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12-06-2015, 12:15 PM - 1 Like   #16
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Hi there,
I own the FA 400 and had similar problems to decide, whether the lens is good or not. Long lenses on the Z are VERY difficult to handle due to shutter vibrations. I recommend two tests:

use live view for focussing and be extremely!! precise
use as a test an object, which is close, about 5 m, the effects of small vibrations are much less visible when the lens is focussed quite close
use about 1/2000 as a shutter speed and differtent apertures
use tripod, MLU etc.
place tripod on concrete or similar
shoot

do the same with slower speeds


second setup

use a minus 10 stop grey filter to achieve very long exposures (20-30 sec), which will reduce the effect of shutter vibrations to zero
tripod etc as above
object distance can be far
make several shots
get rid of the grey filter and shoot with "normal speeds"

After comparing the shots, you will know everything

I doubted the quality of the FA 400 but after the tests I know now, whats feasable

Martin

12-06-2015, 03:28 PM   #17
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QuoteOriginally posted by gha128 Quote
That's quite a statement. I don't find that's the case at all. The 200 with 1.4 is fantastic.
You are probably right, but I have found that if I want to shoot long, is it the 300 or 400 on the Z that I really should use or do I invest in an A7rII and say a 70-400 or similar.

Really for me, I am waiting on the new K mount full frame, perhaps they may finally have a good EFC shutter and maybe even lens adapter for 645 DFA and FA lenses. That with the Z would be a treat.
12-07-2015, 12:10 AM   #18
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The EFC shutter had better be a global type*, the laggy rolling shutter on the Sony Mirrorless cameras can introduce unwanted artifacts.

*that would also give us the ability to sync with flash at any speed.
12-07-2015, 11:51 PM   #19
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QuoteOriginally posted by abrehm Quote
Thank you everyone for your responses! As for stopping down, I really don't shoot anything less than f/11 so its not a wide open issue. As others have mentioned I am suspicious that it is vibration from the lens sticking out so far in front of the camera, but I have done some unscientific tests of very fast shutter speeds (>1/1000s) to see if that helps at all. Unfortunately it didn't seem to help that much, but I also had to mess with ISO in this particular situation to get that shutter speed so maybe that had something to do with it.

I have attached two images to show what I am talking about. The first is the whole image and the second is a 100% crop of the tree in the lower right. When compared to my other lenses the 300 f 5.6 just docent come close. Recently I have resorted to using the A 150 and cropping but I prefer not to do that as I throw away too much data.

2351HD, it sounds like you have had similar issues with this lens. I too have thought about purchasing the RRS long lens support but I didn't want to spend more money without knowing if the lens was worth it and could produce critically sharp images, but it sounds like you are saying it works pretty well? As others have mentioned, I am primarily interested in this lens not only for the focal length but also the size and weight. By purchasing a RRS lens support that increases the weight similar to the 150-300 so would I just be better off getting that instead?

Thanks again!
Andy

Have you tried printing that image and establishing if it is as bad as you think...

12-08-2015, 08:19 AM   #20
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QuoteOriginally posted by gha128 Quote
Have you tried printing that image and establishing if it is as bad as you think...
I haven't tried printing it, but in comparison to similar images taken with the 150 this is significantly worse. Is there something unique about the Z that makes vibration issues worse? I have never shot a film 645 so can't compare but if it's a shutter/mirror issue shouldn't that be the same for the film variants? I'm just curious why the Z would experience such profound vibration issues.

To help though, I have bought a long lens support system so I can see how much that helps...
12-08-2015, 09:53 AM   #21
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QuoteOriginally posted by abrehm Quote
I haven't tried printing it, but in comparison to similar images taken with the 150 this is significantly worse. Is there something unique about the Z that makes vibration issues worse? I have never shot a film 645 so can't compare but if it's a shutter/mirror issue shouldn't that be the same for the film variants? I'm just curious why the Z would experience such profound vibration issues.

