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03-24-2012, 09:55 AM - 1 Like   #106
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One thing to keep in mind is the people shooting medium format have in general been using that format for many years. The type of photographer is different. the 35mm format has never really inspired the slow methodical process of photography.

35mm flexes towards the more action and telephoto side for pro photographers. Sure you can use it for landscapes and portraits, but lets be honest the design of 35mm dslrs is more grab it from the bag and get the picture before something changes. Some people will argue that the weight differences make it more applicable for travel. But they aren't looking at the whole picture as the differences between the D800 full kit of lenses filter, tripod, batteries, charger, laptop, camera bag, etc. aren't that different from the same thing in medium format. There are easier weight savings than the small contribution from the camera. I carried a Mamiya 6 for many years and it was just spectacular light in comparison. But in the end the complete kit was only about 4% lighter... Whether or not I decide to bring a couple bottles of beer took up that difference.

Medium format hits that medium between the 35mm style of photography and the extremely methodical patience oriented large format photography.

The style of photographer dictates camera selection more than numbers. I don't shoot action, I like cameras that are incredibly user friendly allowing me to focus on the picture and not the camera computer system. I prefer to keep things slow: getting my grad NDs aligned perfect, making sure my tripod is firmly anchored and camera leveled, using my handheld light meter to check the camera's meter, waiting for the clouds to come into position, etc. The bright viewfinders of medium format seem to inspire me more than 35mm. The feel that I have to be on the tripod most of the time makes me focus on choosing the perfect foreground to set up at and then focus on figuring out what I can make of the scene. With 35mm dslrs I just can't focus on the image as much. My photography level saw a drop when I started using Pentax dslrs to supplement my 645N (Film, processing, and drum scans were getting expensive).

I presume there are many more photographers out there with a similar perspective. Many of the people using the 645D are likely using it because of the format not the numbers or price. Because in reality the price isn't that different when you look at everything you have invested: lenses, tripods, special purpose tripod feet, leveling bases, ball heads, gimbal heads, lens plates, camera plates, macro focusing rails, extension tubes, grad NDs, polarizers, UV filters, camera bags, computer software, higher performance computer, camera memory, studio lights, remote batteries for studio strobes, remote switches, replacement camera batteries, solar power, travel expenses, "what ever else your kit includes"...

Leica users are the same way. They pay well over what a similarly spec'd Nikon or Canon costs. They like them because how the camera inspires their style not because on numbers. The only problem with them is they are arrogant...


Last edited by atlnq9; 03-24-2012 at 10:03 AM.
03-24-2012, 10:09 AM   #107
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And 3:2 sucks...IMHO.

03-24-2012, 01:08 PM   #108
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i wouldn't say 3:2 sucks...and talking about formats i prefer without any doubt 6x6.
03-24-2012, 03:42 PM   #109
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QuoteOriginally posted by Coeurdechene Quote
i wouldn't say 3:2 sucks...and talking about formats i prefer without any doubt 6x6.
Hence the smiley. But personally of all the formats I have used, 3:2 has been the hardest to get good images with. It is either too narrow or not narrow enough.

