[petrakka]

Love it that you quoted yourself and had that metacognitive misfire. The main issue and interest that I perceive was the superior Hassy support, communication, and customer service. To me, you pay for that upfront when buying into their system. The major functional difference that I perceive are the leaf shutter lenses (the camera has no focal plane shutter) which makes it more compact, quieter, and can flash sync at any speed up to 1/2000" which is great for fashion, weddings, etc, for fill flash. Of course, there is also a downside to leaf shutters in the lenses such as cost, durability, etc.

Right. In my original post I actually stated that I thought the image quality difference (if it would even exist it would be incremental) was not really a selling point over the Z. The lens quality might be though - for both Fuji and Hasselblad. Fuji has a great looking lens roadmap too.

The form factor (the new hassy is lighter/smaller than a full frame dslr - heck, it is just a little bit bigger than the sony Alphas) combined with the leaf shutter, the better support and the questionable support/future/investment in photography of Pentax are all issues. Hasseblad plans to announce 5 new lenses for the X1d next year. Before I was full digital I was very much an 'in the field' medium format shooter. The 645D is good, but bulkier than the cameras I used to use and the sensor leaves something to be desired. I know the Z would remedy this, but since the body is the biggest investment I have in Pentax it's not really a huge deal for me to switch. I would pay a few thousand for a better flash sync alone - it opens up a new world of possibilities that HSS can't. The Hasselblad has that and then some. I am the sort of person that carries my camera with me walking for miles, pretty consistently. I can't do that with the Pentax but I can with my Sony kit, but the Hasselblad, I would be able to my desired format in a portable set up. I feel like I've been waiting years for a Mamiya 7 digital version. This isn't quite the same, but it's even better in some ways. The lenses that they are releasing right now cover (pretty closely) the only focal lengths I tend to use anyways. I'd like an in between 'normal' - but can live without it until they have it covered. The big issue with the Hasselblad right now is that it's not ready, and is continuously delayed. I hope they straighten it out. The Fuji is still on the table for me, but without the flash sync, and the bigger size of the fuji, and they don't have a pro support network here as far as I know - I would possibly be inclined to just stay with Pentax.

Getting a 2nd Z to make up for the service issues as someone else mentioned seems silly to me. I want to simplify my kit. Would rather spend more on one piece that suits me better. I'll always have a backup small format system that these days is plenty good for any job, just not always my preferred way to work.

[mikeSF]

Love it that you quoted yourself and had that metacognitive misfire. The main issue and interest that I perceive was the superior Hassy support, communication, and customer service. To me, you pay for that upfront when buying into their system. The major functional difference that I perceive are the leaf shutter lenses (the camera has no focal plane shutter) which makes it more compact, quieter, and can flash sync at any speed up to 1/2000" which is great for fashion, weddings, etc, for fill flash. Of course, there is also a downside to leaf shutters in the lenses such as cost, durability, etc.

ugh, so a very specific target demographic, but still nothing that would be construed as an "upgrade" to me. I'm not pro enough yet to invest in future perceived support.

[btnapa]

I'm not pro enough yet

I have seen your images. If you are not a pro I do not know who is.

[Alex645]

ugh, so a very specific target demographic, but still nothing that would be construed as an "upgrade" to me. I'm not pro enough yet to invest in future perceived support.

Since Iʻve been owning and shooting Pentax (1986) their support has always been minimal. I do not expect that to change, nor do I expect the Pentax line to vanish. They are a minor player with some major innovations, dedicated users, and slow, but steady growth. Iʻd love more support, but it is secondary to me to other things that Pentax offers in terms of price and function.

I also donʻt expect Hasselblad to change their support which has always been strong and will continue to be so unless they are sold to General Motors (i.e. Saab). Anyone remember the HERO program where they offered deep discounts on new cameras and lenses to educators and students? I just could never warm up to their price tag. When I lived in Switzerland in the 90ʻs (not to be confused with Sweden), I earned triple the income as a teacher compared to my compatriots in the US. And most Euro employers pay a 13th month paycheck as a sort of Happy Holidays/New Year reward to employees. Usually that would go to taxes, or gifts, or reducing your debts, ski chalet rental, or a new Zeiss prime.

