Landscape Do you guys prefer HDR or natural looking?

John Poirier · 04-19-2016, 09:47 AM

It's a very nice shot. Of the three versions you have posted, I prefer the natural one.

I have a somewhat different approach to this sort of thing. My goal is to reproduce what I perceived when I was there.

Your third version was an improvement in some ways, but the excessively blue shadows at left centre and the loss of definition in the clouds were not good.

I've reworked the natural version using a combination of Camera RAW and Photoshop tools.

I started by adding a bit of clarity, vibrance and saturation to the whole image. Then I worked on local adjustments using the dodge and burn tools in Photoshop. I selectively burned in shadows to enhance the texture and solidity of the rock faces, and to make textures more consistent across the image. In the sky I burned in midtones to darken the blue sky, then dodged highlights to lighten the clouds. I then used hue/saturation in Photoshop to tone down the sky blue a bit, as burning in the midtones had made the blue saturation a bit excessive. The goal was to make the sky more interesting.

I could be tempted to lighten the heavy shadow in the lower right, but would want to have a higher bit depth file for that one.

Most or perhaps all of these adjustments could be made in Lightroom using the Adjustment Brush thingie, but I'm more comfortable in Photoshop.

Hope you find this useful.

Gray · 04-19-2016, 09:49 AM

I prefer the natural image - the sky in versions 1 & 2 of HDR looks too artificial.

mikeSF · 04-19-2016, 12:57 PM

Originally posted by John Poirier

It's a very nice shot. Of the three versions you have posted, I prefer the natural one.

I have a somewhat different approach to this sort of thing. My goal is to reproduce what I perceived when I was there.

Your third version was an improvement in some ways, but the excessively blue shadows at left centre and the loss of definition in the clouds were not good.

I've reworked the natural version using a combination of Camera RAW and Photoshop tools.

I started by adding a bit of clarity, vibrance and saturation to the whole image. Then I worked on local adjustments using the dodge and burn tools in Photoshop. I selectively burned in shadows to enhance the texture and solidity of the rock faces, and to make textures more consistent across the image. In the sky I burned in midtones to darken the blue sky, then dodged highlights to lighten the clouds. I then used hue/saturation in Photoshop to tone down the sky blue a bit, as burning in the midtones had made the blue saturation a bit excessive. The goal was to make the sky more interesting.

I could be tempted to lighten the heavy shadow in the lower right, but would want to have a higher bit depth file for that one.

Most or perhaps all of these adjustments could be made in Lightroom using the Adjustment Brush thingie, but I'm more comfortable in Photoshop.

Hope you find this useful.

superb sky work.
a slight green cast to the valley, however.

John Poirier · 04-19-2016, 03:04 PM

Originally posted by mikeSF

superb sky work.
a slight green cast to the valley, however.

Thanks. Didn't work on the green in the valley. Possibly bring in a logging crew? Seriously, I don't see anything too far off in the trees. Maybe a monitor calibration difference? Not a major thing in a 5-minute makeover, anyhow.

**csa** · 04-19-2016, 03:08 PM

I prefer #3. As another member said, maybe crop a little of the sky, but otherwise; beautiful!

**csa** · 04-19-2016, 03:13 PM

Originally posted by John Poirier

Thanks. Didn't work on the green in the valley. Possibly bring in a logging crew? Seriously, I don't see anything too far off in the trees. Maybe a monitor calibration difference? Not a major thing in a 5-minute makeover, anyhow.

The waterfall isn't white, to me; in this retouch. But otherwise, nice!!

mikeSF · 04-19-2016, 09:46 PM

Originally posted by John Poirier

Thanks. Didn't work on the green in the valley. Possibly bring in a logging crew? Seriously, I don't see anything too far off in the trees. Maybe a monitor calibration difference? Not a major thing in a 5-minute makeover, anyhow.

it also got very warm and the water is yellow, but could be some golden hour

**lmd91343** · 04-19-2016, 10:00 PM

Originally posted by mikeSF

it also got very warm and the water is yellow, but could be some golden hour

Mike,

Have you seen Horsetail at golden hour in February?

mikeSF · 04-19-2016, 10:13 PM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by lmd91343

Mike,

Have you seen Horsetail at golden hour in February?

yea, you mean this?

Horsetail II

---------- Post added 04-19-2016 at 10:15 PM ----------

Originally posted by lmd91343

Mike,

Have you seen Horsetail at golden hour in February?

what i meant was compared to the original post, the reprocessed one turned very warm, white balance-wise. I liked the color tones of the original better.

