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09-14-2012, 08:04 PM   #1
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Any full size digital or large size enlargement medium format pics on the net?

After looking around a bit I am finding that all that is available most places for examples of medium format pictures are really smooshed down compressed images that might as well have come from an APSC sensor. Even on the Pentax site they do a truly shitty job of showing what the camera can do, all they have is tiny images that could have come from the K5.

I tend to notice the medium format look more in the film threads where its always clear at any size when someone has posted a scan of a medium format negative by the ridiculous amount of detail it has, but even then its usually only up to the max size here of 1024.

People got to debating what it would take for the MF cameras to be marketable vs the ever growing quality of the FF ones. I don't think most people who say medium format is a waste of money have ever actually see a full size image from a digital or a very large high end scan of a negative.

Anyone know of any? Or at least an example that shows the original image and then a 100% crop like chunk from it?

09-14-2012, 08:22 PM   #2
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I have a few full image crops on my website under the following categories blog.dominik.ca/category/pentax-645d/ . It's not much but I guess it can give you a bit on an idea. I also shoot medium format and 4x5 film and am familiar with the differences the various formats have.
09-14-2012, 08:36 PM   #3
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645D???????????????PENTAX RICOH IMAGING

Pentax Japan website is better than the US website.
09-14-2012, 08:48 PM   #4
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How about some full size RAW files:

http://movies.dpreview.com.s3.amazonaws.com/pentax_645d/IMGP0984.PEF.zip

http://208.43.255.194/PRODS/645D/FULLRES/645DhSLI0100_NR_OFF.DNG

09-14-2012, 09:17 PM   #5
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QuoteOriginally posted by calsan Quote
645D???????????????PENTAX RICOH IMAGING

Pentax Japan website is better than the US website.
I would not judge the camera based on the samples posted on this page. For example the images from the 25mm lens that are up there look like oversized cell phone images which halos around the branches and a lack of detail. This lens is one of the sharpest lenses if used properly so posting the type of samples pentax has of a nearly 6 thousand dollar lens makes their products look bad.
09-14-2012, 09:28 PM   #6
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Drat, i just realized I'm too poor to view that DNG, I have windows XP still so there's no native plugin I can get and I don't have photoshop, plus I deleted GIMP which is the only program I could find that had a free DNG plugin (UFraw).
Maybe I'll actually bother to look at the CD's that came with the K20D (never touched em) and see what viewers are on there.

I feel older than I really am when I feel shocked at the size of that file (and how fast it just downloaded). It seems about 1/3 larger than I would expect when compared to the K5 raw's.
09-14-2012, 09:34 PM   #7
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QuoteOriginally posted by PPPPPP42 Quote
Drat, i just realized I'm too poor to view that DNG, I have windows XP still so there's no native plugin I can get and I don't have photoshop, plus I deleted GIMP which is the only program I could find that had a free DNG plugin (UFraw).
Maybe I'll actually bother to look at the CD's that came with the K20D (never touched em) and see what viewers are on there.

I feel older than I really am when I feel shocked at the size of that file (and how fast it just downloaded). It seems about 1/3 larger than I would expect when compared to the K5 raw's.
Try Raw Therapee: http://rawtherapee.com/releases_head/windows/RawTherapee_WinXP_32_4.0.9.50.zip
It's free, easy to use and works wonders with those 645D files.
09-14-2012, 10:58 PM   #8
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Looks like I will have to wait till I bother to get a 64 bit OS, it just keeps crashing or closing on its own when I try to view it full size or turn it into any other file type. Kinda clunky confusing software, that UFraw was actually much more intuitive. I still cant figure out how to clear all the preview images that accidentally got displayed when I was browsing for that pic you posted.

09-14-2012, 11:04 PM   #9
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QuoteOriginally posted by PPPPPP42 Quote
Looks like I will have to wait till I bother to get a 64 bit OS, it just keeps crashing or closing on its own when I try to view it full size or turn it into any other file type. Kinda clunky confusing software, that UFraw was actually much more intuitive. I still cant figure out how to clear all the preview images that accidentally got displayed when I was browsing for that pic you posted.
Hmmm, I've never seen this type of behavior before.
Perhaps it has something to do with your MS .NET framework files or something along those lines. TBH. I haven't run XP in ages, though I do run the 32bit XP version of Raw Therapee here myself.
I guess this could be a sign that you're going to have to pay if you want to play with the big boys.

