[benjikan]

To each his own, as the saying goes. However, while you might hate them, most pros (fashion for catalogs, advertising, consumer magazines, etc) will quickly tell you umbrellas and/or softboxes are essential to their work (the look clients most want and often expect). While I have & routinely use a selection of softboxes, I often choose umbrellas to allow a trifle more movement by the model without horribly impacting the lighting. I prefer the specular highlights of silver umbrellas, but the softness provided by white umbrellas (or large softboxes) is preferred by many clients. And since I essentially work for the clients, not the other way around, I usually try to provide what they prefer.

stewart

Yes you are quite right Stewart, I could have chosen something a bit less caustic, like "disdain" or "abject dislike for" or perhaps something more considerate like "why I find umbrella light not appropriate for my form of expression..."
My use of the word "Hate" had a lot less to do with the tool than some of the negative associations in my life/business experience of those in power insisting on employing that tool.

[séamuis]

I actually really love your lighting style Ben, its incredibly dynamic and it can go from one extreme to the other all in the same photo. Im always amazed at your lighting, and I can see the challenge laid out in your post. of course I do more journalistic photography not studio photography so it wont be challenging me personally. but I have to say looking at work done with umbrellas and work that's very dynamic such as yours, there is a real draw to yours. maybe its just because everyone is so used to seeing photographs all taken the same way?

[Confused]

Hi Ben

Now you've gone and bequeathed me an inferiority complex I never realised I possessed before, because I don't even own a lighting set-up (flashguns don't count.....lol) !
And please leave my "paradigm" precisely where it was....I do require a certain comfort zone, you know !

Best regards
Richard

P.S. I bet the Victorian used 'parasols' instead......

[Urkeldaedalus]

Hey Benjikan,

This post may not have gotten off to the most auspicious of starts, but I still think it has the potential to be an informative one. I'm interested in learning more about lighting, and you mentioned that when you started you made the mistake of listening to others and used umbrellas when you first started out. Now that you have learned from that experience, what would you recommend that someone start out with instead?

[Peter Zack]

Ben, I get the point of the original post and basically think along the same lines as Stewart. I understand fully what you meant and that we need to constantly challenge ourselves to create new and more interesting ways of shooting whether it be studio or location work. I didn't take offense in my response post, just used a little sarcasm to emphasize how that could be viewed by someone who is just ready to buy their first lightstand. This is a daunting aspect of photography. It's one thing to spot meter a landscape sunset, no pressure no subject to instruct. It's a whole different world to work with a live model, set lights up in a way that is both flattering and achieves the desired end result that the client is happy with and you feel good about the work. I know the first few times I tried this, I forgot everything I had practiced and feel totally under pressure and rushed. I still do sometimes and the results show.

We all start somewhere and most of us are either at the beginning and just wondering how to do it. Starting with training wheels is the best (IMHO) to get to the next level. Just like it's ridiculous to have never shot an SLR before, buy a K-7, 31mm Ltd and a studio kit, then start advertising your "Professional business" when you don't know the relationship between aperture, shutter and ISO.

Finally as Stewart stated far better than I, the basic studio kit can produce the results you want for many situations. The shot below is one I'd like your (as harsh as you want) critique on. On the brides side, I used a hard white umbrella on a stand with a battery operated strobe at 40% to bring up the dress and a soft shoot through on the groom to light him. The camera was set to expose for the fading sunset and the lights were adjusted to balance them enough to not make it look too much like a "strobe shot".
I wanted enough light to balance them against the surroundings and get as much reflection on the water as well but keep it "natural". There were a couple of test exposures taken to check the light and of course there was only one chance to get the shot while the clothes were still dry.

So tell me your honest opinion and what you might have done or used to create an entirely different look.

[cwood]

Its hardly original but still a fun way to use umbrella lighting

Oh yah... and FYI - this kind of work ain't my thing. Spending some time experimenting with different types of studio lighting is definitely on my "to do" list but I'm a novice at best. And like others who have replied before me on this thread - I wasn't sure I wanted to test the waters in a thread written by an exceptional photographer criticizing a vastly popular lighting technique. But what the hell... If we don't propogate the conversation we'll never learn anything in life

[little laker]

When I've learned everything there is to know about using BarnDoors I might move onto Umbrellas.
I think that it'll be a while.

[benjikan]

When I've learned everything there is to know about using BarnDoors I might move onto Umbrellas.
I think that it'll be a while.

LOL!!!!

