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02-22-2017, 12:09 PM   #1
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645Z for interior photography. Any examples?

I would like to use my 645z for shooting commercial interior work instead of my 1DX and 17-40L. The problem is the only affordable option is the SMC FA35mm lens which I believe is around 28mm?
Is this wide enough? Do any of you have any examples you could share.

Thanks

02-22-2017, 01:13 PM   #2
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You might look over the work you've done with the 1DX and 17-40 to see the % of shots were taken at wider than 28mm (and think about how you'd handle having only a 28 as your widest FoV). Or, wander around your house with the 17-40 set to 28 to get a feel for the width.

If you are looking for higher resolution and better DR, you might also consider the K-1 with pixel shift. For completely static scenes like architectural interiors, pixel shift on a 36 MPix camera out-resolves a 50 MPix Bayer filter camera.

Last edited by photoptimist; 02-22-2017 at 06:22 PM. Reason: typo
02-22-2017, 03:31 PM   #3
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Thank you for replying. Yes I have looked at getting the Irix 15mm to go with the K-1. Using PS that should give my work the edge

---------- Post added 02-22-17 at 03:36 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by dcshooter Quote
This lens has a roughly 75 degree diagonal FOV on the 645z.

Here's what 75 degrees looks like:


Wide but not huge. You'd probably have to resort to stitching to do entire rooms.

By comparison, at 17mm, you are getting over 100 degrees on your 1x.
Thank you very helpful. Stitching might be too much work for now but def an option. J don't want to spend on the 35mm and be limited. There still seems to be gaping holes in the 645 lens line up. An affordable manual UWA would be amazing.
02-22-2017, 03:37 PM   #4
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Ditto what Photoptimist said. A K1 with an ultra wide, shooting in pixel shift, will deliver resolution near that of the 645Z, along with a wider color gamut, at far less money than the cost of the 645 28-45mm zoom.

02-23-2017, 09:51 PM   #5
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QuoteOriginally posted by creative69 Quote
I would like to use my 645z for shooting commercial interior work instead of my 1DX and 17-40L. The problem is the only affordable option is the SMC FA35mm lens which I believe is around 28mm?
Is this wide enough? Do any of you have any examples you could share.

Thanks
Just curious, do you need more resolution than the 1 DX provides?

Shooting interiors, are you not using perspective control lenses?

A Canon 17mm T/S lens (on my 1DX) paid for itself in one month. I later added the 24 T/S. Excellent lenses both though the 24 is easier to use. I use the 17 mainly for interiors and the 24 for most exteriors. For the work I do, 28mm is definitely not wide enough for interior work.

My clients have never asked for more resolution, but I'd love to use a Pentax tilt/shift or even just shift on my 645Z. Unfortunately, the Pentax cupboard remains bare.

Good luck in your search.
02-24-2017, 03:30 PM   #6
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QuoteOriginally posted by JohnCameron Quote
Just curious, do you need more resolution than the 1 DX provides?

Shooting interiors, are you not using perspective control lenses?

A Canon 17mm T/S lens (on my 1DX) paid for itself in one month. I later added the 24 T/S. Excellent lenses both though the 24 is easier to use. I use the 17 mainly for interiors and the 24 for most exteriors. For the work I do, 28mm is definitely not wide enough for interior work.

My clients have never asked for more resolution, but I'd love to use a Pentax tilt/shift or even just shift on my 645Z. Unfortunately, the Pentax cupboard remains bare.

Good luck in your search.
Hi Resolution is ok but 645z would be a step up to. Do you have any image examples of your 1dx and ts lenses?
02-25-2017, 12:42 PM   #7
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QuoteOriginally posted by creative69 Quote
Hi Resolution is ok but 645z would be a step up to. Do you have any image examples of your 1dx and ts lenses?
I'm thinking that's best done off this Pentax MF forum. My point was, for some, tilt/shift lenses are necessary in the work we do. And we feel it's time for Pentax to make a digital 645 wide t/s (or tell us this is not in the cards!)

