma is 58mm. I also have a UV filter, but the only reason I use it is to save my lens incase of accidently (Heaven forbid, I'd ever do that) drop my camera.

Andrew Faires · 07-21-2009, 08:24 PM

When I shoot landscapes/water, I often stack 2 or 3 filters.

One of the nicest effects was when I stacked a warm-toned polarizer with a gold'n'blue polarizer to give some zest to some moving water over some rocks in brutally flat light.

I'll also stack a polarizer or colour intensifier with a GND and ND or basically any combination of them up to three.

The only problem with stacking my polarizers is there is an overall magenta cast. It's easy enough to fix in digital by adjusting the WB, but on film it would be more of a problem.

My two polarizers stacked:

Colour Intensifier, 3 stop soft edge GND & a Neutral Density filter (IIRC)

skinja · 07-21-2009, 11:12 PM

What brand of filters are you using, oh great shots by the way. I heard that Cokins probably give off the most color cast and the hitech may have a little but not as much lees and some of the are best but to get set up you could spend as much as a grand or more.

I'm in the market for set of ND's and really leaning towards the lees with the Cokin Z holder.

Andrew Faires · 07-22-2009, 06:37 AM

Thank you very much!

I'm using singh-rays in the Cokin P holder. The Z or XP holder (whichever is the next size up) would be better for the current range of wide-angle lenses, though.

**gofour3** · 07-22-2009, 07:24 AM

If you shoot B&W film you may want to try stacking a CPL and R25 (red) filter for some special 1930's horror movie effects. You can get some interesting looking sky and clouds!

MRRiley · 07-22-2009, 09:55 AM

Originally posted by NaClH2O

Hi PL,

I don't shoot film, so this might not be a lot of help, but when shooting waterfalls and streams etc I frequently stack a ND filter and a Circular polarizer together. I get the benefit of the reduced light so I can get better "soft" water and I think the CPL helps a bit in giving a darker non rapids water. I also tried two CPL's together once and it freaked out the auto WB in the camera and I had shots that weren't consistant except in their weirdness. One would look like it was shot under florescent light the next extremely warm, almost orange and so on.

NaCl(the 2 cpl's might be OK if you were looking for something trippy and abstract)H2O

The "2 stacked polarizer" thing works well if you plan on converting to B&W. They effectively become a variable ND filter when stacked so you have a lot of control. It does do freaky things with colors (especially edges) though so is best left alone for color work in general. Andrew's work above is a very well done exception.

I used this trick for this photo which was taken on a very bright day at a 4 second exposure with a K110D and the kit 18-55mm lens.

I stack ND and polarizers all the time and have never noticed any degradation of sharpness. Of course I only buy mid to high-end multicoated filters. If you buy cheap ones you will probably not be able to stack w/o seeing issues.

Mike

06-25-2009, 07:47 AM	#1
photolady95 Otis Memorial Pentaxian Join Date: May 2009 Location: Cruising the forum watching his back Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 12,712	Using filters I know how to use them, and which to use where. But I have a specific question on the use of coupling two or more filters to get a certain effect. Has anyone done this? If so, tell me what effect you got from which two or three you used, please.

07-22-2009, 07:24 AM	#14
gofour3 Site Supporter Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Vancouver, Canada Posts: 8,090	If you shoot B&W film you may want to try stacking a CPL and R25 (red) filter for some special 1930's horror movie effects. You can get some interesting looking sky and clouds! Last edited by gofour3; 07-22-2009 at 05:17 PM. Reason: Insert image

07-22-2009, 09:55 AM	#15
MRRiley Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Sterling, VA, USA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 6,275	Originally posted by NaClH2O Hi PL, I don't shoot film, so this might not be a lot of help, but when shooting waterfalls and streams etc I frequently stack a ND filter and a Circular polarizer together. I get the benefit of the reduced light so I can get better "soft" water and I think the CPL helps a bit in giving a darker non rapids water. I also tried two CPL's together once and it freaked out the auto WB in the camera and I had shots that weren't consistant except in their weirdness. One would look like it was shot under florescent light the next extremely warm, almost orange and so on. NaCl(the 2 cpl's might be OK if you were looking for something trippy and abstract)H2O The "2 stacked polarizer" thing works well if you plan on converting to B&W. They effectively become a variable ND filter when stacked so you have a lot of control. It does do freaky things with colors (especially edges) though so is best left alone for color work in general. Andrew's work above is a very well done exception. I used this trick for this photo which was taken on a very bright day at a 4 second exposure with a K110D and the kit 18-55mm lens. I stack ND and polarizers all the time and have never noticed any degradation of sharpness. Of course I only buy mid to high-end multicoated filters. If you buy cheap ones you will probably not be able to stack w/o seeing issues. Mike Last edited by MRRiley; 07-22-2009 at 10:11 AM.

