645 Tilt Shift

TheDocAUS · 04-03-2015, 02:16 AM

I recently managed to get hold of a HARTBLEI Digital 45mm Super-Rotator Tilt Shift Lens (Medium Format - Pentax Mount). It works great on the Pentax 645Z, I have only done minimal testing so far, but it seems very sharp. Heading off for a major road-trip next week for 4 months. I intend to give it a workout.

---------- Post added 04-03-15 at 08:19 PM ----------

Originally posted by zapp

There is a reason why there is no T/S lens for Pentax available...

This is one available now, the HARTBLEI Super-Rotator. It is very sharp.

ndevlin · 04-03-2015, 07:12 AM

Really keen to hear how it works out! Keep us posted.

TheDocAUS · 04-03-2015, 12:19 PM

Initial view: very impressed.

There seems to be several Hartblei websites. This is the genuine one as far as I can tell: Hartblei Super-Rotator Tilt Shift Professional Lenses & Adapter Rings

I dealt with Vitaliy. May take a day or to to respond, but he always did. Helpful, focused on good service and delivered on time.

zobeleye · 04-03-2015, 11:39 PM

yes, Vitalyi is the son of former co-owner. I am also very keen on seeing results. he has responded the my email very promptly and seems to be a good bloke.
I like small companies that make things possible.
I was in touch with schneider last year for a couple of times, getting invited to see them at Photokina, could not go but sent sent a colleague and the stand wasn't even where they had said they would be, and he could not find them. that was about the new 28mmTS for nikon mount that they had announced 2 years ago.
when they started selling it, I found out that they had claimed new design, but the only new thing was the mechanism, the optics are still the same old sad Story.
so please be so kind and test it, so that we can support a small business and get the thing we want...
cheers
Stephan

jonmarsh · 04-04-2015, 08:23 AM

I have a Hartblei, purchased some years ago. If you don't need the tilt function, I think the Pentax SMC Pentax-6x7 75mm F4.5 Shift is somewhat better optically, and often can be found for a relative song on eBay. It does have a rotator function for changing the direction of shift. Drawback is that it's not as wide angle as the Hartblei, if you need that field of view, that's the way to go.

There's a very clean one on eBay from Georgia, USA, right now, for about $625. (No, it's not me!) See the reviews on this forum for more info.

TheDocAUS · 04-04-2015, 03:42 PM

I have the new Hartblei lense (you can still buy the older version), and so far it is very sharp.

Thomasbrowphoto · 04-06-2015, 10:18 PM

Would love to see some images with the lens on the 645 guys. :-)

TheDocAUS · 04-06-2015, 11:35 PM

Thomas I am now on the road, not far from you actually. Staying at Ballina tonight on my way to The Kimberley.

I can only offer one image. It is of Castle Rock on Flinders Island. It was the second image I took with the lense, the first one I messed up the rotation. All I did was extract the jpg from the raw file, stitched the 2 images together. PP was some sharpening, saturation, minor re-crop and resize. I was only experimenting.

While I can use T+S lenses, I am new to the camera and the lense, so do not expect miracles, I still have more to learn: http://thedocaus.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/FI-Castle-Rock.jpg

zobeleye · 04-07-2015, 12:03 AM

just bought the used one off Ebay.
looking forward to checking it out.
at the same time I got an email from vitalyi, the ukrainian Hartblei guy.
He is offering the 45 TS for 2400 us ATM.
that is a sweet deal ( i think)
Stephan

---------- Post added 04-07-15 at 07:06 PM ----------

another thing, just got a response from the Mirex guy, that it is mechanically not possible to do a T/S adapter for Hasselblad lenses onto the Pentax.
not enough Space...😔
that would have been so awesome
hope the Hartblei is IT
cheers
Stephan

TheDocAUS · 04-07-2015, 12:11 AM

Good price if it is the NEW version of the 45mm.

Thomasbrowphoto · 04-08-2015, 05:20 PM

Originally posted by TheDocAUS

Thomas I am now on the road, not far from you actually. Staying at Ballina tonight on my way to The Kimberley.

I can only offer one image. It is of Castle Rock on Flinders Island. It was the second image I took with the lense, the first one I messed up the rotation. All I did was extract the jpg from the raw file, stitched the 2 images together. PP was some sharpening, saturation, minor re-crop and resize. I was only experimenting.

While I can use T+S lenses, I am new to the camera and the lense, so do not expect miracles, I still have more to learn: http://thedocaus.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/FI-Castle-Rock.jpg

Ahh Nice image there mate. Looks very sharp indeed, you seem pretty happy with the quality of the optics. Could you compare it to any of the other 645 lenses you may have? I hope you capture some great images up in The Kimberly!

normhead · 04-08-2015, 06:15 PM

One of my friend's sons has bought a 4x5 film view camera and is investigating tilt shift as we speak. If you want to do it it's there. Just don't think doing it on a 35mm or 645 is really doing it. It's a large format thing. You can do it with smaller formats, but it's finicky and time consuming. OK< it's finicky and time consuming even on large format, but it has to be way worse on smaller formats.

fap · 04-09-2015, 02:27 AM

Originally posted by TheDocAUS

Thomas I am now on the road, not far from you actually. Staying at Ballina tonight on my way to The Kimberley.