That being said, there really isn't much to do to view images in RawTherapee.
For the most part, its as simple as opening the file, at which point, it will load with default configuration.
Then again... I guess that wouldn't work very well if the software keeps crashing on you.

PS. how much RAM do you have? I think I read somewhere that the min. requirements is 2GB.

Last edited by JohnBee; 09-14-2012 at 11:21 PM.
09-15-2012, 08:22 AM   #10
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4gb but of course that isnt all being used with xp32, I don't think its the fault of the program, It doesn't crash till I try to view the raw full size or try to convert it to anything, then I get an error and it closes. I really need a 64 bit version of windows 7, its kinda funny to see an out of memory error (the first in like 15 years) when I tried to batch process some HDR stuff. I see the writing on the wall, and it is in dollar signs.
The main hold up is I want a new processor and motherboard at the same time so I can buy the $100 cheaper OEM version (only installs and registers with microsoft for one motherboard) That $100 saved would almost buy the new motherboard and my "old" 2.8 ghz core 2 duo processor is way behind even the cheap stuff now.
09-15-2012, 01:53 PM   #11
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Pentax 6X7 example

QuoteOriginally posted by PPPPPP42 Quote
After looking around a bit I am finding that all that is available most places for examples of medium format pictures are really smooshed down compressed images that might as well have come from an APSC sensor. Even on the Pentax site they do a truly shitty job of showing what the camera can do, all they have is tiny images that could have come from the K5.

I tend to notice the medium format look more in the film threads where its always clear at any size when someone has posted a scan of a medium format negative by the ridiculous amount of detail it has, but even then its usually only up to the max size here of 1024.

People got to debating what it would take for the MF cameras to be marketable vs the ever growing quality of the FF ones. I don't think most people who say medium format is a waste of money have ever actually see a full size image from a digital or a very large high end scan of a negative.

Anyone know of any? Or at least an example that shows the original image and then a 100% crop like chunk from it?

This will give you some sense of the detail in a photo with a Pentax 6X7, Super-Takumar 2.4/105, 160 NC.
Size 1/3 of original grey test scan at 4800 dpi, 800 Mb on Epson V750 (flatbed),
By the way, this is shot handheld with ‘The Grand Slap‘ Pentax 6X7 without using mirror lock up.




Here is the ‘original‘ file at flickr: http://www.flickr.com/photos/32108329@N08/6319935398/sizes/o/in/set-72157628064543436/

..and here is 1/64 close up


Regards

Last edited by jt_cph_dk; 09-15-2012 at 02:01 PM. Reason: text edit
09-15-2012, 02:42 PM   #12
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QuoteOriginally posted by larkis Quote
I have a few full image crops on my website under the following categories blog.dominik.ca/category/pentax-645d/ . It's not much but I guess it can give you a bit on an idea. I also shoot medium format and 4x5 film and am familiar with the differences the various formats have.
Those are great samples and a very nice review as well. Regards
09-16-2012, 09:40 PM   #13
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QuoteOriginally posted by jt_cph_dk Quote
This will give you some sense of the detail in a photo with a Pentax 6X7, Super-Takumar 2.4/105, 160 NC.
Size 1/3 of original grey test scan at 4800 dpi, 800 Mb on Epson V750 (flatbed),
By the way, this is shot handheld with ‘The Grand Slap‘ Pentax 6X7 without using mirror lock up.




Here is the ‘original‘ file at flickr: All sizes | img002_size_1/3_original_grey | Flickr - Photo Sharing!

..and here is 1/64 close up


Regards
Your scanner does not have and optical path of 4800dpi. You could save yourself some file size by scanning at a lower resolution and get the same quality.
09-17-2012, 01:20 AM   #14
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QuoteOriginally posted by tuco Quote
Your scanner does not have and optical path of 4800dpi. You could save yourself some file size by scanning at a lower resolution and get the same quality.
Hi Tuco,

I wrote to Epson about the question (linking to filmscanner.info) and their answer was, that the maximum resolution for V700 and V750 is 6400X9600 dpi and 12.800X12.800 dpi with interpolation.

We have had this debate in other threads and if youre not actually saying, that 4800 dpi scans are worse than lower dpi scans, then I cannot see the relevance to my posting it here, wich is to make a high res 6X7 photo example availiable to the poster.