03-24-2012, 07:30 PM - 1 Like   #110
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I made a few test shots today with my D800 and 645D - a landscape scene with good light and great fine edge detail - forest scenes, some close, some a mile away. One of my favorite 645 lenses is the FA 80-160, and so I put it up against one of my favorite Nikon lenses, the 70-200 VRII - images were zoomed to similar field of view for the test images (using big tripod, cube head, mirror up with cable release, etc. - my normal way to shoot). I bought the Nikon to do ultrawides and long telephoto work with (which I can't do with the Pentax), but was secretly hoping the Nikon would also do well with normal-range lenses up against the Pentax so I could consider becoming a one-camera guy again (and selling the Pentax). I was a bit surprised by the outcome - the Pentax files were clearly sharper/better than the Nikon files (no post processing done to either, just run through ACR to open). I will shoot more tests in the days to come, but my early opinion is that for my landscape work I will need both camera systems to cover my needs to get the best image files. The Pentax files really are very sweet...
03-24-2012, 07:56 PM   #111
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QuoteOriginally posted by jwoodland Quote
I made a few test shots today with my D800 and 645D - a landscape scene with good light and great fine edge detail - forest scenes, some close, some a mile away. One of my favorite 645 lenses is the FA 80-160, and so I put it up against one of my favorite Nikon lenses, the 70-200 VRII - images were zoomed to similar field of view for the test images (using big tripod, cube head, mirror up with cable release, etc. - my normal way to shoot). I bought the Nikon to do ultrawides and long telephoto work with (which I can't do with the Pentax), but was secretly hoping the Nikon would also do well with normal-range lenses up against the Pentax so I could consider becoming a one-camera guy again (and selling the Pentax). I was a bit surprised by the outcome - the Pentax files were clearly sharper/better than the Nikon files (no post processing done to either, just run through ACR to open). I will shoot more tests in the days to come, but my early opinion is that for my landscape work I will need both camera systems to cover my needs to get the best image files. The Pentax files really are very sweet...
Can't wait to see!!
05-11-2012, 02:38 PM   #112
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me too.
05-25-2012, 07:44 PM   #113
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Impressive, 645 is still better, but the Nikon D800 is also and nice machine.

05-26-2012, 09:02 AM   #114
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They are both excellent cameras--I doubt few are going to be disappointed with images from either. They both have strengths and weaknesses. Most of the angst seems to come from the idea of missing out on something--the grass is alway greener...
05-26-2012, 12:15 PM   #115
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QuoteOriginally posted by atlnq9 Quote
One thing to keep in mind is the people shooting medium format have in general been using that format for many years. The type of photographer is different. the 35mm format has never really inspired the slow methodical process of photography.

35mm flexes towards the more action and telephoto side for pro photographers. ...
True, but APS is even better than 35mm for 35mm-style photography. Eg the K-5 with its smaller sensor have one stop advantage over Nikon/Canon FF cameras for the same DOF. In addition the K-5 have image stabilization on all lenses up to four stops. That give a total up to five stop advantage over eg the coming D600 used with "normal" zoom lenses. Thats a lot! Not to mention cost, weight and size issues.
05-26-2012, 01:37 PM   #116
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QuoteOriginally posted by Pål Jensen Quote
True, but APS is even better than 35mm for 35mm-style photography. Eg the K-5 with its smaller sensor have one stop advantage over Nikon/Canon FF cameras for the same DOF. In addition the K-5 have image stabilization on all lenses up to four stops. That give a total up to five stop advantage over eg the coming D600 used with "normal" zoom lenses. Thats a lot! Not to mention cost, weight and size issues.

This is not an advantage for on-tripod work, which is what I'd use a FF dslr to do.
05-26-2012, 04:20 PM   #117
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QuoteOriginally posted by civiletti Quote
This is not an advantage for on-tripod work, which is what I'd use a FF dslr to do.
We were talking 35mm-style work. That is grab your camera from the bag and shoot.
Anyway, faster shutterspeed at the same DOF is usually an advantage....
05-27-2012, 08:34 AM   #118
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The Pentax 645D is my street camera...
05-27-2012, 09:59 AM   #119
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Btw, what Lens(es) do you use with it in this exercice ?
05-27-2012, 10:54 AM   #120
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I have used my 645D for some street shooting in a couple of cities and will be doing more of it in tokyo in a few weeks. While it's size and speed is not designed for for street shooting, I find it interesting that it runs circles around the D800 in hand holding ergonomics; the very thing people assume that it's not designed for. The balance of the body and the deep grip make the camera a pleasure to hold. This very ironic since the intended use of the 645D is firmly on a tripod. Making it feel good in the hand should have been a second thought for the 645d designers but was clearly not. Meanwhile the D800 is stuck with a shallow grip that feels like it will slip out with the smallest amount of perspiration on the hand. I praise nikon for a great sensor and auto focus system but the body of the D800 is hardly worth the money if the majority of your time is spent hand holding the camera.
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