[ivo919]

Hi,

Except if you are only shooting landscapes, don't switch yet from Pentax 645z to mirrorless medium format systems (Hassy/Fuji)... The sensors of these new cameras do not even have integrated Phase Detection (like Sony A7R II does...)... The 645z's AF is exceptionally precise, fast, and works in low light (-3 EV)... Contrast detect is just miserable in comparison...

Consider also that the 645z is weather resistant...

[Alex645]

Since Iʻve been owning and shooting Pentax (1986) their support has always been minimal. I do not expect that to change

Thanks Adam and Pentax: Now that on PF we have a direct link to communicating to Pentax customer service, what was minimal before is less so and I was the hypocrite that said "do not expect that to change" and "change is the only constant". Can I have some whip cream on my humble pie?

[672]

@ Mike SF , the Z is less than two and a half , not three..... (years old) late june 2014

[Jonathan Mac]

If I had the cash to go medium format right now I would wait to see how the new Fuji camera and lenses perform. If it's design ethic is anything like their APS-C models then it'll be superb.

Pentax has long had very, very poor post-sales service and there are many tales about it. I'm not sure about Fuji as I don't spend much time on Fuji forums.

[itshimitis]

I've considered moving out of my 645Z but not to a Hasselblad or Fuji system. I've found my K-1 delivers image quality that more than meets my needs for the market where I live most of the time. I'll probably continue using my Z for some travel photography on the mainland. Internationally, it's becoming more difficult to travel with large systems thanks to airline restrictions (Qantas comes to mind) and refusal to allow even one ounce over their posted limited.

The reality is the Hasselblad and Fuji systems that will use the same sensor as the Z, won't really bring any significant image quality improvement, if any at all, that the average wall art buyer could discern. They might be a bit lighter than the Z for photographers that want a slightly lighter load to carry.

One thing to remember. Pentax pricing is such that it's fair to say by the time the Hasselblad ships, you'll be able to buy two 645Z bodies for the cost of one Hasselblad. A spare body can alleviate to some extent the Pentax history of poor service and repair.

I don't generally get any issues travelling with my 645Z and the Sony plus lenses. In fact I often travel to Asia and also from time to time to US and to Australia/NZ and haven't had issues. Part of the reason will be that I'm often in business class, but even in economy/coach I had no issues on Qantas or Jetstar. What I tend to do is to have at least one of the cameras on a sling strap and wear it. This then means it's not luggage. It did result in a question from Customs in NZ on one occasion. I have never ever been challenged on any airline no matter what class I'm travelling in - even on Swiss who only allow 7kg in economy. I will sometimes take a lens out of my case and put it in a large coat pocket if I am made to weigh a cabin bag. If you have the 28 - 45 in a coat pocket your cot will become very heavy, but they never ask to weight the coat

[texandrews]

I don't generally get any issues travelling with my 645Z and the Sony plus lenses. In fact I often travel to Asia and also from time to time to US and to Australia/NZ and haven't had issues. Part of the reason will be that I'm often in business class, but even in economy/coach I had no issues on Qantas or Jetstar. What I tend to do is to have at least one of the cameras on a sling strap and wear it. This then means it's not luggage. It did result in a question from Customs in NZ on one occasion. I have never ever been challenged on any airline no matter what class I'm travelling in - even on Swiss who only allow 7kg in economy. I will sometimes take a lens out of my case and put it in a large coat pocket if I am made to weigh a cabin bag. If you have the 28 - 45 in a coat pocket your cot will become very heavy, but they never ask to weight the coat

This is what sort of floors me about the airlines.

I understand individual bag weight limits: imagine being the person who has to load bags! But the bag limit makes little sense to me---it should be less weight per bag, even if it means more, smaller bags. But total weight per customer? This would only make sense if the customer is also weighed! That's how I'd do it if I ran an airline---everyone step on the scale with all your kit and be assessed accordingly. Smaller bags that could be binned and loaded into the holds with equipment.

As for the overheads, I understand the size and weight and number restrictions: there is limited space, and none of us want some heavy bag hurtling out of an overhead bin onto our heads. It could break your neck.

OTOH, I have seen so many people routinely and cavalierly break the rules it's ridiculous, and the airlines' enforcements are so variable and quixotic that none of it makes any sense. There ought to be some rules governing special, expensive equipment as well---cameras, computers, sporting equipment, & etc.