-jc

p.s.

You could take a quick look at johncameron.ca (scroll down to 01). Then contact me from the site if you want to see something specific.

I guess my take away thoughts are:
- to show a small room well you are going to want the MF equivalent of a 17 or 18mm (FF) lens.
- to show the drama of a large or tall area, you are still going to want something that wide
- to properly/efficiently deal with perspective, you can't beat a tilt/shift lens
- a shift lens allows you to 'go wider than the lens' by shifting right and lift, or up and down
- to get whole room in sharp focus or focus down a wall (or in a landscape), tilt is your friend
- some wide t/s lenses have a protruding element that sometimes likes to surprise you when shooting into lights...
02-25-2017, 03:25 PM   #8
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Hartblei make a 45mm t/s lens, which is the only t/s offering for 645....there are several others posts on here which debate the image quality and what it can/should be used for - look out for Stefan Streib who was instrumental in using the Hartblei t/s on Phase One cameras a few years ago...his tech opinion is excellent and spells out the pros and cons......depending on your quality requirements it may fit the bill, although still not a cheap option, and likely made-to-order for a Pentax 645 mount from Hartblei. I have one , and use it for 'non-critical' images (ie not pixel perfect) as it is rather soft at the edges even when stopped down. Alternatively I have found using the 28-45 DFA for stitching to be an excellent alternative, if used with a proper tripod notched mounting bracket which puts the plane of focus over the centre of the tripod column.

02-25-2017, 04:00 PM   #9
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QuoteOriginally posted by creative69 Quote
I would like to use my 645z for shooting commercial interior work instead of my 1DX and 17-40L. The problem is the only affordable option is the SMC FA35mm lens which I believe is around 28mm?
Is this wide enough? Do any of you have any examples you could share.

Thanks
There's really not a good reason to use a Pentax 645Z for this kind of work. The lens lineup simply isn't there, and the need for that resolution or format isn't really there either. There's a reason that Canon is kinda the standard for this work. It's not the sexiest solution, but they have the best lenses for this work and they tether to C1 which are basically the two most important tools for interior/architectural work. I like my 645, but when I need to make those pictures I use another camera because the 645 isn't the best tool for the job.

---------- Post added 02-25-17 at 04:02 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by JohnCameron Quote
I'm thinking that's best done off this Pentax MF forum. My point was, for some, tilt/shift lenses are necessary in the work we do. And we feel it's time for Pentax to make a digital 645 wide t/s (or tell us this is not in the cards!)

-jc

p.s.

You could take a quick look at johncameron.ca (scroll down to 01). Then contact me from the site if you want to see something specific.

I guess my take away thoughts are:
- to show a small room well you are going to want the MF equivalent of a 17 or 18mm (FF) lens.
- to show the drama of a large or tall area, you are still going to want something that wide
- to properly/efficiently deal with perspective, you can't beat a tilt/shift lens
- a shift lens allows you to 'go wider than the lens' by shifting right and lift, or up and down
- to get whole room in sharp focus or focus down a wall (or in a landscape), tilt is your friend
- some wide t/s lenses have a protruding element that sometimes likes to surprise you when shooting into lights...
Not sure about Pentax making a 645 t/s - the need for those lenses is, if anything, going down not up. The other thing is, a t/s lens kinda goes hand in hand with capture 1 tethering, which Pentax also lacks. But there are architectural photographers who have abandoned them because software correction is that good now.
02-26-2017, 01:37 AM   #10
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QuoteOriginally posted by petrakka Quote
There's really not a good reason to use a Pentax 645Z for this kind of work. The lens lineup simply isn't there, and the need for that resolution or format isn't really there either. There's a reason that Canon is kinda the standard for this work. It's not the sexiest solution, but they have the best lenses for this work and they tether to C1 which are basically the two most important tools for interior/architectural work. I like my 645, but when I need to make those pictures I use another camera because the 645 isn't the best tool for the job.

