[flyer]

You should also look at a "copy stand". It will make sure your camera is parallel to the book, thus minimizing distortion and making sure the limited depth of field will cover everything it can. It will also make the process more efficient since, once you are all set for the first picture, all the subsequent ones will be taken with the same set up. You just put marks on the copy stand to position your subject at the same position, and you're in business.

If you cant find a used copy stand, you might want to look for a used enlarger and take off the enlarging head from it. From there on, you can install a screw on the thing to put your camera on.

[Marc Sabatella]

Marc, like you I am still uncertain of the intent. If to copy the whole book into a digital format that's illegal anyway.

Well, on re-reading the original post, he mentioned being a graphic designer who designs books, and that this is for a portfolio. I'm getting the impression there are books he had a hand in, and what he is proposing would probably be sanctioned by the authors. I gather the intent is to show off the graphic design, not so much reproduce the text as an end in itself. I'm further assuming he specifically *wants* the pages curved like this for aesthetic effect.

Anyhow, I'm still thinking the initial less than satisfying results were more due to lighting and technique than to the camera. A 7MP P&S like the Canon SD1000 really should be just fine for the task - it's just a question of getting enough light to avoid high ISO, to control the direction of the light to get shadows the way he wants them, to shoot with a relatively "normal" or telephoto focal length to avoid wide angle perspective distortion, and to carefully control the shooting angle to avoid the distortion that results from shooting off-axis.

[Ratmagiclady]

I'd say, if the OP wants to buy something just for this, any now- cheap DSLR that can take a now-cheap prime lens ought to be the best solution for the distortion problem. Something like a DS and any old 50mm would work: (anything M-series will be of excellent optical quality and very affordable. Lack of automation-convenience really doesn't matter if you're putting the camera on a stand and doing the same thing over and over. )

Point and shoots with their little zooms can be rife with distortion at least somewhere in their range, (my little Lumix Fz-7 likes to give *barrel* distortion at the wider end, but there are places in the range where there's nothing offensive.)

With just a book, too, it's possible that you could use a P&S you *have* and simply correct in post-processing. First thing to try might be to see if that distortion goes away depending upon where you have the zoom set.

[brecklundin]

I haven't read all the replies, but why can't you use a table type scanner to "photograph" the book pages. The glass is already there and they are relatively cheap.

Phil

the problem with a scanner is the distortion that happens where the pages curve toward the spine. It's usually pretty unattractive. If ya ever have copied something from a book on a copy machine you will have seen this in action.

Beyond that though, I have typed out a few replies to the OP but deleted them. The thing is I am not liking the sheet of "something" over the book to hold it and shooting through. It is going to be a real PITA to control reflections, including the camera rig which has to be positioned directly over the book. There are just too many factors that need to be managed for each and every book, meaning the ability to reproduce quality results one after the others might be very frustrating for the OP.

The reason I didn't post my comments was I am trying to word the solution I would try. Mostly it comes to this, if the OP wants to shot pages and layout samples then the odds are there exist copies of these books in electronic form somewhere...use those and just show the layout. To get shots of the whole book and have them flat, that is not going to be possible. But a creatively arranged selection of titles with one book held open with both a combo of Scotch non-permanent double-stick tape (same kinda adhesive as used on post-it notes - no residue, no damage to the paper), a nice wooden or even metal plate holder/stand (I use some vinyl covered wire-frame plate stands all the time as I can bend them) all combined to create a nice arrangement of the books and using DOF to control emphasis would do the trick...but to do this right is a non-trivial task, especially as the OP indicated he has a lot of books to shoot as samples.

Last, 50mm is simply too long on a crop. I know, I tried it out and I have all the toys to make this work. Even 43mm is not wide enough if the books are above trade-paperback in size, if 8.5" x 11" then forget it unless the OP has the ability to crop thanks to a higher pixel count.