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
For Sale - Sold: Trade: My 77mm filters for your 72mm filters (CONUS)	loveisageless	Sold Items	0	10-02-2010 12:29 AM
To use UV filters or Not to use UV filters?HELP NEEDED	Softsoap	Pentax SLR Lens Discussion	6	02-20-2010 04:50 PM
Filters?	skamalpreet	Troubleshooting and Beginner Help	17	07-23-2009 03:50 AM
What Filters?	chipchops123	Troubleshooting and Beginner Help	5	02-06-2009 11:13 PM

06-25-2009, 02:37 PM	#2
NaClH2O Site Supporter Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Bronx NY Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 5,631	Hi PL, I don't shoot film, so this might not be a lot of help, but when shooting waterfalls and streams etc I frequently stack a ND filter and a Circular polarizer together. I get the benefit of the reduced light so I can get better "soft" water and I think the CPL helps a bit in giving a darker non rapids water. I also tried two CPL's together once and it freaked out the auto WB in the camera and I had shots that weren't consistant except in their weirdness. One would look like it was shot under florescent light the next extremely warm, almost orange and so on. NaCl(the 2 cpl's might be OK if you were looking for something trippy and abstract)H2O

06-25-2009, 04:18 PM	#3
photolady95 Otis Memorial Pentaxian Join Date: May 2009 Location: Cruising the forum watching his back Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 12,712 Original Poster	I think the concept is about the same thing, except that film might interpret the light differently than digital cameras would. Does that make sense? Thanks for the information. I still need to buy a ND filter yet.

06-26-2009, 04:59 AM	#4
K-9 Veteran Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: USA Photos: Albums Posts: 1,971	IMO, using two filters is best left alone unless absolutely necessary. You slightly degrade image quality the more glass/elements you keep adding. You could also wind up with vignetting, depending on the lens. They make all kinds of polarizers, so getting one with a dual function is possible and a much better option than adding a second filter.

07-04-2009, 07:18 PM	#5
photolady95 Otis Memorial Pentaxian Join Date: May 2009 Location: Cruising the forum watching his back Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 12,712 Original Poster	I just noticed your response K-9. Thanks for the information. I'll stick with one filter at a time for now.

07-11-2009, 08:37 PM	#6
Duck Dodgers Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: in the 24½th Century! Photos: Gallery Posts: 439	They do make special thin-mount filters, mostly for use on ultra-wide lenses, but they also allow you to use two filters at once on more "normal" focal lengths. That being said, it does indeed add four more air-to-glass surfaces, so you're more prone to flare and reflections (especially shooting towards the sun). Someone posted about a filter test recently, that pretty much "proved" that Hoya HMC filters transmit the most light, with a 97% transmission rate. If you're going to use two filters, you can at least minimize the degradation. UV filters test - Lenstip.com

07-11-2009, 11:13 PM	#7
little laker Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Photos: Gallery Posts: 5,697	Originally posted by photolady I'll stick with one filter at a time for now. The Cokin systems were designed so you could stack their filters for some effects. I don't think that they'd design them that way if they figured there was much loss of IQ. Like K-9 said, and especially since your shooting film you might have problems with vignetting on some lenses. This can often be avoided by using oversized filters, with adapters, moving the edge of the filter outwards.

07-12-2009, 12:29 AM	#8
Kerrowdown PEG Moderator Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Highlands of Scotland... "Hold Infinity in the palm of your hand" - William Blake Photos: Gallery Posts: 57,818	If your using filters always buy the best optical quality you can afford, when you think about it, we all spend a small fortune on our lenses, don't degrade them with poor qualty filters. For me, filters are for coffee machines.

07-12-2009, 03:14 AM	#9
flyer Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Ste-Anne des Plaines, Qc., Canada Posts: 2,013	Originally posted by K-9 IMO, using two filters is best left alone unless absolutely necessary. You slightly degrade image quality the more glass/elements you keep adding. . Sometimes, using two filters is the only way to get what you want. If there is no other way, who's to say image quality is degraded? You do what needs to be done to get the image you want.

07-13-2009, 10:20 PM	#10
photolady95 Otis Memorial Pentaxian Join Date: May 2009 Location: Cruising the forum watching his back Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 12,712 Original Poster	Thanks for the additional comments. I have a Tiffen CPL that I use most of the time when I need it. It's not one that fits any of my lenses, but with a stepup ring, I can use it on my Sigma. The Tiffen CPL is 72mm, the Sigma is 58mm. I also have a UV filter, but the only reason I use it is to save my lens incase of accidently (Heaven forbid, I'd ever do that) drop my camera.

07-21-2009, 08:24 PM	#11
Andrew Faires Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Ontario Posts: 744	When I shoot landscapes/water, I often stack 2 or 3 filters. One of the nicest effects was when I stacked a warm-toned polarizer with a gold'n'blue polarizer to give some zest to some moving water over some rocks in brutally flat light. I'll also stack a polarizer or colour intensifier with a GND and ND or basically any combination of them up to three. The only problem with stacking my polarizers is there is an overall magenta cast. It's easy enough to fix in digital by adjusting the WB, but on film it would be more of a problem. My two polarizers stacked: Colour Intensifier, 3 stop soft edge GND & a Neutral Density filter (IIRC)

07-21-2009, 11:12 PM	#12
skinja Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Denver, Co Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 968	What brand of filters are you using, oh great shots by the way. I heard that Cokins probably give off the most color cast and the hitech may have a little but not as much lees and some of the are best but to get set up you could spend as much as a grand or more. I'm in the market for set of ND's and really leaning towards the lees with the Cokin Z holder.

07-22-2009, 06:37 AM	#13
Andrew Faires Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Ontario Posts: 744	Thank you very much! I'm using singh-rays in the Cokin P holder. The Z or XP holder (whichever is the next size up) would be better for the current range of wide-angle lenses, though.