[aslyfox]

I need to decide quick, in the next 10 days, .to take advantage of a deal being offered

Grand Tetons trip in Dec '21, Jan - Feb ' 22 hoping to see predators, bull moose with antlers, bull elk with antlers and big horn sheep rut

would be in warm vehicle but photographing outside in cold air may occur

best guess on how the equipment would react

best advice on how to minimize any effect

best advice on when to go for what I hope to see

thanks for any and all help

[photoptimist]

Warm dry air (vehicle heat is on by recirculation is off) would be no problem. As long as the dew point inside the car is less than the temperature outside the car, no condensation will occur.

If the windows of the vehicle are fogging up (sweaty, breathing, talking people emit a lot of water), then things get more dangerous in two ways. First, a cold camera will fog up when brought into the vehicle. Moisture will condense on the outside of the lens and body surfaces. Zooming a cold camera lens inside a warm moist car can cause condensation inside the lens and camera. Changing the lens of a cold camera in a warm humid location could cause condensation inside the lens and camera.

So:

Do keep the heat on and recirculation off -- fresh air, warned as needed prevents humidity from building up inside the car.

Don't zoom or change lenses of a cold camera inside a warm humid location.

You could put the cold camera and lenses inside a plastic bag before you get in the car if you are hyper-concerned about condensation.

Have fun!

[robgski]

Take the trip.
Get a beanbag to rest the lens on the window if using the car as a blind.
Don’t change lenses within 5 minutes of going from heat to cold to avoid condensation inside the camera.
Biggest challenge will be condensation on the lens surfaces, so cover lenses until ready to use.

[aslyfox]

. . . Zooming a cold camera lens inside a warm moist car can cause condensation inside the lens and camera. Changing the lens of a cold camera in a warm humid location could cause condensation inside the lens and camera.

So:

Do keep the heat on and recirculation off -- fresh air, warned as needed prevents humidity from building up inside the car.

Don't zoom or change lenses of a cold camera inside a warm humid location.

You could put the cold camera and lenses inside a plastic bag before you get in the car if you are hyper-concerned about condensation.

Have fun!

Take the trip.
Get a beanbag to rest the lens on the window if using the car as a blind.
Don’t change lenses within 5 minutes of going from heat to cold to avoid condensation inside the camera.
Biggest challenge will be condensation on the lens surfaces, so cover lenses until ready to use.

thanks for the responses


I plan on using two cameras, K 3 III and K 3 II, one with telephoto, either D FA 150-450 or DA 55-300 PLM and the other with DA 16-85 primarily

or I could have 3 and add the K 1 II

so little need to change lenses

am worried about sucking in humid air with the zooms

---

Last edited by aslyfox; 09-21-2021 at 10:38 AM.

[UncleVanya]

Don’t worry too much if using from the car. If you get out for a while and if the windows are fogging up use ac/defrost to dehumidify. Also avoid using equipment that has gotten very cold until it warms back up inside a warm and humid car. Car may not be humid and if so shouldn’t be a big issue. If humid leave the equipment to warm back up or only use outside.

This isn’t hard to test. Take a filter with you not attached to the gear. Keep it exposed to the cold. If you renter the vehicle and it fogs you know what to avoid. A cheap lens is another option.

Take some soft cloths to wipe excess moisture off the bodies and some ziplock bags and desiccant to absorb extra moisture if it is an issue.

Basic cloth camera bags are sufficient no need for a hard waterproof case.

[aslyfox]

Take the trip. . . . .

are you going to help with the cost

seriously I hope to use points to pay for hotel costs

plan on eating cheap

[ProfessorBuzz]

Astronomers use Kendrick Dew Heaters to keep lenses from fogging up as the air cools at night. Generally they run off +12VDC and are available in different sizes.
Kendrick Astro Instruments - dew removal, imaging power, power packs, observer tent, solar filters, focus masks, USB hub,cord management solutions
There are a bunch of competing products out there, usually called Dew Heaters or Dew Straps and you need a little Dew Controller box to run them.
Worthwhile investment.