Here are some samples at 43mm:






Just click on any shot to see the gallery

Now those are not great examples nor I am using the tape mentioned but I did use some hidden plate stands, three daylight 30w daylight trumpet bulbs and a tripod. You can see there is still not really enough light. I like using books to decorate the shot might because books "like" to hang around with other books. If I had a wider lens, say 28mm or wider, then you could get closer to the subject book and increase the effectiveness of the DOF. But more light is needed for sure. My goal there was to show what I have been trying to describe. The lighting is still the key and I am not sure the results using the transparent sheet to flatten the books is the way to go as lighting is going to be even more critical and a wider lens will be imperative...I would say 35mm macro is the longest I would use...isn't there a close focus 28mm by Vivitar(?) out there somewhere? but I am willing to bet that would blow the OP's budget by a hundred bucks or so...

Also I would setup on a low table either way. That will allow for shots from directly above the books when it matters, though it could make angled shots somewhat tedious. No matter I see that one will need a lot of working room to do this right, I would say at least 5' across though I had 4' and it was workable. To get these shots right'er I think would require me to setup at least 3 additional lights or use a couple off camera flashes. But the OP would need to buy flashes, and buying a few more lights would be much cheaper.

The final trick I would use to help flatten the books would be to leave them open face down opened to the page I wanted to show-off. I weight on the book would help flatten them and I would bet you would need to leave them that way over night. Also this idea runs the risk of damaging the spine as binding, it's a trade-off in order to get the shot.

[Kaimarx]

I have used a 50 together with a copystand for repro work, 50 is too long for anything in the vicinity of A4 with the stand at its highest adjustment setting. The normal routine for art reproduction is to have the peice mounted/ hanging vertically on a wall, camera on tripod, lamps or floods set at 45 degrees either side.

For a open book though, a little difficult but it still can be done by angling the book at 45 degrees or less, at ground level, camera angled at teh same degree downwards. You just need a way to hold the book stationary so it doesnt slide off whatever backing your using.

If any of the books are on a glossy stock you might want to do one of the following:

a) Diffuse the light be putting something transparent between the lights and the books (but not between the camera and subject hehe). Tracing paper, baking paper, white sheets, white tshirt will work if you dont have a diffuser(2).

b) Change the angle of the lights so they bouce into cards that are angled at 45 degrees to the books.

Either will stop hotspots and reflections showing up on glossy stock (for straight on shots)



The no fuss way of course would be to bust out some van damme splits over 2 chairs facing down directly at teh peice in the middle (or just use a ladder so no one gets hurt, its too early in the year for stunts hehe). Just beware of casting shadows...

[brecklundin]

Kaimarx:

nice tips!! And I agree about the whole idea of a simple setup rather than something more elaborate.

Until I actually tried it out, I did not realize that 50mm is waaaay to long for getting shots of the whole book over, as you mention, A4 in size. Previously I have only taken shots of individual pages so whatever lens I have handy will work as long as i had room to maneuver.

I love your tip about the "Van Damme" strips...nice.

My looking at the problem really makes me suggest that if the OP can get hands on the original electronic version of most of the books, to use those, just choosing the pages to feature. Then take some shots with the books laid out in an attractive arrangement to focus on the look and feel of the final product.

Something else I have found that works really well to diffuse hotspots is either a sheet or two of micro-foam (you know the foam used to wrap fragile items for storage or shipping. but also I will use cheap thin styrofoam plates and/or bowls from Walmart. The cheaper the grade plate the better it will work as a diffuser because it will allow more light. Heck I even made a flash diffuser from stapling two bowls together rim-to-rim then cutting a hole to fit over the flash head...it was really useful, until i got my Lumiquest Softbox III (which is GREAT for my needs) still on my fill flashes I use the foam bowls because they are cheap and I can make a lot of them for the cost of one Softbox III.

There is also the tip to use some tissue paper, paper towel or Kleenex over the camera's built-in or pop-up flash to soften it's light.

One problem I have found is using too many DIY diffusers of different materials can lead to color balance problems because every source will be a slightly different color/temperature. Experimentation works though and thanks to the Strobist kinda people out there I have learned it's not about the name on the tools you use to control light but rather getting the same and consistent result.

I, for one, really appreciate your tips!! I have them filed away for reference.

Oh, I when looking for additional adhesive options I also found a stick that uses the same Post-it-note adhesive and is removable w/o residue:
Restickable Glue Stick - Paper Source

That could be used to "tame the wild page" which refuses to cooperate no matter what ya try.

