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10-17-2014, 03:35 AM   #1
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why tiff?

I notice that the Z will shoot tiff natively. Does anyone do this workflow? What are the advantages over RAW?

10-17-2014, 03:40 AM   #2
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I guess the only advantage is that TIFF's save you time, as they already include the color profile and lens corrections performed by the camera, just like JPEGs. But their huge filesizes makes them rather restrictive.

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10-17-2014, 04:38 AM   #3
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Tiff is one of the few file types now that can handle the emerging 32 bit floating point image brightness depth.
10-17-2014, 04:43 AM   #4
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I have been told that tiff was the thing for magazine use.
I have been told that tiff is lossless.
I have been told that you can make huge prints from it. for now I shoot a lot in raw and print and share in jpeg.

10-17-2014, 05:15 AM   #5
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QuoteOriginally posted by Adam Quote
I guess the only advantage is that TIFF's save you time, as they already include the color profile and lens corrections performed by the camera, just like JPEGs. But their huge filesizes makes them rather restrictive.
Oh , so perhaps they can also include all the qualities of jpg such as the dynamic range settings?
10-17-2014, 06:02 AM   #6
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TIFF files can include metadata much like a JPEG.
10-17-2014, 07:41 AM   #7
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QuoteOriginally posted by 672 Quote
I notice that the Z will shoot tiff natively. Does anyone do this workflow? What are the advantages over RAW?
To answer your questions as asked regarding in camera tiff, here's an excerpt on this subject from the Canon digital learning center;

“Some readers may wonder about in-camera TIFF files, especially as an alternative to unprocessed RAW files. After all, most RGB TIFF files are uncompressed, finished, and ready-to-use. However, there are several downsides to the idea of in-camera TIFFs. For one thing, standard in-camera TIFF files are typically limited to 8 bits of information per pixel instead of 12 or 14 bits, so they are inferior to RAW image data in terms of tonal gradation. Another downside to uncompressed TIFF files is file size: With a 12 million pixel camera, an 8-bit RGB TIFF image would produce a file size of about 36MB on the memory card for every shot — with none of the added flexibility or additional tonal information available in even a 12-bit RAW file. If the camera offered the option to record 16-bit TIFF files, the situation would be even worse because the file size would double to 72MB per image! These huge files would drastically impair camera burst performance and squander memory card storage capacity, with less image quality compared to RAW files. As a result, TIFF recording is rarely an option in modern digital cameras. However, TIFF is still the preferred recording format for storing post-processed images.”

(this is not without saying many save in PSD) ( Afaik the 36mp D800 is one that is capable of recording in camera 16 bit tiff with a file size of around 200mb vs around 76mb for raw.)

Also from Lynda.com regarding working with;

Exploring RAW vs. JPEG or TIFF files from the Course Photoshop CS6 for Photographers: Camera Raw 7

Last edited by Oldbayrunner; 10-17-2014 at 09:22 AM.
10-17-2014, 10:02 AM   #8
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Natively shooting TIFF also frees you from the vagaries of RAW converters.

Too bad Fuji & Sigma don't shoot TIFF.

10-17-2014, 10:46 AM   #9
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The advantages of TIFF specific to Pentax:


TIFF is a "lossless" format that includes things like digital filters and color profiles. Example: When I switch the camera to B&W, the RAW file is saved as a bland color image that I have to convert to B&W - same if you use portrait, landscape, bright, etc. TIFF files will be saved with the camera's processing settings. I like it because I love the ability to fine-tune those presets to my preferences.


General TIFF not specific to Pentax:


JPG is compressed, TIFF is not. Editing a JPG in photoshop, then saving re-compresses it, which will lose quality over a few editing sessions. TIFF will not suffer this loss.


As far as printing goes, this is dependent on your lab - some labs print better from TIFF, some don't even allow it. I use two labs, one does better with TIFF, the other does better with up-sampled JPG.


The disadvantage to TIFF is it's a huge file, much bigger than a DNG


Also worth mentioning: If you use Lightroom, and choose to edit a file in photoshop from lightroom, lightroom renders the images as a TIFF, then saves it as a TIFF when you close photoshop and return to lightroom.


A good way to incorporate TIFF into your workflow is to use it instead of JPG when you want to write the camera's color profile/processing (noise reduction etc.)/digital filters/white balance to the file, basically just like it does with JPG, but yielding a file that you can edit without having to worry about losing quality from saving.