[aslyfox]

well

the wife decided on my Christmas present and the present for my 65th birthday on Jan 30 2022

I will get to go to Grand Tetons NP and Yellowstone NP in mid December of this year

perhaps a one and done

but all of my cold weather gear was bought when I lived in Iowa 1982 - 2001

and haven't even been tried on since moving to Kansas

and I have gained a pound or two since then

so I am shopping for bargains

I went to my local Army Surplus store and obtained snowmobile mittens which have a removable mitten insert

as well as two sets of fingerless gloves 85 % wool 15 % nylon which will fit inside the snowmobile mittens

why two, one to dry while I wear the other

it's a start

[UncleVanya]

This isn’t cheap but I highly recommend the Columbia OmniHeat products. Particularly those that are also omnishield. I have a jacket using that material and it is light and WARM. I can’t find the video review I found off the coat years ago but here’s a similar testimonial:

You Tube

You Tube

And you can find used and new coats on eBay. Highly recommended by this southern boy who traveled to Minneapolis in January (years ago) with a bunch of northerners who all ended up freezing cold in the zero degree (Fahrenheit folks) weather while I was toasty warm.

What’s important to note is that you do not tend to overheat in this gear. Also but the pants of you can or your legs will feel cold even in ok insulated pants because these are that good, The contrast is noticed.

[aslyfox]

thanks

my problem is that I would never use such a good winter coat unless I go on such a trip again

so if I spend a lot of money on such a coat, I either am stuck with its costs or have to try to sell it second hand

decisions decisions

[UncleVanya]

thanks

my problem is that I would never use such a good winter coat unless I go on such a trip again

so if I spend a lot of money on such a coat, I either am stuck with its costs or have to try to sell it second hand

decisions decisions

I use mine living in Charlotte NC. I thought mine would be a waste of money but at the time I supported part of the company located in Minneapolis and assumed it would be needed for return trips. But it is surprising how well it works in modest temps as well as extreme temps. There are several varieties. I would look on eBay - the cost is not too high and they hold up well. The Omni-shield part is fantastic for wind and rain, Omni-heat is crazy good for warmth and the coats don’t overheat you in my experience- it is hard to explain. Additionally they breathe moisture away from you - it really is a fantastic product.

---------- Post added 09-24-21 at 10:31 AM ----------

Edit. I paid over $200 for mine new and have never regretted it. Think what you spend on a rental lens and then how hard photography will be if you are freezing. You can buy on eBay far cheaper than what I paid.

[aslyfox]

I use mine living in Charlotte NC. I thought mine would be a waste of money but at the time I supported part of the company located in Minneapolis and assumed it would be needed for return trips. But it is surprising how well it works in modest temps as well as extreme temps. There are several varieties. I would look on eBay - the cost is not too high and they hold up well. The Omni-shield part is fantastic for wind and rain, Omni-heat is crazy good for warmth and the coats don’t overheat you in my experience- it is hard to explain. Additionally they breathe moisture away from you - it really is a fantastic product.

---------- Post added 09-24-21 at 10:31 AM ----------

Edit. I paid over $200 for mine new and have never regretted it. Think what you spend on a rental lens and then how hard photography will be if you are freezing. You can buy on eBay far cheaper than what I paid.

you

my friend

are a trouble maker

here in Kansas

I rarely wear more than a wind breaker style jacket

December Climate & Weather Averages in Topeka
High Temp: 43 °F
Low Temp: 24 °F
Mean Temp: 34 °F
Precipitation: 0.57"
Humidity: 71%
Dew Point: 24 °F
Wind: 7 mph
Pressure: 30.14 "Hg
Visibility: 9 mi

https://www.timeanddate.com/weather/usa/topeka/climate

December Climate & Weather Averages in Jackson WY

High Temp: 25 °F
Low Temp: 4 °F
Mean Temp: 15 °F
Precipitation: 0.78"
Humidity: 79%
Dew Point: 10 °F
Wind: 6 mph
Pressure: 30.17 "Hg
Visibility: 9 mi

Climate & Weather Averages in Jackson, Wyoming, USA

December Climate & Weather Averages in West Yellowstone
High Temp: 28 °F
Low Temp: 10 °F
Mean Temp: 19 °F
Precipitation: 0.60"
Humidity: 80%
Dew Point: 14 °F
Wind: 5 mph
Pressure: 30.21 "Hg
Visibility: 8 mi