[JameGumb]

Hello, everyone.

Sorry about the late check-in. Apparently, I am subscribed to recieve notification when there are replies, but, no e-mails came through. Mods?

The extra info is, yes, the copy being legible in these is a concern for me as a designer who works with typography. Corrective software, like the barreling correction built into Photoshop CS3, distorts the type noticeably, but works fine for dirty-fixing book edges.

This is an example of a book shot incorrectly, in my opinion. And, it is from a designer's website, one I admire very much. Besides the lighting being poor, it looks like he definitely shot digital, and with a factory lens. Possibly even a point and shoot. This is typically what I can come up with, as well, on my own. So, I am just trying to clean up my act.

I am going to read over the rest of these responses in the morning. I was reminded to check in again after a while, because I have discussed this with some friends, and they are all curious too.

If somebody wrote a tutorial out there, with photo examples, I can think of easily a dozen artists and designers who would be tremendously indebted. If anybody has free time...

Til then, thanks again for all the help! Back soon.

Attached Images

 

[JameGumb]

And one more example of what I consider an ideal, perfect shot.

This is exactly what I am looking for (and is from another great graphic design team's portfolio, Stout/Kramer).

[landscaped1]

Stout/Kramer website of all the books make it seem like a good photoshop job. Assuming you are laying out pages in indesign and have all the images and text as well as the graphic know how of Adobe products. I would say it would be easier to "create" these images. Take a clean photo of the book, square up the edges with distortion and enhance the shadow detail. Then just lay the real images on top. Stout/Kramer These images are flat as are the pages, but the shadow shows the "curves" of the book pages. Has to be photoshoped.

[Marc Sabatella]

It's kind of hard to tell at the psoted size, but the "incorrectly" shot image really just seems to suffer from the page not being perfectly flat (that's the only "distortion" obviously present) and the focus point and DOF not being sufficient to put the whole thing in focus. That plus the lighting not being I agree, it's not very well done, but it's also nothing that requires super fancy gear or techniques for. The kit lens could have done a fine job had he simply got the book as flat as would be needed to eliminate distortion and had he focused better and adequate DOF. and in particular, I have no idea what you meant in saying it looks like he shot digitl, but asde from resizing artifacts that make it clear the posted version of the image is digital, there's really nothing about it to indicate whether it was actually shot that way or not, nor would I expect you'd normally ever be able to tell.

[MJB DIGITAL]

Sorry I'm late also. I'll attach a couple of my own shots.

They are old shots of my first wedding album so go easy please. 8)

[MJB DIGITAL]

Holy crap those are big!!!!!!!! SORRY!!!!!!

mods feel free to take action, I don't know if I'm breaking the king kong rule here, but I'll leave em in case the OP wants a chance to check em out. if you want em down, feel free to take em down or pm me to get em down.

mitch

[openyourap]

I'm still unclear on what you are trying to to exactly - copy the book page by page, so the entire contents are readable, or just show of the book aesthetically. Neither is really beyond the capability of a P&S camera, frankly. The distortion you note is more likely a result of shooting too close with a wide angle setting on the zoom - thus creating perspective distortion - than any inherent flaw in the camera. Some example of pictures you've taken that you find unsuccessful would help.

For your P&S camera to get about 50mm equivalent, try zooming to 1.4x. If you can check your exif data, you're aiming for a focal length of 8.28mm.

Once the focal length is set, frame your shot by moving the camera or the book, keeping the lens centred and perpendicular

Some copy stands will let you spin the camera away from the base, which means you can shoot off the edge of a table for greater height. Many tripods can also be configured for overhead shots.

If the pages are mostly white, you'll also need to remember to shoot in manual mode and to set the exposure compensation to overexpose by at least one or two stops (EV+1-2). If you want to cheat, try a scene mode like snow or beach.

[Asudef]

It seems like the books in your "target photos" are held down so the covers lay flat which gives the pages a nice even spread. Maybe something thin and heavy enough to weigh them down or some tape like another user mentioned?

It also seems like you can place the books in a soft box for nice even soft lighting and zoomed in to get that flatter perspective although that might be more difficult to arrange.