As for swapping out to Fuji or Hassy? No thanks. The Fuji does look decent and the Hassy "pretty" although it is not my preferred implementation of mirrorless, saw them under glass at PhotoExpo, but the whole thing with either line would be so expensive that I'd never be able to do it. I've now got a Z, a K1, flashes, 11 medium format lenses (I had several from film days) and 3 35mm lenses, accessories including the 645 to K mt adapter, and all of it I was able to get for less than the Fuji and maybe 1 or 2 of the new lenses (although once an adapter comes out then the used market could come into play, advantage: Fuji), and happily now am all in one well integrated system of 2 formats. I'll gladly have that instead of some size/weight savings.

[Alex645]

This is what sort of floors me about the airlines.
total weight per customer? This would only make sense if the customer is also weighed! That's how I'd do it if I ran an airline---everyone step on the scale with all your kit and be assessed accordingly.

Welcome to Pentax Airlines. $.99/pound on all one-way domestic flights; $2.99 international. PF members only fly first class with discounted flights to Vietnam and the Philippines. All non-Pentax owners can upgrade to first class if they place their gear in the amnesty bin at the gate. Those flying economy may be barefoot and clothing is optional....however, all flights are photo-free unless taken with a Ricoh or Pentax branded camera (non-Ricoh/Pentax may be stowed in checked in luggage for nominal $99/bag fee). PF members have unlimited checked in bags, with no fee. Every flight has a raffle for a free 645Z system with 3 lenses of your choosing.

BTW: All planes are equipped with weather-sealing and shake reduction.

[2351HD]

The Hassy no, not tempting, but the Fuji yes.

I love it when others on this forum keep saying "the Pentax 25mm is good". Now please tell me where I can buy one and how Pentax are going to service it if it requires?

The look of that Fuji 23mm lens with 82mm filters.....joy!

For landscapes, the EVF wins every time for me for fine focusing. But then again the Z's viewfinder is good and it's AF focusing is accurate.

Pentax just need to get off their bums and release the promised normal and tele zooms, or at least give us a timeline.

As for the full frame 645 that Kenspo mentioned, don't hold your breath as he also told us that 645 lenses would have full compatibility with the K1 and that never came about either.

[Lacunapratum]

I got two of those 25mm just in case one of them breaks . I guess Pentax is busy right now developing their full-frame system, which appears to be selling better than expected. Happy for Pentax. I'd be glad to see a new body with the 100MP sensor and some new primes that will come with it, including an extreme wideangle. A fast portrait prime along the way wouldn't hurt either, and a longer macro.

In the meantime the prices for the body will go down. Based on everything else Fuji has done with their lenses, those new 23mm and 110mm are likely to rock. I also love the design of the camera, but I guess that's a matter of taste.

And then their flyer recalling half a century of Fuji lens design, for the 6x8, the GSW, and the large format lenses. They definitely know how to market themselves.

[Digitalis]

Considering my history with Hasselblad I will be doing a review of the X1D. I have had equipment from Hasselblad fail* and their service was superb. I had a replacement lens sent to me at no charge, and the damaged lens was repaired free of charge.

I have no history with Fuji, I don't know if their service department, or QC is any good. The only camera I ever used that was made by them was the X-pan. As I recall the lenses for it were a bit quirky.

*if you want to get technical, it was actually a lens made by Fuji that failed: the HC 50-110mm f/5.6, the front cell casing literally fell out of the lens barrel and took the front optical assembly of the lens along for the ride.

[petrakka]

I spend much more time for composing and metering than focusing when shooting medium format landscapes. Why do you need fine focusing for landscapes? Does the 645Z's focusing confirmation not suffice for focusing accuracy for landscape photos when the aperture is usually, if not always, stopped down?

2351 stated that the Z's viewfinder and AF were just fine, but if you've never used EVF for fine focusing you won't know what he means.
Sometimes landscapes need fine focusing, to assume otherwise is inaccurate. Not everything is shot at a wide angle and stopped down. People shoot landscapes differently. For instance, I shoot most of my landscape work at 50-100 mm and usually between 2.8 and f/8. Fine focusing matters definitely and I use the EVF all the time for it.

Personally, I won't buy another camera without EVF. In most scenarios I like it better than the traditional viewfinder. It is not a downside but a requirement for me at this point. You see the picture you are making - not just the framing of it.