Climate & Weather Averages in West Yellowstone, Montana, USA

2021 Sunrise/Sunset Daylength Astronomical Twilight Nautical Twilight Civil Twilight Solar Noon

13 7:47 am ↑ (122°) 4:47 pm ↑ (238°) 8:59:15 −0:37 6:04 am 6:30 pm 6:39 am 5:55 pm 7:15 am 5:19 pm 12:17 pm (23.4°) 91.506
14 7:48 am ↑ (122°) 4:47 pm ↑ (238°) 8:58:42 −0:33 6:04 am 6:30 pm 6:39 am 5:56 pm 7:15 am 5:19 pm 12:17 pm (23.3°) 91.496
15 7:49 am ↑ (122°) 4:47 pm ↑ (238°) 8:58:14 −0:28 6:05 am 6:31 pm 6:40 am 5:56 pm 7:16 am 5:20 pm 12:18 pm (23.3°) 91.487
16 7:49 am ↑ (122°) 4:47 pm ↑ (238°) 8:57:49 −0:24 6:06 am 6:31 pm 6:41 am 5:56 pm 7:17 am 5:20 pm 12:18 pm (23.2°) 91.478
17 7:50 am ↑ (122°) 4:48 pm ↑ (238°) 8:57:30 −0:19 6:06 am 6:31 pm 6:41 am 5:57 pm 7:17 am 5:20 pm 12:19 pm (23.2°) 91.469
18 7:51 am ↑ (122°) 4:48 pm ↑ (238°) 8:57:15 −0:15 6:07 am 6:32 pm 6:42 am 5:57 pm 7:18 am 5:21 pm 12:19 pm (23.2°) 91.462

Sunrise and sunset times in Jackson, December 2021

[UncleVanya]

you

my friend

are a trouble maker

here in Kansas

I rarely wear more than a wind breaker style jacket

My winter tolerance for the coat is anything below 35 degrees. But your situation could vary. Here we get wild swings 18 one night, 70 the next day sometimes. Typically I leave the coat put up and wear light jackets unless I’m expecting potential for rough weather, it’s really windy and wet and cold, or I could need the coat to walk comfortably if car broke etc. it’s overkill here. In Wyoming it may be life saving.

---------- Post added 09-24-21 at 11:41 AM ----------

Edit: a friend’s wife calls me satan because I am good at temptation. I talked her husband into many excellent lunches when he brought food with him to the office. Lol.

[aslyfox]

update on my planned trip to Jackson, Grand Tetons and Yellowstone Parks planned for December 13

Unseasonably warm and dry weather pattern for Jackson Hole

. . . The Town of Jackson has only received 0.7 inches of snow in November compared to an average of 11.5 inches.. . .

A slight cool-down will occur over the weekend as a couple of minor disturbances pass north of the area. It’s possible we could see some light snow or rain showers reach the area over the weekend, but the odds of precipitation are fairly low at this time as the main storm track will be located too far north.

The next chance of meaningful snow is expected in about a week from now, around Monday, December 6. Colder temperatures are also likely to arrive around this time.

Whether or not this storm proves to be a one-off event or the beginning of a more favorable pattern for snowfall remains to be seen, but there are at least some signs in the long-range that snow potential will improve heading into mid-December. . . .

Unseasonably warm and dry weather pattern for Jackson Hole - Buckrail - Jackson Hole, news Unseasonably warm and dry weather pattern for Jackson Hole

I cannot get into Yellowstone National Park unless there is sufficient snow fall to allow access to tracked vehicles

so the trip has been delayed until Jan 4

let it snow

You Tube

You Tube

[aslyfox]

as the poet wrote:

. . . .The best laid schemes o’ Mice an’ Men
Gang aft agley, [ oft go astray ] . . .

To a Mouse by Robert Burns | Poetry Foundation

_________________

Last Monday, Dec 13, I suffered a TIA [ transient ischemic attack ], went to the ED and did not get out of the hospital until the late afternoon of Dec 14.

Although I have made a complete recovery, my doctors have advised me against being in areas where immediate medical aid for strokes is not available. They are worried about another episode or even a stroke possibly occurring in the near future – 30 to 90 days

Therefore considering the airports, planes and the isolation in the Grand Tetons and Yellowstone, I have decided that I must cancel the trip for now.

I hope to make out there next year