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05-04-2011, 01:39 AM   #1
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First Roll Through 645d Disapointing

I have just got a roll of 400 ASA colour film through the 645N that I recently purchased back from the lab and the results aren't encouraging.

The shots are really thin and flat you can tell from the negs that there is no density. I from metered the camera and I'm sure the needle was dead in the middle. The shots were lit naturally.
There is also white sqiggly marks on the prints and dots which look like damage to the film emuslsion. Could this be dust?
Anyone out there got any thoughts? After this and $30 for processing and proofing I'm ready to go running back to my digital camera in a hurry!

05-04-2011, 01:52 AM   #2
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I wondered how got film into a 645d

Sorry, but I have nothing really useful to add.

Have you checked that the meter is accurate? Maybe compare it to another exposure meter?
05-04-2011, 02:03 AM   #3
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I thought the 645D was digital?
Have you considered this to be the problem?
Pushing film through a digital camera could yield unsatisfactory results
05-04-2011, 02:22 AM   #4
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Sharing the shot would help
I assume you are using a 645N and not a D.

Couple of possible reasons if lack of contrast is what you are pointing to.
Light leaks;
Over exposure (meter is out);
Film speed set wrongly so metering is wrong (still at ISO100);
Over processing at lab/scan


my few cents

05-04-2011, 02:35 AM   #5
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Yes - apologies it was a 645 N. Might have been wishful thinking!
05-04-2011, 07:26 AM - 1 Like   #6
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My first rolls through my new old 645 (the original one) last year was some 800 ISO expired 220 film. Besides the color being odd, I really wasn't happy with the results, at all. First roll of non-expired b&w 120 film...results were outstanding! I don't shoot much color film in mine but recently I've shot some Agfa 160 120 film (no idea on the expiration date) and been very pleased with the results.

One surprise I've had is that one roll I shot had signs of light leakage on the edges of the film. Apparently this was caused by my miss handling of the film during loading / unloading in strong light conditions. I'm a little more careful now about it and make sure the roll is tight and I change in subdued light.

Shoot some b&w film and see what you get. There may be something wrong with the camera as has been suggested but there are a number of variables to check out.
05-04-2011, 12:28 PM   #7
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You might try shooting a sequence and different iso's to figure out correct exposure for the camera. Shooting Provia 100, I had two original 645s, both had to be set to iso 160 for proper exposure. My 645NII is the same way, it must be set to iso 200.
05-04-2011, 01:35 PM   #8
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Color negative film has a pretty large exposure latitude. I generally shoot mine at 1/2 to 1 stop over exposed for the best saturation. As an experiment, try one frame at -1, one at dead even and one at 1 stop over.

05-04-2011, 01:44 PM   #9
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Thanks for these suggestions guys. I did actually shoot each frame sequencially at -1, 0 and +1. I also shot the same scene with my digital camera and the results were perfect. It may be the lab.
Any ideas on the white squiggly lines and dots on the film. From memory, I seem to remember this being a film processing issue too.
I didn't use the lab I normally use but a 1 hour guy down the road. I'm really starting to wonder if the $5.00 I saved in the process may be the problem.
05-04-2011, 02:44 PM   #10
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I don't know what experience you have with film, so i must ask, is the performance bad compared to other films (e.g. b&w 35mm's or 120 from other cams), or its just plain bad as you see it.
When looking at negatives they can look uncontrasty, because of the dynamic range they hold.

Thin negatives (transparent, few dark parts) are usually caused buy under, not over exposure.

Seeing the shots would really be helpful.

Even professional labs can mess up pretty bad. Although for me this has been more of a experience with colour films and scans. If it has been something in the developing process or handling this can be seen by the edges of film (parts not normally exposed to the light).
Whats the point of messing with such an advanced camera if you don't do the processing yourself?
Sometimes photographing the film with my 18-55 kit against ceiling comes out better than scans from lab. They don't pay the required attention.

More details would be welcome.
05-05-2011, 01:00 AM   #11
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I've had extensive experience with film but not for several years. I generally shoot with a Nikon D3x and make prints A3, A1 and AO which I sell for really good money all around the world. Always looking for more detail, but not wanting to get into a 645D or Hassleblad HD system at this stage, I bought a 67 and a 645 with a variety of lenses to see if I could get a higher level of detail when I compare a AO print made with a 67 or a 645n with one made by a D3x.
I'm almost certain that if the light meter on the 645 was correct, then the film has been over processed in the case under discussion. The white marks are almost certainly muck on the negs so I'm wondering if this guy down the road knows what he's doing!
Anyhow tomorrow. I'm shooting in the studio under monoblocs with the D3x and the 67 shooting an identical static object. I will be doing identical exposures and then will get the film processed at a prolab and a high quality scan done of one neg. Then I will have two A1 prints made and see what the results are like. If the 67 is better, I may buy more bodies & lenses to kit myself out, if not, I'll buy into the 645 D system at a later stage.
That's where I'm at, at the moment. If anyone has compared these two cameras side by side, I'd be VERY interested in hearing from you. Cheers
05-05-2011, 11:14 AM   #12
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QuoteOriginally posted by Joburger Quote
...
I will be doing identical exposures and then will get the film processed at a prolab and a high quality scan done of one neg. Then I will have two A1 prints made and see what the results are like.
...
A high-quality scan is needed indeed. But some places call their highest quality scan "high quality" when, in fact, they are really not that high of a scan resolution at all but rather just high quality for them. YMMV.
05-05-2011, 02:00 PM   #13
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The lab I spoke to who everyone recommended said they would produce a 200 meg scan. They charge $55 each and that includes cleaning up (dust etc.) and colour and density balancing. Having said that Tuco, I get the feeling you aren't confident I'm going to get better results with the 67 over the D3X.
05-05-2011, 04:05 PM   #14
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QuoteOriginally posted by Joburger Quote
The lab I spoke to who everyone recommended said they would produce a 200 meg scan. They charge $55 each and that includes cleaning up (dust etc.) and colour and density balancing. Having said that Tuco, I get the feeling you aren't confident I'm going to get better results with the 67 over the D3X.
Well, you shouldn't have to upscale or select a lower print dpi for A1 prints when a 6x7 is scanned around true 4000dpi like you would with the D3X. I've never done a print that large with either my 4x5, 6x7 or 6x6 cameras so far to say. But my MF negative scanner will do optically around 4000dpi at 48bit and the file sizes are over 200MB. But that's not to say they would be better than a drum scan at a lower resolution.
05-24-2011, 11:36 PM   #15
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Your description is very confusing. First of all, if there are "dots" on the prints then look at the negatives with a loupe and see what's what.

The mere fact that "the needle was dead in the middle" has everything to do with it, unless you were spot metering an 18% gray card which you didn't. Zeroing out the meter has nothing to do with getting to the correct exposure. You didn't say what you metered or what metering mode you used. But, the only accurate way to make the proper exposure is to take a spot meter reading of a known tonaity and then set the meter to a number that corresponds to that tonality. If that tonality happens to be 18%, that's the only time you would ever center the meter to zero. So, I think it's user error and you also have a crappy lab.

Take a look along the outside edge of the film frame with a loupe to see your camera settings (hopefully you enabled this very useful feature that prints information in the unexposed area of each frame). Maybe you set the wrong ISO.
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