To help though, I have bought a long lens support system so I can see how much that helps...
May I asked what support system you bought? I found the Really right stuff option far to expensive for what it is.
12-09-2015, 07:32 AM   #22
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I agree, RRS seemed a bit over priced for me. I ended up piecing together a system from Sunwayfoto. They make all the pieces for a system similar to RRS but they do not market it as a package. From what I could tell online it seems they make a pretty high quality product so we will see. In Sunwayfoto came in ~$100 cheaper and about 1oz lighter. I will get everything from B&H on Friday so I will let you know how it looks.
12-10-2015, 01:09 AM   #23
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for manual focussing and landscape work, an alternative would be the 645 A 4/300mm, the copy of which I had was really sharp (visibly sharper than the 24x36 K 4/300mm). Ideally used with the Manfrotto Telesupport 293. It is heavy, though, but probably less so than the 67 ones. 77mm.

12-10-2015, 04:24 AM   #24
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QuoteOriginally posted by abrehm Quote
I agree, RRS seemed a bit over priced for me. I ended up piecing together a system from Sunwayfoto. They make all the pieces for a system similar to RRS but they do not market it as a package. From what I could tell online it seems they make a pretty high quality product so we will see. In Sunwayfoto came in ~$100 cheaper and about 1oz lighter. I will get everything from B&H on Friday so I will let you know how it looks.
I am going this way as well. I am thinking about a 30cm long rail in combination with the lens support (yls 01). But you also need a clamb on the rail to lift the camera a bit. Which one did you order the bi directonal one or the paralel one (DDT-53)?
Also I found out there are two companys making dedicated Pentax 645 camera plates, which a pin; RRS and Hejnar photo, as far as I can see they have no dealers in Europe.
12-13-2015, 04:11 PM   #25
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So I got the long lens support and have taken some test images to see what how the f/5.6 performs with it. I am still disappointed with the results but I guess I don't know if I am being too critical or not. Below is one of the sample shots, tripod, MLU, long lens support, 2 second delay with remote switch. Honestly I don't know what more I can do to limit/prevent shake so I feel like this is how the lens performs.

If so, is my only other option the 645 FA f/4 300mm? As mentioned before I would like to stay away from the weight of that lens but if it gives significantly better performance I will entertain it. Also, are there any adapted options from other manufacturers that would yield better performance?

Thanks all for your input.

Last edited by abrehm; 02-29-2016 at 09:03 PM.
12-13-2015, 11:50 PM   #26
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All I can say is that I use the 6x7 300mm f4 EDIF lens with an adaptor on my 645Z and 645D and have always been delighted with the results. One of the best lenses of the whole Pentax system and used lovingly by others I know on other camera systems (e.g. Leica S2). It is a hefty piece of kit, but I would be surprised if you were to be disappointed with its performance.

Last edited by Ed Hurst; 12-14-2015 at 12:08 AM.
12-14-2015, 12:38 AM   #27
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Try the 12 sec timer if on a z. Helps a lot

Take a look http://georgebarr.blogspot.co.uk/2014/08/pentax-645z-and-shutter-shake-updated.html?m=1
12-14-2015, 01:14 AM   #28
672
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400mm FA

mine looks okay and as mentioned elsewhere in this thread, it prints up real good. make sure you print something. here is a sample with three 100 percent crops. having said how great the FA 400mm is, I should mention that I also keep a 400mm P67 ed if F4 lens around in cases where i want the best image a telephoto can make on this sensor. But the lens is at least four times heavier than the one you are asking about.
Attached Images
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PENTAX 645Z  Photo 
View Picture EXIF
PENTAX 645Z  Photo 
View Picture EXIF
PENTAX 645Z  Photo 
View Picture EXIF
PENTAX 645Z  Photo 
12-14-2015, 06:53 AM   #29
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Thanks everyone. I have some things to look in to now. I can't say I'm thrilled about a lens that is 3 times heavier but if I can't get useable images from the one I am currently carrying around then it's worth a look.

672- those were taken with the f/5.6? Can I ask what your settings and technique were? Even at small compressed jpegs those look considerably better than what I am producing....

Thanks,
Andy
12-14-2015, 08:12 AM   #30
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This is a sample taken with the 150-300 at 300mm at f/9. Camera used was the 645D. No tripod, just hand held. 100% crop
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PENTAX 645D  Photo 
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