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02-28-2016, 04:33 PM   #1
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Pentax 645Z vs Phase one P45+

Well I had an opportunity(and gonna use for 7 weeks) to use Phase one p45+ for studio class. Tethering was essential cause the LCD screen had bad quality that I can't see the detail well and time consuming. Even this camera was quite old, I really impressed about this camera's color tone, image quality, and detail. Well K-1 is what I'm going to buy within 2 years but medium format cameras are quite interesting too since I'm using my own film medium format camera usually. I am not sure about Pentax 645Z or D cause I never used those cameras before but I would like to know the quality of those cameras compare to Phase one P45+ for curiosity. Color tone, image quality, and DR(highlight) are what I would like to know.

02-28-2016, 04:54 PM   #2
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I'm assuming you had the phase one on a old DF body - the new XF phase ones are wayyyyyyyy better.

As for comparing, the 645z holds up very well considering the enormous price disparity.
02-28-2016, 06:15 PM   #3
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QuoteOriginally posted by gavincato Quote
I'm assuming you had the phase one on a old DF body - the new XF phase ones are wayyyyyyyy better.

As for comparing, the 645z holds up very well considering the enormous price disparity.
I know that XF is WAAAY better. But it's very expansive and I do satisfy with DF body with P45+ back. Color tone was the best feature to me. I've been using K-5 but I don't like the color tone of it. CCD sensor tend to have film like color and noise I think. I wish to try Pentax 645d tho.
02-29-2016, 02:20 AM   #4
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QuoteOriginally posted by rlatjsrud Quote
I've been using K-5 but I don't like the color tone of it. CCD sensor tend to have film like color and noise I think. I wish to try Pentax 645d tho.
Film like color = distorted color.
No digital sensor noise has pattern and characteristics like film.

From my experience all Pentax DSLR cameras produce RAW files from which you can get colors as you need. Accurate or film like - that depends on your liking and skills.

02-29-2016, 02:27 AM   #5
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QuoteOriginally posted by rlatjsrud Quote
I know that XF is WAAAY better. But it's very expansive and I do satisfy with DF body with P45+ back. Color tone was the best feature to me. I've been using K-5 but I don't like the color tone of it. CCD sensor tend to have film like color and noise I think. I wish to try Pentax 645d tho.
As far as colour tone is concerned, depending on your post-processing software you can set up profiles for how you want colours to be rendered. If you're relying on either the K5's embedded profile or a default profile in your software, you should look into creating something more to your liking.
02-29-2016, 09:11 AM   #6
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QuoteOriginally posted by BigMackCam Quote
As far as colour tone is concerned, depending on your post-processing software you can set up profiles for how you want colours to be rendered. If you're relying on either the K5's embedded profile or a default profile in your software, you should look into creating something more to your liking.
Creating my own profile and color is the biggest issue to me. I use x-lite color checker but it just for matching colors to be similar. If I can manage the color tone and profile, Pentax 645 should be nice but for now, I have no idea how to do.
02-29-2016, 01:42 PM   #7
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QuoteOriginally posted by rlatjsrud Quote
Creating my own profile and color is the biggest issue to me. I use x-lite color checker but it just for matching colors to be similar. If I can manage the color tone and profile, Pentax 645 should be nice but for now, I have no idea how to do.
What post processing software are you using, and what (if any) profiling software (with your x-rite color checker)?
02-29-2016, 02:14 PM   #8
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QuoteOriginally posted by BigMackCam Quote
What post processing software are you using, and what (if any) profiling software (with your x-rite color checker)?
I usually use Lightroom for now. I rarely use photoshop but I'm not that good for retouching skin, hair, and etc yet. In lightroom I just adjust few settings and then use the profile from color checker passport by creating profile. Yeah it's very limited that I can't even try creating my own color so I tend to stick with specific cameras and brands. Idk how photographers create their own color tones and styles. If I have to use photoshop then I have no idea how to apply all pics that I'm editing at.

02-29-2016, 02:30 PM - 1 Like   #9
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QuoteOriginally posted by rlatjsrud Quote
I usually use Lightroom for now. I rarely use photoshop but I'm not that good for retouching skin, hair, and etc yet. In lightroom I just adjust few settings and then use the profile from color checker passport by creating profile. Yeah it's very limited that I can't even try creating my own color so I tend to stick with specific cameras and brands. Idk how photographers create their own color tones and styles. If I have to use photoshop then I have no idea how to apply all pics that I'm editing at.
OK. I use Lightroom too.