John Poirier · 04-19-2016, 10:57 PM

Originally posted by mikeSF

yea, you mean this?

Horsetail II

---------- Post added 04-19-2016 at 10:15 PM ----------

what i meant was compared to the original post, the reprocessed one turned very warm, white balance-wise. I liked the color tones of the original better.

I didn't do anything to the colour balance. The warmth may be inherent in the image, a bit of golden hour effect as someone else suggested, but more noticeable when brightness is reduced. I'm getting tired, so I'm not going back into the image, but you can certainly see for yourselves. I made the rock faces darker mainly by burning in shadows in Photoshop, using multiple brush stroke, 0 hardness, 15 per cent opacity. You might be able to do something similar using the adjustment brush gadget in Lightroom with the shadows slider somewhat to the left.

I agree that the waterfall is warmer than the snow in the scene. Again, that may be a bit of Golden Hour. Part of the warmth of the waterfall may also be explained by the translucency of the water, which may allow the somewhat warm-coloured cliff behind the falls to reflect warmed light back through the falls.

Without seeing the surrounding landscape I can't entirely explain why the golden hour effect would be stronger in the closer part of the scene than on the distant peaks. Perhaps the colour of the distant areas is affected by blue haze. As a matter of personal taste, I like the enigmatic variations in colour temperature.

Good night!

**lmd91343** · 04-19-2016, 11:15 PM

Originally posted by mikeSF

yea, you mean this?

Horsetail II

---------- Post added 04-19-2016 at 10:15 PM ----------

what i meant was compared to the original post, the reprocessed one turned very warm, white balance-wise. I liked the color tones of the original better.

I just wanted to know if you had seen Horsetail. I've tried twice in previous Februarys, without luck. You live much closer than me. Seeing El Capitan and read the words about a warm colored waterfall triggered the question.

That is quite a picture of yours. It is very impressive. Can you talk a bit about it? Where did you shoot it from? Time of day? Lens? It appears that you were looking westward.

mikeSF · 04-19-2016, 11:22 PM

Originally posted by lmd91343

I just wanted to know if you had seen Horsetail. I've tried twice in previous Februarys, without luck. You live much closer than me. Seeing El Capitan and read the words about a warm colored waterfall triggered the question.

That is quite a picture of yours. It is very impressive. Can you talk a bit about it? Where did you shoot it from? Time of day? Lens? It appears that you were looking westward.

oh, i wasn't sure what the reasoning was. sorry.
Yes, I went out this year, tried 2 days in a row and the first day the conditions were perfect and then about 15 minutes before go time, it fizzled (a big cloud blotted out the light). The next day conditions were bad all day but an hour before the show, it cleared and was memorable.
Shot from the North Drive turnout area. I think I used the FA150mm/2.8 on the 645Z. Some additional info in the flickr description if you click the image.
thanks for looking

**lmd91343** · 04-19-2016, 11:29 PM

Originally posted by mikeSF

oh, i wasn't sure what the reasoning was. sorry.
Yes, I went out this year, tried 2 days in a row and the first day the conditions were perfect and then about 15 minutes before go time, it fizzled (a big cloud blotted out the light). The next day conditions were bad all day but an hour before the show, it cleared and was memorable.
Shot from the North Drive turnout area. I think I used the FA150mm/2.8 on the 645Z. Some additional info in the flickr description if you click the image.
thanks for looking

What weather service do you use? I think I know the spot. I'd need to use a 300mm on my K3. Wait till next year!

Thanks!

DeadJohn · 04-23-2016, 08:02 AM

Originally posted by lmd91343

What weather service do you use? I think I know the spot. I'd need to use a 300mm on my K3. Wait till next year!

Thanks!

I think you converted equivalent focal length in the wrong direction. 150mm on the 645 is more like 75mm on the K3.

**lmd91343** · 04-23-2016, 08:48 AM

Originally posted by DeadJohn

I think you converted equivalent focal length in the wrong direction. 150mm on the 645 is more like 75mm on the K3.

You are right! I should try thinking now and then.