Regards


The following is in danish, but should be understandable:

Til Epson Support,

Jeg vil gerne vide, hvad jeg skal forvente af min V750 ved scanninger på 6400 dpi. Interpolerer den på dette niveau eller er det faktiske scans på 6400 dpi? Jeg spørger fordi der findes en ret negativ artikel (Test report film-flatbed-scanner Epson Perfection V750 Pro transparency unit: experiences report; image quality, scanning slides, medium formats) som påstår at scannneren ikke leverer den påståede kvalitet, at man kan nøjes med en V700 og 2300 dpi? Mit eget indtryk fra nærstudie af prøvescanninger er, at det ikke ser ud til at der interpoleres. Grunden til at jeg spørger er, at jeg skal producere scanninger af mellemformat (6X7) negativer til print på ca. 150x120 cm. Jeg oplever at det er svært at opnå god farvedybde i de mørke områder på billederne. Også når jeg bruger SilverFast Ai v.6.6. Har i evt. nogle råd?

Mvh. Jakob Trägårdh

..

Kære Jakob
Tak for at De kontaktede EPSON e-mail support.
Den maksimale optiske opløsning er 4800 x 9600 dpi ved scanning af dokumenter/billeder og 6400 x 9600 dpi ved scanning af transparenter (dias og film). Scanneren kan klare op til 12,800 x 12,800 dpi med software interpolation.
Dette gælder både for V700 og V750.
Vi har desværre ikke umiddelbart en vejledning vi kan sende til dig. Det lyder umiddelbart ikke til at der er noget galt med scanneren. Det er muligt du kan opnå bedre resultater ved at ændre nogle indstillinger i SilverFast. For hjælp med dette må jeg bede dig kontakte LaserSoft Imaging, da det er ikke er software der er udviklet af Epson. SilverFast Ai :: LaserSoft Imaging

Har du brug for hjælp med selve scanneren eller med Epson Scan er du selvfølgeligt velkommen til at kontakte os igen.
Med venlig hilsen
Jens


Note
: I´ll add a google translation for your convenience..

For Epson Support

I would like to know what to expect from my V750 by scans at 6400 dpi. Interpolates it at this level or the actual scans at 6400 dpi? I ask because there is a rather negative article (Test report film Document Flatbed Scanner Epson Perfection V750 Pro transparency unit: experiences reporters, image quality, scan slides, medium formats) that claim to scannneren not deliver the claimed quality that you can just with V700 and 2300 dpi? My own impression from close study of sample scans is that it does not seem to be interpolated. The reason I ask is that I need to produce scans of medium format (6X7) negatives for printing of approx. 150x120 cm. I find it difficult to achieve good color depth in dark areas of pictures. Also when I use SilverFast Ai v.6.6. Do you have any. some advice?

Sincerely. Jacob Trägårdh

..

Dear Jacob
Thank you for contacting EPSON e-mail support.
The maximum optical resolution is 4800 x 9600 dpi when scanning documents / photos and 6400 x 9600 dpi when scanning transparencies (slides and film). The scanner can handle up to 12.800 x 12.800 dpi with software interpolation.
This applies to both V700 and V750.
Unfortunately, we have no immediate guidance we can send to you. It sounds not that there is anything wrong with the scanner. It is possible you may get better results by changing some settings in SilverFast. For help with this, I must ask you to contact LaserSoft Imaging, since it is not software developed by Epson. SilverFast Ai :: LaserSoft Imaging

Need help with the scanner or with Epson Scan, you are of course welcome to contact us again.
Sincerely,
Jens

Last edited by jt_cph_dk; 09-17-2012 at 04:01 AM. Reason: text edit
09-17-2012, 07:50 AM - 1 Like   #15
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QuoteOriginally posted by jt_cph_dk Quote
Hi Tuco,

I wrote to Epson about the question (linking to filmscanner.info) and their answer was, that the maximum resolution for V700 and V750 is 6400X9600 dpi and 12.800X12.800 dpi with interpolation.
I think you asked the wrong question. But all you're going to get from Epson is double-speak anyway. Just think, you wouldn't need to spend as much as a new car for a scanner that does half that resolution if this comparatively inexpensive, commodity flatbed could actually resolve to that advertised resolution.

Last edited by tuco; 09-17-2012 at 09:17 AM.
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