[benjikan]

Ben, I get the point of the original post and basically think along the same lines as Stewart. I understand fully what you meant and that we need to constantly challenge ourselves to create new and more interesting ways of shooting whether it be studio or location work. I didn't take offense in my response post, just used a little sarcasm to emphasize how that could be viewed by someone who is just ready to buy their first lightstand. This is a daunting aspect of photography. It's one thing to spot meter a landscape sunset, no pressure no subject to instruct. It's a whole different world to work with a live model, set lights up in a way that is both flattering and achieves the desired end result that the client is happy with and you feel good about the work. I know the first few times I tried this, I forgot everything I had practiced and feel totally under pressure and rushed. I still do sometimes and the results show.

We all start somewhere and most of us are either at the beginning and just wondering how to do it. Starting with training wheels is the best (IMHO) to get to the next level. Just like it's ridiculous to have never shot an SLR before, buy a K-7, 31mm Ltd and a studio kit, then start advertising your "Professional business" when you don't know the relationship between aperture, shutter and ISO.

Finally as Stewart stated far better than I, the basic studio kit can produce the results you want for many situations. The shot below is one I'd like your (as harsh as you want) critique on. On the brides side, I used a hard white umbrella on a stand with a battery operated strobe at 40% to bring up the dress and a soft shoot through on the groom to light him. The camera was set to expose for the fading sunset and the lights were adjusted to balance them enough to not make it look too much like a "strobe shot".
I wanted enough light to balance them against the surroundings and get as much reflection on the water as well but keep it "natural". There were a couple of test exposures taken to check the light and of course there was only one chance to get the shot while the clothes were still dry.

So tell me your honest opinion and what you might have done or used to create an entirely different look.

I quite like this image actually. Are you pleased with it? That is what is really important my friend.

[ismaelg]

Hello,

Interesting topic.
I think we all have to start somewhere, and umbrella lightning is my first step in this journey.

Photography is a hobby for me, not a source of income. So this is something I don't use a lot and as much as I dream of having "pro" setups with all the gadgets, bells and whistles, the truth is I don't even master this one.
I want to improve and move up. But, until I master this humble setup and hate it for limiting me, it will have to do.
Heck, I don't even master flash photography. I still consider flash an evil and "dark" science.




As Peter said, these are my training wheels.
My philosophy, not only in this hobby but in everything, has always been to start with the basics and move up. Not to start at the top and see if I can reach it. That's why I started with an all manual SLR even when autofocus / auto-everything was at full swing in the 90's.

Thanks,

[Jerry Thirsty]

When I think "umbrella lighting" there is only one image that sticks in my mind:

Strictly Commercial

[mel]

I'll add an umbrella shot even though it kills me to do so, what with my low self-esteem and no confidence and all. This is #2 son. And yes his hair is in is face but it's always in his face which is why I like this shot because it's so him. His friends call it his rock-star shot and they want rock-star shots too.

Actually I was rather relieved to finally get something for softening light that I didn't have to rig from tissue paper, fabric scraps, plastic bags, foam electronics bags (from a tv) and all other manner of trash and garbage. It's fun to find stuff like that to use but sometimes it's nice to use something a little tidier.

But all this being said, I'm a rank newbie with artificial lighting. Experimenting with it is just over the top. I could play with it all day long.

[Peter Zack]

Ben Thanks and yes everyone including me is pleased with the shot. It's also great to work with imaginative and fun people.

I hope this thread continues to develop. I have really enjoyed your lighting series and want to take a moment to say I appreciate the opportunity to see a small insight into what you do. You are fortunate to be in the epicenter of the fashion industry and get to experiment with stuff most of us never will. I know I've learned a lot from that and other posts, for example I use your PS sharpening action all the time and it has really sped up my workflow when using PS. Often that's the only adjustment I'll do to a shot.

So keep it going Ben keep on challenging. I appreciate the chance to learn more. I'd love to have the time and money to come and spend a day or 2 watching you work.

[GeneV]

This is a fascinating thread. It seems to me that an umbrella is just a tool which can be used with creativity or not. What is or should be at the heart of this discussion is photos without feeling.

It's a bit of spillover from another thread, but attending way too many weddings this summer has put front and center the sheer volume of technically good but formulaic, uncreative photography done every day.

Every single wedding photographer had the same kind of strobe bracket rig, most of which seems almost unnecessary because they are bouncing 90% of their shots off the ceiling anyway. Talk about the most boring light there is....

[Miserere]

Flat eh?

This was taken with an umbrella.



The umbrella was inches from my face to create the falloff and shadow areas.

Dave, is your surname Wahlberg?

.