With respect to AOV, 645Z-FA150mm approximates K3-DA limited 70mm. (I hope I'm thinking now)

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04-19-2016, 09:47 AM	#16
John Poirier Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Gabriola Island Posts: 619	It's a very nice shot. Of the three versions you have posted, I prefer the natural one. I have a somewhat different approach to this sort of thing. My goal is to reproduce what I perceived when I was there. Your third version was an improvement in some ways, but the excessively blue shadows at left centre and the loss of definition in the clouds were not good. I've reworked the natural version using a combination of Camera RAW and Photoshop tools. I started by adding a bit of clarity, vibrance and saturation to the whole image. Then I worked on local adjustments using the dodge and burn tools in Photoshop. I selectively burned in shadows to enhance the texture and solidity of the rock faces, and to make textures more consistent across the image. In the sky I burned in midtones to darken the blue sky, then dodged highlights to lighten the clouds. I then used hue/saturation in Photoshop to tone down the sky blue a bit, as burning in the midtones had made the blue saturation a bit excessive. The goal was to make the sky more interesting. I could be tempted to lighten the heavy shadow in the lower right, but would want to have a higher bit depth file for that one. Most or perhaps all of these adjustments could be made in Lightroom using the Adjustment Brush thingie, but I'm more comfortable in Photoshop. Hope you find this useful.

04-19-2016, 09:49 AM	#17
Gray Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Cape Town Photos: Gallery Posts: 536	I prefer the natural image - the sky in versions 1 & 2 of HDR looks too artificial.

04-19-2016, 12:57 PM	#18
mikeSF Pentaxian Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: East Bay Area, CA Photos: Gallery Posts: 6,622	Originally posted by John Poirier It's a very nice shot. Of the three versions you have posted, I prefer the natural one. I have a somewhat different approach to this sort of thing. My goal is to reproduce what I perceived when I was there. Your third version was an improvement in some ways, but the excessively blue shadows at left centre and the loss of definition in the clouds were not good. I've reworked the natural version using a combination of Camera RAW and Photoshop tools. I started by adding a bit of clarity, vibrance and saturation to the whole image. Then I worked on local adjustments using the dodge and burn tools in Photoshop. I selectively burned in shadows to enhance the texture and solidity of the rock faces, and to make textures more consistent across the image. In the sky I burned in midtones to darken the blue sky, then dodged highlights to lighten the clouds. I then used hue/saturation in Photoshop to tone down the sky blue a bit, as burning in the midtones had made the blue saturation a bit excessive. The goal was to make the sky more interesting. I could be tempted to lighten the heavy shadow in the lower right, but would want to have a higher bit depth file for that one. Most or perhaps all of these adjustments could be made in Lightroom using the Adjustment Brush thingie, but I'm more comfortable in Photoshop. Hope you find this useful. superb sky work. a slight green cast to the valley, however.

04-19-2016, 03:04 PM	#19
John Poirier Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Gabriola Island Posts: 619	Originally posted by mikeSF superb sky work. a slight green cast to the valley, however. Thanks. Didn't work on the green in the valley. Possibly bring in a logging crew? Seriously, I don't see anything too far off in the trees. Maybe a monitor calibration difference? Not a major thing in a 5-minute makeover, anyhow.

04-19-2016, 03:08 PM	#20
csa Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Aug 2014 Location: Montana mountains Posts: 10,133	I prefer #3. As another member said, maybe crop a little of the sky, but otherwise; beautiful!

04-19-2016, 03:13 PM	#21
csa Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Aug 2014 Location: Montana mountains Posts: 10,133	Originally posted by John Poirier Thanks. Didn't work on the green in the valley. Possibly bring in a logging crew? Seriously, I don't see anything too far off in the trees. Maybe a monitor calibration difference? Not a major thing in a 5-minute makeover, anyhow. The waterfall isn't white, to me; in this retouch. But otherwise, nice!!

04-19-2016, 09:46 PM	#22
mikeSF Pentaxian Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: East Bay Area, CA Photos: Gallery Posts: 6,622	Originally posted by John Poirier Thanks. Didn't work on the green in the valley. Possibly bring in a logging crew? Seriously, I don't see anything too far off in the trees. Maybe a monitor calibration difference? Not a major thing in a 5-minute makeover, anyhow. it also got very warm and the water is yellow, but could be some golden hour

04-19-2016, 10:00 PM	#23
lmd91343 Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Los Angeles, CA USA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 1,027	Originally posted by mikeSF it also got very warm and the water is yellow, but could be some golden hour Mike, Have you seen Horsetail at golden hour in February?

04-19-2016, 10:13 PM - 1 Like	#24
mikeSF Pentaxian Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: East Bay Area, CA Photos: Gallery Posts: 6,622	Originally posted by lmd91343 Mike, Have you seen Horsetail at golden hour in February? yea, you mean this? Horsetail II ---------- Post added 04-19-2016 at 10:15 PM ---------- Originally posted by lmd91343 Mike, Have you seen Horsetail at golden hour in February? what i meant was compared to the original post, the reprocessed one turned very warm, white balance-wise. I liked the color tones of the original better.