---------- Post added 02-25-17 at 04:02 PM ----------



Not sure about Pentax making a 645 t/s - the need for those lenses is, if anything, going down not up. The other thing is, a t/s lens kinda goes hand in hand with capture 1 tethering, which Pentax also lacks. But there are architectural photographers who have abandoned them because software correction is that good now.
Pentax wont be making a 645 t/s lens....Stefan Streib explained that the investment required is way too high, and potential lens sales volume too low to warrant the investment...so we are limited to stitched images , or the Hartblei lens I mentioned above...I will post links to Stefan's threads when I find them...

---------- Post added 02-26-17 at 08:52 AM ----------

Here's the original explanation from Stefan about the 645 t/s from Hartblei....so the 3 options are , Hartblei, stitched images from the 28-45mm DFA(or 35mm DFA), or use your Nikon/Canon with their greater range of t/s lenses...I originally used a 24mm t/s on my Nikon D810 and got very good results.....the new 19mm t/s from Nikon looks like a very good lens!

To know your tools is the essence

My partners in Hartblei Kiev have pointed me to this thread and asked me to answer, maybe I can bring some light into this:

This is all about field curvature (astigmatism), same discussion as we had with Phase One (for whom we did an OEM version of the new lens for some time).
Also their users have split into 2 groups - Group one was very happy to use the lens for certain images, e.g. landscapes or portraits, people, food, all more artistic stuff and
Group 2 who Id like to call the Siemens-star followers were very unhappy for using it on architecture and precise technical stuff, although we even had advised Phase One to advertise
the lens with an artistic label, these customers started a rant about the "inferior quality" using it on 80 Mpix backs, which I call nonsense.

The 45mm has a very strong field curvature as it is a super-wide-angle lens capable to draw an image circle at 45mm large enough for even 6x9cm.

The lens was calculated some time back in the 70ies or 80ies and this means that the image plane is not very flat. To work with this lens best precisely (besides the artistic approach).
is to stop it down to f16, set focus not to center , but to a circle at around 1/3rd image height (from center) and also refocus a tad closer if needed, if there are important parts of the image outside of this thought curvature.

To learn how to use this use the brick wall test . User needs to train how to focus for a flat plane and for stitching, he may even need to refocus and maybe even tilt if there are
image parts he wants to cover in sharp resolution.

BTW many Leica M wide-angle Lenses have these field curvatures and nobody complains about this, at least people seem to know, what kind of tools they are using for which task.

And finally: the Hartblei 45mm TS is the ONLY existing solution for TS on MF. So unless somebody does a better solution (which I doubt, because it is a niche lens and incredibly expensive to develop , probably a new lens costs a company around 1 Million from drawing-board to shop), and the market numbers for possible customers in MF are SMALL., it is what it is. Take it or leave it.

BTW Phase sold the lens for about double the price as Hartbleilens.com does now. I think people need to adjust their mind-set and become realistic about what is possible and what is a pointless wish. We all want the super-deal for half the price, double the quality, with four times the usability.

Me too. If you find that, please tell me.

Greetings from Germany, Stefan
02-26-2017, 02:13 AM   #11
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QuoteOriginally posted by petrakka Quote
There's really not a good reason to use a Pentax 645Z for this kind of work. The lens lineup simply isn't there, and the need for that resolution or format isn't really there either. There's a reason that Canon is kinda the standard for this work. It's not the sexiest solution, but they have the best lenses for this work and they tether to C1 which are basically the two most important tools for interior/architectural work. I like my 645, but when I need to make those pictures I use another camera because the 645 isn't the best tool for the job.

---------- Post added 02-25-17 at 04:02 PM ----------



Not sure about Pentax making a 645 t/s - the need for those lenses is, if anything, going down not up. The other thing is, a t/s lens kinda goes hand in hand with capture 1 tethering, which Pentax also lacks. But there are architectural photographers who have abandoned them because software correction is that good now.
Here's one with the 28-45mm @ 28mm...maybe not what you're aiming for but gives a good impression of the fov....
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