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05-25-2012, 08:17 AM   #31
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QuoteOriginally posted by Yamanobori Quote
Actually, I find your posts provocative. I do not find the 645D slow at all.
you just find them provocative because the carry a different opinion from yours. I have been working with the 645D for 11/2 years. The quality is great, no question about it. But it's not image quality that only matters, there are a couple of other points that are important as well, as I have mentioned in earlier threads.

QuoteOriginally posted by aurele Quote
dumb question, but we never know : Do you have some kind of optical correction turned on ?
nope. When I say slow it's the overall camera I mean, not just image processing.

05-25-2012, 09:25 AM   #32
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QuoteOriginally posted by aurele Quote
i've read that "impossible project" projected to re-manufacture 8x10 polaroid film during 2012 at the cost of 570 USD for 15 exposure.

Dunno if they did/do/will.
Impossible project consistency on their film is iffy at best.

there is a guy shooting 8x10 who had an 8x10 non scanning back made for his camera to replace the polaroids before he ran out of stock. he just used polaroid to conserve on film cost since it is even harder to replace
cost him as much as a very nice house - he got 2 made

He was shooting about 50 grand in polaroids a year so it made fiscal sense, and his client list is the type that will pay the big bucks associated.

Mitchell Feinberg’s 8×10 Digital Capture Back
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05-25-2012, 11:13 AM   #33
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QuoteOriginally posted by phonoline Quote
you just find them provocative because the carry a different opinion from yours. I have been working with the 645D for 11/2 years. The quality is great, no question about it. But it's not image quality that only matters, there are a couple of other points that are important as well, as I have mentioned in earlier threads.
No, you have an extreme/exaggerated position that is really not true.
05-25-2012, 11:16 AM   #34
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I haven't really given up on the 645D but selling stuff to bankroll the body plus a 25mm is going much slower than I had thought. In the meantime along comes the D800 which will require serious rethinking of my plan. I have a bagsful of lenses (FA 33-55, FA 35, A 35, FA 45, A 55, FA 45-85, A 80-160, A 120, A 150, FA150, A 200, FA 200, A 300, FA 400, Arsat 30mm, Hartblei 45 SR TS, and Practicar 500mm) which I have been collecting for the new body as well as a couple of 645 N I bodies. If I sell all my Pentax stuff and add the money that was going to go for the 645D body, I think I can get a D800 plus 14-24, 24-70, 70-200, 24TS plus some plane tickets. The reason for this serious consideration is mostly because I Iike wide angle landscapes in the 18mm to 28mm range, and the 24mm TS will be better than my Hartblei TS. Also I think live view is almost indispensable.

05-25-2012, 11:38 AM   #35
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QuoteOriginally posted by wkkato Quote
I haven't really given up on the 645D but selling stuff to bankroll the body plus a 25mm is going much slower than I had thought. In the meantime along comes the D800 which will require serious rethinking of my plan. I have a bagsful of lenses (FA 33-55, FA 35, A 35, FA 45, A 55, FA 45-85, A 80-160, A 120, A 150, FA150, A 200, FA 200, A 300, FA 400, Arsat 30mm, Hartblei 45 SR TS, and Practicar 500mm) which I have been collecting for the new body as well as a couple of 645 N I bodies. If I sell all my Pentax stuff and add the money that was going to go for the 645D body, I think I can get a D800 plus 14-24, 24-70, 70-200, 24TS plus some plane tickets. The reason for this serious consideration is mostly because I Iike wide angle landscapes in the 18mm to 28mm range, and the 24mm TS will be better than my Hartblei TS. Also I think live view is almost indispensable.
If you are not a Pro Landscape/ Archi photographer and you dont Print over 20x30 and extreme corners are not a concern to you and going with Nikon glass only and you are not a "perfectionist" then the Nikon D800/E will serve you better.
05-25-2012, 12:38 PM - 1 Like   #36
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QuoteOriginally posted by wkkato Quote
I haven't really given up on the 645D but selling stuff to bankroll the body plus a 25mm is going much slower than I had thought. In the meantime along comes the D800 which will require serious rethinking of my plan. I have a bagsful of lenses (FA 33-55, FA 35, A 35, FA 45, A 55, FA 45-85, A 80-160, A 120, A 150, FA150, A 200, FA 200, A 300, FA 400, Arsat 30mm, Hartblei 45 SR TS, and Practicar 500mm) which I have been collecting for the new body as well as a couple of 645 N I bodies. If I sell all my Pentax stuff and add the money that was going to go for the 645D body, I think I can get a D800 plus 14-24, 24-70, 70-200, 24TS plus some plane tickets. The reason for this serious consideration is mostly because I Iike wide angle landscapes in the 18mm to 28mm range, and the 24mm TS will be better than my Hartblei TS. Also I think live view is almost indispensable.
..but with the 645 you have bought into a system that is ahead of FF also in the future. The next 645 may have 60mp or even 100! and be in a very different league than any FF camera. Theres also the possibility for a FF 645D.
The Pentax 645D is not going to stagnate as the MF solutions was one that particularly interested Ricoh when buying Pentax camera division...
05-25-2012, 12:47 PM   #37
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QuoteOriginally posted by Pål Jensen Quote
..but with the 645 you have bought into a system that is ahead of FF also in the future. The next 645 may have 60mp or even 100! and be in a very different league than any FF camera. Theres also the possibility for a FF 645D.
The Pentax 645D is not going to stagnate as the MF solutions was one that particularly interested Ricoh when buying Pentax camera division...