I can only offer one image. It is of Castle Rock on Flinders Island. It was the second image I took with the lense, the first one I messed up the rotation. All I did was extract the jpg from the raw file, stitched the 2 images together. PP was some sharpening, saturation, minor re-crop and resize. I was only experimenting.

While I can use T+S lenses, I am new to the camera and the lense, so do not expect miracles, I still have more to learn: http://thedocaus.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/FI-Castle-Rock.jpg

Do you mind to share the un-edited jpg extract before the stitching? I am really interested to get the lens and would like to see a full size sample image made with the lens. Many thanks.

swelo · 04-09-2015, 06:45 AM

Sounds very interesting. I have for a long time been searching for someone with the combination 645z and hartblai. Could anyone be kind enough to share a RAW file?

Philippp · 04-09-2015, 09:34 PM

Hi All,
I'm late to this thread, brand new member to the forum.
Regarding the Hartblei 45mm super rotator, I purchased a new one eight years ago, and have used it on many different cameras. Mechanically it is ingeniously designed, and solid as a tank. Optically it is not a great performer. Lots of CA, curved plane of focus, soft in one corner. Perhaps the new ones are better, but make double sure it is the newer design. Many of the 45mm super rotators on ebay claim to be the digital version, but the lens groups appear to be exactly the same as the old ones. The only really sharp ones are those where Zeiss provided the glass, and hartblei the body. These sell upwards of $4K if you can find them.
I have had much better luck with a Zörkendörfer or Zoerk modified Mamiya 50mm shift lens (no tilt) made to fit Hasselblad. Every now and then you can find them on eBay. I recently purchased two copies for around $600 each, one went to a colleague. Very sharp, low CA mild barrel distortion easily corrected in ACR.
Agree with one of the posts mentioning use of a 45mm pentax 67 lens using a zoerk pro shift adapter. This is a pricey item somewhere around USD 2500 last time I checked.
Z
So, for the time being, the 50mm Mamiya/Hassy shift is it.
If tilt with longer focal lengths, or/and macro is your thing, check out Zork's multi focus system which employs enlarging lenses. It can also be used in conjunction with the Pro shift adapter.

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04-03-2015, 02:16 AM	#16
TheDocAUS Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2014 Posts: 126	I recently managed to get hold of a HARTBLEI Digital 45mm Super-Rotator Tilt Shift Lens (Medium Format - Pentax Mount). It works great on the Pentax 645Z, I have only done minimal testing so far, but it seems very sharp. Heading off for a major road-trip next week for 4 months. I intend to give it a workout. ---------- Post added 04-03-15 at 08:19 PM ---------- Originally posted by zapp There is a reason why there is no T/S lens for Pentax available... This is one available now, the HARTBLEI Super-Rotator. It is very sharp.

04-03-2015, 07:12 AM	#17
ndevlin Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 132	Really keen to hear how it works out! Keep us posted.

04-03-2015, 12:19 PM	#18
TheDocAUS Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2014 Posts: 126	Initial view: very impressed. There seems to be several Hartblei websites. This is the genuine one as far as I can tell: Hartblei Super-Rotator Tilt Shift Professional Lenses & Adapter Rings I dealt with Vitaliy. May take a day or to to respond, but he always did. Helpful, focused on good service and delivered on time.

04-03-2015, 11:39 PM	#19
zobeleye Forum Member Join Date: Sep 2014 Posts: 85	yes, Vitalyi is the son of former co-owner. I am also very keen on seeing results. he has responded the my email very promptly and seems to be a good bloke. I like small companies that make things possible. I was in touch with schneider last year for a couple of times, getting invited to see them at Photokina, could not go but sent sent a colleague and the stand wasn't even where they had said they would be, and he could not find them. that was about the new 28mmTS for nikon mount that they had announced 2 years ago. when they started selling it, I found out that they had claimed new design, but the only new thing was the mechanism, the optics are still the same old sad Story. so please be so kind and test it, so that we can support a small business and get the thing we want... cheers Stephan

04-04-2015, 08:23 AM	#20
jonmarsh Junior Member Join Date: Nov 2013 Posts: 40	I have a Hartblei, purchased some years ago. If you don't need the tilt function, I think the Pentax SMC Pentax-6x7 75mm F4.5 Shift is somewhat better optically, and often can be found for a relative song on eBay. It does have a rotator function for changing the direction of shift. Drawback is that it's not as wide angle as the Hartblei, if you need that field of view, that's the way to go. There's a very clean one on eBay from Georgia, USA, right now, for about $625. (No, it's not me!) See the reviews on this forum for more info.

04-04-2015, 03:42 PM	#21
TheDocAUS Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2014 Posts: 126	I have the new Hartblei lense (you can still buy the older version), and so far it is very sharp.

