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06-03-2010, 10:08 AM   #1
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Mamiya RZ33 - Worse sensor than 645D, more expensive

Just noticed here that Mamiya has announced a new digital medium format body - the RZ33 - one that has less resolution than the 645D and costs almost twice as much!

Looks like a big win for Pentax.

06-03-2010, 10:39 AM   #2
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How did you conclude that the Mamiya sensor is worse? It has somewhat less pixels and a bit larger area. That could be advantage for image quality. Apart from that - both cameras are rather different.
06-03-2010, 10:39 AM   #3
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Well, to be fair, I see it other features the 645D does not and that might not be a big win if you're after them. It looks like a great studio camera for shooting products if that is your business.
06-03-2010, 10:50 AM   #4
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Well, the size is very similar, and the resolution is lower - the big selling feature of MF is the insane resolution, and on those grounds the 645 wins.

I also doubt that the performance of the Mamiya sensor will be much increased considering that it has a more limited ISO range than the Pentax.

Take a look at some test shots on the Pentax: ?????6?????????????PENTAX645D????????????????????

At any rate, Pentax has an offering that is at least contending with if not better than the competition, at a fraction of the price. Looks good for them.

06-03-2010, 10:59 AM   #5
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QuoteOriginally posted by Eigengrau Quote
Well, the size is very similar, and the resolution is lower - the big selling feature of MF is the insane resolution, and on those grounds the 645 wins.
Wins for you. But the IQ, no doubt, between these cameras is picking the fly crap out of the pepper. If you're bread and butter is shooting models and products in a studio, I'd say this RZ33 wins. Be cautious about bringing the small format mentality to MF cameras. Mamiya has some fine optics.
06-03-2010, 11:03 AM   #6
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QuoteOriginally posted by tuco Quote
Wins for you. But the IQ, no doubt, between these cameras is picking the fly crap out of the pepper. If you're bread and butter is shooting models and products in a studio, I'd say this RZ33 wins. Be cautious about bringing the small format mentality to MF cameras. Mamiya has some fine optics.
How would you be able to say that the RZ33 wins in a studio? Pentax has some excellent optics of their own. Your claims are just as unsubstantiated as you suggest that mine are.

It seems like you think I'm dismissing the Mamiya as a worthwhile platform - that certainly isn't the case. Different bodies perform well in different situations. I do think it bodes well for Pentax, though, that they have a higher resolution model available at a lower price than their competitors.
06-03-2010, 11:18 AM   #7
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QuoteOriginally posted by Eigengrau Quote
...Different bodies perform well in different situations....
There you go. And the RZ33 with its features looks like an awesome studio camera.
06-03-2010, 11:44 AM   #8
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Tuco... Please explain the features of the new RZ33 that make it a superior studio camera vs the 645D...

06-03-2010, 12:20 PM   #9
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I like the bellows feature, system of view finder options and no camera orientation. Plus you get LS flash syncs. Good things, I feel, for the studio not that any other MF camera can't get the job done too.
06-03-2010, 04:54 PM   #10
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QuoteOriginally posted by tuco Quote
...is picking the fly crap out of the pepper...
First time I have heard this expression and absolutely love it.

It is difficult (for me at least) to compare these via their 'on paper merits' alone - but I somehow find a way to do the comparison anyhow . Armchair camera/lens evaluations - my lost calling? Maybe there is a business model out there based on handicapping cameras and lenses for people (like the oddsmakers use in sports betting). Anyhow, I have a Tamron wide zoom for my DSLR that on paper looks every bit the inferior compared to the name brand equivalent, but it is a great performer and I am happy that I ignored my paper comparison and went with what worked for me.
06-03-2010, 06:37 PM   #11
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QuoteOriginally posted by Eigengrau Quote
At any rate, Pentax has an offering that is at least contending with if not better than the competition, at a fraction of the price. Looks good for them.
Well, Pentax is the only MF manufacturer that also deals in the decidedly more cut-throat world of small-format cameras. They remind me of that smartarse kid at the end of The Emperor's New Clothes, who brazenly points out the emperor is actually nekkid. They're applying the SF pricing and business schemes to MF cameras.

Still, at the end of the day, the 645D has better AF (despite what certain detractors say that you're only supposed to have ONE AF point for MF cameras - anything more is just too easy, and that's bad, or something,) better weather sealing, higher res, 77 segment metering, and a much, much lower price. About the only thing they don't have is a waist-level finder.

And it's not as if Pentax doesn't have leaf-shutter lenses.
06-03-2010, 10:19 PM   #12
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Mamiya uses DALSA sensor. It's more expensive than Kodak.
06-03-2010, 10:20 PM   #13
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QuoteOriginally posted by Matus Quote
How did you conclude that the Mamiya sensor is worse? It has somewhat less pixels and a bit larger area. That could be advantage for image quality. Apart from that - both cameras are rather different.
DALSA is not bad sensor. But, not better than 40 MP Kodak.
06-04-2010, 12:32 AM   #14
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to mamiya's defence, I will say they make some superb lenses. Especially on their RF series lenses ...the 45mm f/2.8 was the sharpest wide lens for the 67 format ever made. and the rack a pinion focusing mechanism extends their lenses close focusing capabilities on the RZ33. I noticed the RZ33 camera is using a slightly larger sensor than the 645D - 44X33mm Vs 48X36mm

i'm all for competition; it encourages diversity and innovation. The Rz33 fills a different niche than the Pentax 645. it's not a simple case of one camera is being "better" than the other they are designed to suit different needs.however, I am disappointed by the lack of DNG on the Mamiya.

thought the touch screen interface seems to be a very good idea...depending on how that interface is designed.

Last edited by Digitalis; 06-04-2010 at 12:50 AM.
06-04-2010, 01:07 AM   #15
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QuoteOriginally posted by Digitalis Quote
to mamiya's defence, I will say they make some superb lenses. Especially on their RF series lenses ...the 45mm f/2.8 was the sharpest wide lens for the 67 format ever made. and the rack a pinion focusing mechanism extends their lenses close focusing capabilities on the RZ33.
Mamiya has a lot of mediocre lenses of 645 system (just 2-3 lenses not bad) and rather good lenses for 67.
645 is not strong.

Last edited by ogl; 06-04-2010 at 02:52 AM.
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