04-19-2016, 10:57 PM	#25
John Poirier Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Gabriola Island Posts: 619	Originally posted by mikeSF yea, you mean this? Horsetail II ---------- Post added 04-19-2016 at 10:15 PM ---------- what i meant was compared to the original post, the reprocessed one turned very warm, white balance-wise. I liked the color tones of the original better. I didn't do anything to the colour balance. The warmth may be inherent in the image, a bit of golden hour effect as someone else suggested, but more noticeable when brightness is reduced. I'm getting tired, so I'm not going back into the image, but you can certainly see for yourselves. I made the rock faces darker mainly by burning in shadows in Photoshop, using multiple brush stroke, 0 hardness, 15 per cent opacity. You might be able to do something similar using the adjustment brush gadget in Lightroom with the shadows slider somewhat to the left. I agree that the waterfall is warmer than the snow in the scene. Again, that may be a bit of Golden Hour. Part of the warmth of the waterfall may also be explained by the translucency of the water, which may allow the somewhat warm-coloured cliff behind the falls to reflect warmed light back through the falls. Without seeing the surrounding landscape I can't entirely explain why the golden hour effect would be stronger in the closer part of the scene than on the distant peaks. Perhaps the colour of the distant areas is affected by blue haze. As a matter of personal taste, I like the enigmatic variations in colour temperature. Good night!

04-19-2016, 11:15 PM	#26
lmd91343 Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Los Angeles, CA USA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 1,027	Originally posted by mikeSF yea, you mean this? Horsetail II ---------- Post added 04-19-2016 at 10:15 PM ---------- what i meant was compared to the original post, the reprocessed one turned very warm, white balance-wise. I liked the color tones of the original better. I just wanted to know if you had seen Horsetail. I've tried twice in previous Februarys, without luck. You live much closer than me. Seeing El Capitan and read the words about a warm colored waterfall triggered the question. That is quite a picture of yours. It is very impressive. Can you talk a bit about it? Where did you shoot it from? Time of day? Lens? It appears that you were looking westward.

04-19-2016, 11:22 PM	#27
mikeSF Pentaxian Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: East Bay Area, CA Photos: Gallery Posts: 6,622	Originally posted by lmd91343 I just wanted to know if you had seen Horsetail. I've tried twice in previous Februarys, without luck. You live much closer than me. Seeing El Capitan and read the words about a warm colored waterfall triggered the question. That is quite a picture of yours. It is very impressive. Can you talk a bit about it? Where did you shoot it from? Time of day? Lens? It appears that you were looking westward. oh, i wasn't sure what the reasoning was. sorry. Yes, I went out this year, tried 2 days in a row and the first day the conditions were perfect and then about 15 minutes before go time, it fizzled (a big cloud blotted out the light). The next day conditions were bad all day but an hour before the show, it cleared and was memorable. Shot from the North Drive turnout area. I think I used the FA150mm/2.8 on the 645Z. Some additional info in the flickr description if you click the image. thanks for looking

04-19-2016, 11:29 PM	#28
lmd91343 Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Los Angeles, CA USA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 1,027	Originally posted by mikeSF oh, i wasn't sure what the reasoning was. sorry. Yes, I went out this year, tried 2 days in a row and the first day the conditions were perfect and then about 15 minutes before go time, it fizzled (a big cloud blotted out the light). The next day conditions were bad all day but an hour before the show, it cleared and was memorable. Shot from the North Drive turnout area. I think I used the FA150mm/2.8 on the 645Z. Some additional info in the flickr description if you click the image. thanks for looking What weather service do you use? I think I know the spot. I'd need to use a 300mm on my K3. Wait till next year! Thanks!

04-23-2016, 08:02 AM	#29
DeadJohn Pentaxian Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: New York Posts: 4,834	Originally posted by lmd91343 What weather service do you use? I think I know the spot. I'd need to use a 300mm on my K3. Wait till next year! Thanks! I think you converted equivalent focal length in the wrong direction. 150mm on the 645 is more like 75mm on the K3.

04-23-2016, 08:48 AM	#30
lmd91343 Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Los Angeles, CA USA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 1,027	Originally posted by DeadJohn I think you converted equivalent focal length in the wrong direction. 150mm on the 645 is more like 75mm on the K3. You are right! I should try thinking now and then. With respect to AOV, 645Z-FA150mm approximates K3-DA limited 70mm. (I hope I'm thinking now)