I doubt a FF 645D, i thought there new lenses are made for a cropped 645 sensor, beside that the cropped factor save them from extream corners problems
05-25-2012, 01:01 PM   #38
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For the money the Pentax 645d cannot be matched (present price;although Linhof might be working on a model which costs less).

I could technically "get away" with exclusively using the Pentax. This comes from someone who presently owns the Hasselblad H4, a Mamiya, and a PhaseOne. Also noting, the Pentax is not quite as fast in processing work flow as a Hasselblad; not all too notable, but look at the savings as well.


But for anyone out there; I would suggest NOT getting it with more than two lens; preferably only one lens.

05-25-2012, 01:09 PM   #39
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QuoteOriginally posted by Medium FormatPro Quote
For the money the Pentax 645d cannot be matched (present price;although Linhof might be working on a model which costs less).

I could technically "get away" with exclusively using the Pentax. This comes from someone who presently owns the Hasselblad H4, a Mamiya, and a PhaseOne. Also noting, the Pentax is not quite as fast in processing work flow as a Hasselblad; not all too notable, but look at the savings as well.


But for anyone out there; I would suggest NOT getting it with more than two lens; preferably only one lens.
i find the 45-85 and the 80-160 to be a must "basic kit" lenses , they are the best zooms i have used yet in sharpness and contrast beside the Nikon 14-24.
you can complement them with a 120 macro.

But for Pro work u need few more lenses , but be picky in samples specially the 35mm
05-25-2012, 01:12 PM   #40
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QuoteOriginally posted by Abdallah Quote
I doubt a FF 645D, i thought there new lenses are made for a cropped 645 sensor, beside that the cropped factor save them from extream corners problems
1 lens is made to the crop the 25 because they had problems with the ff release version

everything else is FF with an eye towards a ff sensor, the next edition will almost certainly be 60 mp maybe more and quite possibly FF as well to separate it from the 35mm ff crowd, and compete with the ever expanding mp in MF
wholly different market, almost entirely pro who aren't as phased by price as the factor the cost and either it works within their model or it doesn't
05-25-2012, 02:40 PM   #41
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This is pure conjectue on my part but after having shot Pentax in a professional capacity for over 35 years and having a relationship with them before all the mergers and acquisitions....my educated guess Is possibly take a cue from their 35mm DSLR development. Once they made a commitment to APS sensor and dumped most of their FF lenses, there really isn't yet a clear sign of a 35mm FF DSLR body. My gut assumption is for at least one or two generations of 645D development, the 645D will use a cropped sensor but allow advancing technology to utilize a higher resolution sensor with better high ISO performance and also faster processors. This will still allow it to keep it's price advantage over others and remain in the "superb value for the $$ category.

I think where a future lens is to be released, if making it full frame isn't a cost or development issue, then it will a be full frame lens that also could be sold to film body users. If a given new lens becomes even most costly for development in a full frame version or technically challaging for edge performance, it then will be released for cropped sensor only. That's the way it's been with their 35mm lenses

As for my personally staying with the superb 645D body, my work and somewhat unique shooting circumstance has lead to some serious evaluation. When time permits, I'll elaborate on this in another post. Thanks!

Dave (DandA)
05-25-2012, 05:34 PM   #42
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QuoteOriginally posted by Abdallah Quote
If you are not a Pro Landscape/ Archi photographer and you dont Print over 20x30 and extreme corners are not a concern to you and going with Nikon glass only and you are not a "perfectionist" then the Nikon D800/E will serve you better.
Well, all the examples I have seen, corner sharpness is great in the D800. You will easily print D800 files over 20x30. With the Nikon tilt/shift lenses, this will make a better choice for a Architectural photographer. As for landscape, it just comes down to subtle things like format and the sensor size difference.

There are reasons for choosing one camera over the other, but not for the reasons you have given.
05-25-2012, 05:36 PM   #43
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QuoteOriginally posted by Medium FormatPro Quote
But for anyone out there; I would suggest NOT getting it with more than two lens; preferably only one lens.
What would your reasoning be for this?
05-25-2012, 05:46 PM   #44
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QuoteOriginally posted by eddie1960 Quote
not much chance of shooting 8x10 now unfortunately since the film stock is all discontinued. 4x5 is the best you can hope for (and i don't give that a whole lot longer)
8x10 film stock is still in production, even Kodak (but obviously who knows how long that will continue). Monochrome film is unlikely to disappear since it has long since moved over into the artistic world but the size of the companies producing it is shrinking. Ilford now do a special run once a year where they cut all the odd-ball sheet sizes like whole plate and 7x11 as well as the ultra large format stuff (7x17, 8x20 and so on up to 20x24) and that business model works well. There are other small players in Europe producing monochrome film and Chinese manufacturers feeding the Chinese LF scene which is apparently quite robust.

On the colour side there is only Fuji and Kodak left. Both suffer from having machinery set up to produce a much greater volume than is currently needed so the economics don't stack up as well, which may lead to the loss of colour film. All sheet film sizes are cut from the same master rolls, so if 4x5 is being produced there is no reason that either company couldn't follow Ilford's lead and cut the other sizes to order once a year. It just may be that they can't transfer production to a more economical plant without spending more money than would be saved.

Instant film is a whole other ball game with 3x4 (i.e passport film) the only LF size still being produced (by Fuji). The Impossible Project still seems to be limited to selling their experimental batches with no completed film in sight.
05-25-2012, 05:54 PM   #45
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I took a few shots at EXPOsure today with a 645D. Very nice camera, remember how heavy your film 645 was, it's not like that, and it's nicely balanced. I was suitably impressed.
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