Do pros use TIFF? Out of hundreds of stringer jobs, I've only had three companies ask me for TIFF. I use TIFF more for my own creative purposes than I do for paying jobs.


If you use a send-out lab to print your photos, and they allow TIFF, I highly suggest you get an image printed from a JPG and a TIFF, make it the same image, and compare to see if there is an advantage to be gained from that specific lab. Many of the better labs can tell you if they print better from TIFF than JPG if you email them and ask, but it never hurts to see the results yourself.
10-17-2014, 11:08 AM   #10
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For shooting
Not sure many people are getting it. . . . there is NO reason to shoot a tiff instead of a PEF/DNG/RAW. You either get 100% of the data from the sensor or not.
In essence you have a huge, uncompressed, processed file with limited ability for corrections on.
The only use I can see for shooting tiff is if you don't own/have access to a computer and need someone else (who is image manipulation limited) to print out the image.
The only use I can see for shooting jpg is if you don't own/have access to a computer and need to transmit/share your image and you.
For editing
Yes, when you export out of Lightroom/C1/ACR and bring the image into PS, yes it should be edited and saved as a tiff not psd or any other file format UNLESS somewhere down the creative food chain, someone needs the image to be implemented into their workflow as such.
Otherwise it is always a 16 bit tiff.
10-17-2014, 11:37 AM   #11
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Many news photographers shoot JPG because it's faster to transfer the images from the camera to their agencies. Many people don't prefer to manipulate their images after taking the photo, not just casual users, but working photographers as well. Many people who like the way Pentax cameras process the images prefer to shoot in a format that preserves that processing - RAW does not.


Perhaps YOU have no reason to shoot JPG/TIFF/etc. but there are many people out there working full time as photographers who find many reasons to do so.
10-17-2014, 01:05 PM   #12
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QuoteOriginally posted by chimpwithagun Quote
Many news photographers shoot JPG because it's faster to transfer the images from the camera to their agencies. Many people don't prefer to manipulate their images after taking the photo, not just casual users, but working photographers as well. Many people who like the way Pentax cameras process the images prefer to shoot in a format that preserves that processing - RAW does not.


Perhaps YOU have no reason to shoot JPG/TIFF/etc. but there are many people out there working full time as photographers who find many reasons to do so.
Hey Chimp (great nickname btw)
I do understand that
In my post I wrote "The only use I can see for shooting jpg is if you don't own/have access to a computer and need to transmit/share your image and you."
That's fine that "many people don't prefer to manipulate their images after taking the photo" but they also are not getting everything they can out of their images.
Think of it as shooting some RDP 8x10 and taking it to the local Walgreens to have processed, you're just not getting the most out of your camera and files.

QuoteOriginally posted by chimpwithagun Quote
Many people don't prefer to manipulate their images after taking the photo, not just casual users, but working photographers as well. . . . . . there are many people out there working full time as photographers who find many reasons to do so.
Personally, and don't take this as a jibe, but if you are working professional and are giving clients files right out of the camera, then you are not giving your best to them, period.
The camera does not know that you feel the shadows should be brought up a bit or to pull the highlights some, or that the pinks are over saturated. . . . . What happens when the client calls and asks to do those adjustments?
You try and attempt them on a jpg or a tiff? Or even worse an 8 bit file?
You start getting banding and losing colour definition etc because you locked yourself into shooting directly to a fixed file format.

Sure shoot your jpgs/tiffs but in the other SD slot through in a BIG card and save out all the raws, even just for a rainy day.

To each their own.
Good luck

Rob
10-18-2014, 05:16 AM   #13
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QuoteOriginally posted by chimpwithagun Quote
Also worth mentioning: If you use Lightroom, and choose to edit a file in photoshop from lightroom, lightroom renders the images as a TIFF, then saves it as a TIFF when you close photoshop and return to lightroom..
Sort of correct Lightroom developes in Prophoto RGB by default and renders as a tiff file format by default, (there is not really a save option per say in Lightroom), to add though one does have the option to change the rendering default to Psd which is Photoshops default. I have it set that way as I work mostly in Photoshop so it keeps my saved layered Psd file format across the board the same even though as mentioned you can work in Photoshop with tiff and do the same just as well.

Last edited by Oldbayrunner; 10-18-2014 at 05:30 AM.
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