04-06-2015, 10:18 PM	#22
Thomasbrowphoto Veteran Member Join Date: May 2014 Location: NSW, Australia Posts: 335	Would love to see some images with the lens on the 645 guys. :-)

04-06-2015, 11:35 PM	#23
TheDocAUS Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2014 Posts: 126	Thomas I am now on the road, not far from you actually. Staying at Ballina tonight on my way to The Kimberley. I can only offer one image. It is of Castle Rock on Flinders Island. It was the second image I took with the lense, the first one I messed up the rotation. All I did was extract the jpg from the raw file, stitched the 2 images together. PP was some sharpening, saturation, minor re-crop and resize. I was only experimenting. While I can use T+S lenses, I am new to the camera and the lense, so do not expect miracles, I still have more to learn: http://thedocaus.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/FI-Castle-Rock.jpg

04-07-2015, 12:03 AM	#24
zobeleye Forum Member Join Date: Sep 2014 Posts: 85	just bought the used one off Ebay. looking forward to checking it out. at the same time I got an email from vitalyi, the ukrainian Hartblei guy. He is offering the 45 TS for 2400 us ATM. that is a sweet deal ( i think) Stephan ---------- Post added 04-07-15 at 07:06 PM ---------- another thing, just got a response from the Mirex guy, that it is mechanically not possible to do a T/S adapter for Hasselblad lenses onto the Pentax. not enough Space...😔 that would have been so awesome hope the Hartblei is IT cheers Stephan

04-07-2015, 12:11 AM	#25
TheDocAUS Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2014 Posts: 126	Good price if it is the NEW version of the 45mm.

04-08-2015, 05:20 PM	#26
Thomasbrowphoto Veteran Member Join Date: May 2014 Location: NSW, Australia Posts: 335	Originally posted by TheDocAUS Thomas I am now on the road, not far from you actually. Staying at Ballina tonight on my way to The Kimberley. I can only offer one image. It is of Castle Rock on Flinders Island. It was the second image I took with the lense, the first one I messed up the rotation. All I did was extract the jpg from the raw file, stitched the 2 images together. PP was some sharpening, saturation, minor re-crop and resize. I was only experimenting. While I can use T+S lenses, I am new to the camera and the lense, so do not expect miracles, I still have more to learn: http://thedocaus.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/FI-Castle-Rock.jpg Ahh Nice image there mate. Looks very sharp indeed, you seem pretty happy with the quality of the optics. Could you compare it to any of the other 645 lenses you may have? I hope you capture some great images up in The Kimberly!

04-08-2015, 06:15 PM	#27
normhead Pentaxian Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Near Algonquin Park Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 40,451	One of my friend's sons has bought a 4x5 film view camera and is investigating tilt shift as we speak. If you want to do it it's there. Just don't think doing it on a 35mm or 645 is really doing it. It's a large format thing. You can do it with smaller formats, but it's finicky and time consuming. OK< it's finicky and time consuming even on large format, but it has to be way worse on smaller formats.

04-09-2015, 02:27 AM	#28
fap New Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 7	Originally posted by TheDocAUS Thomas I am now on the road, not far from you actually. Staying at Ballina tonight on my way to The Kimberley. I can only offer one image. It is of Castle Rock on Flinders Island. It was the second image I took with the lense, the first one I messed up the rotation. All I did was extract the jpg from the raw file, stitched the 2 images together. PP was some sharpening, saturation, minor re-crop and resize. I was only experimenting. While I can use T+S lenses, I am new to the camera and the lense, so do not expect miracles, I still have more to learn: http://thedocaus.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/FI-Castle-Rock.jpg Do you mind to share the un-edited jpg extract before the stitching? I am really interested to get the lens and would like to see a full size sample image made with the lens. Many thanks.

04-09-2015, 06:45 AM	#29
swelo New Member Join Date: Jul 2014 Location: Skåne Posts: 7	Sounds very interesting. I have for a long time been searching for someone with the combination 645z and hartblai. Could anyone be kind enough to share a RAW file?

04-09-2015, 09:34 PM	#30
Philippp New Member Join Date: Apr 2015 Posts: 13	Hi All, I'm late to this thread, brand new member to the forum. Regarding the Hartblei 45mm super rotator, I purchased a new one eight years ago, and have used it on many different cameras. Mechanically it is ingeniously designed, and solid as a tank. Optically it is not a great performer. Lots of CA, curved plane of focus, soft in one corner. Perhaps the new ones are better, but make double sure it is the newer design. Many of the 45mm super rotators on ebay claim to be the digital version, but the lens groups appear to be exactly the same as the old ones. The only really sharp ones are those where Zeiss provided the glass, and hartblei the body. These sell upwards of $4K if you can find them. I have had much better luck with a Zörkendörfer or Zoerk modified Mamiya 50mm shift lens (no tilt) made to fit Hasselblad. Every now and then you can find them on eBay. I recently purchased two copies for around $600 each, one went to a colleague. Very sharp, low CA mild barrel distortion easily corrected in ACR. Agree with one of the posts mentioning use of a 45mm pentax 67 lens using a zoerk pro shift adapter. This is a pricey item somewhere around USD 2500 last time I checked. Z So, for the time being, the 50mm Mamiya/Hassy shift is it. If tilt with longer focal lengths, or/and macro is your thing, check out Zork's multi focus system which employs enlarging lenses. It can also be used in conjunction with the Pro shift adapter.