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01-08-2011, 05:25 PM   #46
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There are still some places where you can buy the FA 45-85mm, no longer for 300 perhaps, but still not that expensive. An A version of this lens, optically identical, is listed for 200

01-08-2011, 05:32 PM   #47
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Where exactly can I find the lens for these prices
01-08-2011, 05:43 PM   #48
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Sent you the links
01-08-2011, 11:40 PM   #49
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Joe Holmes on (general) MF lens frustration

Is lens problems (design and sample variation, often referred as "QC" issue) a Pentax specialty?

I revisited Joseph Holmes' sites and read this comment there again today:

Joseph Holmes - News: Photographers Comment on Quality Control

"1) Tim Ashley In GetDPI's forum:

You know, we can always question other people's methodologies and memories but in general his experience exactly matches my own. I test every piece of equipment I buy as soon as I unpack it and have an absolute rule that if it isn't right, right out of the box, it goes back immediately.

Since I got into MF I have had to return (or test in store and not buy) more items, especially lenses, than I can remember. My Phase kit arrived with a wonky kit lens. Silvestri could have had a lot of my money if I had been able to get any of their kit to focus. Mamiya lost me after two 28D's were just C**P and I eventually went second hand. I could (and have in the past!) go on and on but the fact is that this stuff is mighty sensitive to poor QC and poor QC is widespread.

Had I read this article before starting my journey in November, I would at least have known I was entering a vale of tears. As it was, there have been months of lost shots, detective work to try and work out which of many elements was the weak link in the chain, a feeling that everything I purchased was doomed. Now I learn that this is just standard. And, controversially, I have come to the conclusion that anyone who has not had the same experience has probably been either extraordinarily lucky or, more likely, they are insufficiently observant or demanding."

This was in response to Joe's long and famous essay documenting MF digital reality. The article is way too long to quote,

Joseph Holmes - News: Medium Format Problems

but there are some summaries nearing the end:

"So let's count up the lenses:

1) Two 24 A-D's (not counting the third one), 2) Three 35 A-D's, 3) Three 28 HR's, and 4) Three 35 HR's. And out of these eleven, how many appeared to meet the MTF spec? Two for sure and three fairly close but not really. Or maybe three with two not quites. Two to five good lenses out of eleven. And I'm still nervous about some of the five. Really what I'm looking for is just to be able to have the same thing (or better) from MF digital that I've had with my 4x5 for decades, and even to achieve it using the larger aperture optimums that Linos claims they are achieving.

I take that as approximately a one-in-four chance of getting a good superwide, view-camera-type, German lens when you order one. And for every lens that gets rejected by one photographer, if the thing isn't made right by Schneider or Linos/Rodenstock or one of the other vendors who assemble elements to shutters (possibly including Linhof, Sinar, Horseman, and Cambo), it then just serves to reduce the chances of getting a good one for the other photographers to almost zero. And these things aren't exactly in great supply to begin with.

The sorry thing is that other kinds of super wide lenses which might be useful with this format are generally worse. The 35 mm Hasselblad HC f/3.5 lens (built by Fuji) is a real lemon, as mentioned above. One of those was Don Wood's Hasselblad HC 35 lens, which is so blurry around the edges that we both regard it as useless -- it's simply impossible to get a sharp picture, even if you stop down to f/22. ..."

Surely it looks we live in a world far from being perfect.