Have you used Adobe's free DNG Profile Editor? It does the same job as X-Rite's own profiling software (including creating "dual illuminant" profiles for a more accurate representation in different lighting conditions), but gives you a lot more control, allowing you to adjust the profile once you've calibrated to the Color Checker. In fact, it lets you edit the behaviour for all of the colours you see reproduced on the Color Checker chart. So, you might decide that you want reds to have more of a crimson feel, or to be saturated more than other colours... Maybe you want blues to be weaker, greens to be darker and more vibrant, or skin tones to have a slightly warmer feel... All of that is possible with this tool - but it does take some experimentation to get what you want. Working with some reference photos and interpreting what you see to inform.

The Mac version is downloadable here, and the Windows version is here.

There are tutorials scattered around the web, maybe on YouTube too...
02-29-2016, 03:01 PM   #10
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QuoteOriginally posted by BigMackCam Quote
OK. I use Lightroom too.

Have you used Adobe's free DNG Profile Editor? It does the same job as X-Rite's own profiling software (including creating "dual illuminant" profiles for a more accurate representation in different lighting conditions), but gives you a lot more control, allowing you to adjust the profile once you've calibrated to the Color Checker. In fact, it lets you edit the behaviour for all of the colours you see reproduced on the Color Checker chart. So, you might decide that you want reds to have more of a crimson feel, or to be saturated more than other colours... Maybe you want blues to be weaker, greens to be darker and more vibrant, or skin tones to have a slightly warmer feel... All of that is possible with this tool - but it does take some experimentation to get what you want. Working with some reference photos and interpreting what you see to inform.

The Mac version is downloadable here, and the Windows version is here.

There are tutorials scattered around the web, maybe on YouTube too...
So it creates my own profile for lightroom?
02-29-2016, 03:22 PM   #11
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QuoteOriginally posted by rlatjsrud Quote
So it creates my own profile for lightroom?
Yes. You take a couple of photos of the Color Checker in different lighting conditions - typically, one on a cloudy day and one under typical indoor house lighting, then load these into the DNG Profile Editor, and with a few mouse clicks, the software creates a profile. You can even do this with just one photo of the Color Checker in one lighting situation, but that profile will be less useful if used across a wide range of lighting conditions.

Once you've created that profile, it can be applied in Lightroom to photographs you take with that specific camera, and it should result in neutral, accurate colour reproduction. I use it this way all the time, as I want all of my photos to start off with accurate colour, even though I may subsequently change aspects of the hue, saturation and luminance for individual shots.

However, with that same profile still loaded in DNG Profile Editor, you can then tweak how each colour shown on the X-Rite Color Checker is rendered - as I say, you might choose to boost or reduce the saturation in one or more colours, perhaps skew the hue of other colours, or tweak the luminance. You can then save the edited profile and this can be used in Lightroom as a basis for your photos. Several people have used this tool to create profiles that broadly replicate a particular type of 35mm film with their specific DSLR.
02-29-2016, 03:31 PM   #12
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So do I need few pics with color checker first?
02-29-2016, 03:54 PM   #13
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QuoteOriginally posted by rlatjsrud Quote
So do I need few pics with color checker first?
Yes. As I mentioned, you ideally need to take two photos of the Color Checker - one in cloudy daylight, and one under normal indoor lighting. The software will use these to create a normalised profile which you can then either apply "as is" to your photos in Lightroom (to get *accurate* colour reproduction) - or tweak first, save it, then use the tweaked profile in Lightroom to give your photos a repeatable colour rendering effect.

Here's a tutorial I found online - have a read through and try it for yourself; this is how I got started...

How to Create a Custom Color Profile for Your Camera - Envato Tuts+ Photo & Video Tutorial
02-29-2016, 04:01 PM   #14
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QuoteOriginally posted by BigMackCam Quote
Yes. As I mentioned, you ideally need to take two photos of the Color Checker - one in cloudy daylight, and one under normal indoor lighting. The software will use these to create a normalised profile which you can then either apply "as is" to your photos in Lightroom (to get *accurate* colour reproduction) - or tweak first, save it, then use the tweaked profile in Lightroom to give your photos a repeatable colour rendering effect.

Here's a tutorial I found online - have a read through and try it for yourself; this is how I got started...

How to Create a Custom Color Profile for Your Camera - Envato Tuts+ Photo & Video Tutorial
Once concern that I have is that what if I use studio shooting cause each studio shootings have different light set up that i have to use the color checker every time.
02-29-2016, 04:07 PM   #15
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QuoteOriginally posted by rlatjsrud Quote
Once concern that I have is that what if I use studio shooting cause each studio shootings have different light set up that i have to use the color checker every time.
Just take a shot of the color checker *once* in that lighting, use DNG Profile Editor to create a profile, and use that (or tweak it to your liking, and use the tweaked profile) for all future shots in that lighting.
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