Last edited by leping; 01-09-2011 at 01:53 AM.
01-09-2011, 05:39 AM   #50
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I'd get the FA 120mm Macro for 600 Euro in mint condition. Is this price too high?
01-09-2011, 06:48 AM   #51
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Leping
Excellent post
Yes it's QC from all the manufactures
I guess in this case you don't always get what you pay for
I would be happy if I could get M9 sharpness out of my 645d so I can print bigger then 16x24 native resolution
For me all I want is a good 45mm lens for the 645d so the search continues
Funny you mentioned the HCD35 yep not a good performer
I went with the hcd50 which worked great for me and I also had the hcd28 which is a special lens and I know that a lot of the flaws of that lens gets corrected in hasselblad focus software.
When I first looked at mf I looked at mAmiya / phase combo and I noticed
The same problem with there wa lenses all soft
I know I have said this a million times but I hope pentax will invest some resources to there 645 lens lineup
Steven.
01-09-2011, 09:54 AM   #52
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Stephen, we’d all like to see further lens development, or at least importation of existing 645 FA lenses. However, having said that, we all knew the lens situation when we bought a 645D. It’s a factor that causes me serious concern. However, there are lenses out there and they are much cheaper than those from other systems. I’ve seen three 600mm A* telephotos sell on ebay over the past year, ranging in price from $1800 to $2600. How much would an equivalent Nikon or Canon lens cost (or Leica, if they had one)? I’m finding very good performance with my existing supply of 645/67 lenses. Focusing is an issue and I’m finding some degrees of front focus (although not in the 120mm). Posted below are some early tests with a 200mm A, not the best of the 645 lenses, and this is before I knew it was focusing in front of the target. I find the resolution of this lens at f/8 more than satisfactory. At f/4, it was soft, but that may be the focus issue and it still sharpens passably well. In order: 1. Full image. 2. Crop at f/4, unsharpened. 3. Crop at f/8, unsharpened. 4. Crop at f/4, smart sharpen. The crops are actual pixels; I'm quite impressed that I can read the lock manufacturer’s name in the unsharpened image at f/8.
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Last edited by Thomas; 01-09-2011 at 04:10 PM.
01-09-2011, 10:03 AM   #53
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Thomas
Point well taken.
Actually the only lens I am not happy with is my 45mm FA, my 75mm FA, 120mm A, AND 200MM FA are all performing quite well.
It's just the 45mm which is frustrating me. I don't want or need supper wide but at least a have decent 35mm equivalent lens would be nice to have.
Steven

01-09-2011, 10:45 AM   #54
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Steven:

I sold my copy of the 45mm FA years ago, since I was getting better results with the 45-85mm FA. Of course you pay a price in speed and size.
01-09-2011, 11:18 AM   #55
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Has anyone tried the 67 45/4 on the 645D? It is very sharp over 2/3's of the 6x7 frame (stopped down), so it should perform well on the 33x44 sensor of the 645D.
01-09-2011, 12:03 PM   #56
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QuoteOriginally posted by surfotog Quote
Has anyone tried the 67 45/4 on the 645D? It is very sharp over 2/3's of the 6x7 frame (stopped down), so it should perform well on the 33x44 sensor of the 645D.
I'm very happy with the 45-85mm, so I hadn't considered that test. You made me wonder, so here's a handheld shot @f/8 with the 67 45mm, focus on the garage doors, crop is actual pixels. No sharpening or PP. A little noisy, but this is ISO 400. Not bad, I'd say.
The white vertical border between the door and the glass is only 2-3 pixels in width!
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Last edited by Thomas; 01-09-2011 at 03:22 PM.
01-09-2011, 01:59 PM   #57
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Thanks for the test shoot Thomas,
Yeah looks like if I want 45mm I will have to go for the 45-85mm zoom... Bummer, not so much about the price but the size of the lens

Steven
01-09-2011, 02:54 PM   #58
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size and above all weight is the main con. One reason why I never even tried the 80-160 which is heavier. Not sure how heavy the 67 45mm is, but at F4, that might be a suitable alternative.
01-09-2011, 04:18 PM   #59
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Thomas I miss read your post. The image you posted was taken with your 645D with the Pentax 67 to 645 adapter and the 45mm 67 lens?
Do you feel the IQ is better then the 645 45-85mm zoom??

Steven
01-09-2011, 06:55 PM   #60
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QuoteOriginally posted by kuau Quote
Thomas I miss read your post. The image you posted was taken with your 645D with the Pentax 67 to 645 adapter and the 45mm 67 lens?
Do you feel the IQ is better then the 645 45-85mm zoom??

Steven
I haven't done a real comparison, but I'd guess they are close. Based on the quick test I posted, the 67 45mm looks good, it certainly is on the 67.The 45-85mm is also very good and AF, so I have had no reason to look elsewhere.
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