Tips for Street Photography - Pentax 67

Femto1969 · 10-03-2017, 09:59 AM

Hi Team,

I just took my updated kit out for a spin on the streets of St. Louis.

I'm using a Pentax 67 with a waist level viewfinder and a 105mm f/2.4. But I have a variety of lenses and finders at my disposal (namely the 55 and 75mm lenses).

I thought that using the waist finder would be a great method for me. Bringing the hulking SLR up to my eye is not inconspicuous. Usually people immediately realize they are being photographed. With the SLR style and the waist finder, most people have no idea they are appearing in my viewing screen. And this way I can get that Vivian Meyer perspective, where everyone looks like a towering statue.

However I am hesitating quite a bit before I take the shot. It is hard for me to confirm sharp focus with the finder near my waist. My eyes aren't perfect and I'm still getting used to manual focusing. And the major advantage of shooting medium format is the detail - which could easily be lost with poor focus.

I'm wondering if you have any tips about nailing the shot sharply and quickly.

Here is my new strategy, and tell me if it makes sense to you:

1) Put my contacts in and wear a brimmed hat! I should ensure that when I go out my eyes are as sharp as can be and the sun is out of my eyes/finder

2) Frequently meter the scene and set the camera settings so I all I need to do is focus and snap

3) Use faster film, even in broad daylight (ISO 400) so I can get shots at 1/1000 of a second into the f/8 f/11 range, or higher. The reason I think this may help is that even if I miss focus slightly, at a higher f-stop, my depth of field will be wide enough where it won't matter. Sure I won't get quite the same level of subject to background separation, but at least I will have the shot in focus.

4) Just shoot when I have the opportunity. I've missed shots waiting to long for better composition. I'd rather have the shot without magazine quality composition/focus than not at all. I need to stop being such a miser with my film. The point is to get out there and shoot!

I'd love to hear if you think my new strategy will work, and if you have any other tips.

CreationBear · 10-03-2017, 10:41 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by Femto1969

wear a brimmed hat!

Ha, you have to be rolling with the off-side wooden handle as well...

Between being nearsighted and living in an armed (but polite) society I'm afraid I'm of no help with street shooting--but Pentax forum member "Oculus" is one of the best I've seen...it would be worth doing a search of PF to see some of his work.

pathdoc · 10-03-2017, 11:07 AM - **2 Likes**

The 67 uses the sort of film you sort of need to be a miser with. But in street photography it is a rule that sometimes composition beats both correct exposure and ultra-sharp focus. GIven the size of your negatives, you have a bit more latitude than 35mm and 120 shooters for creating the same-sized print in this regard. That's not a licence to go all balls-out, who-cares-about-focus Lomo style; just that sometimes there has to be give around the edges of picture quality.

The advantage of the 67 and cameras like it is that while it isn't exactly the most unobtrusive camera (take an ME or MX if you want that), it's the sort of thing that rates as an antique in most people's minds; it's practically a conversation-starter. I keep a few pics on my Flickr and in my phone that I can show people to demonstrate what I do, and quite a few are interested to see that film is still a thing (especially when I tell them about Caffenol).

Choose the right brimmed hat and you will look like a refugee from the days when the 67 was king. Shoot it proudly. Take pics of, or focus on, inanimate objects occasionally so people are comfortable with seeing it in your hands. Mark out a beat. Take it for a coffee regularly. Become part of the furniture. The more you're known, the more likely it is people will vouch for you if some idiot takes undue offence.

Femto1969 · 10-03-2017, 01:01 PM

Originally posted by pathdoc

The 67 uses the sort of film you sort of need to be a miser with. But in street photography it is a rule that sometimes composition beats both correct exposure and ultra-sharp focus. GIven the size of your negatives, you have a bit more latitude than 35mm and 120 shooters for creating the same-sized print in this regard. That's not a licence to go all balls-out, who-cares-about-focus Lomo style; just that sometimes there has to be give around the edges of picture quality.

The advantage of the 67 and cameras like it is that while it isn't exactly the most unobtrusive camera (take an ME or MX if you want that), it's the sort of thing that rates as an antique in most people's minds; it's practically a conversation-starter. I keep a few pics on my Flickr and in my phone that I can show people to demonstrate what I do, and quite a few are interested to see that film is still a thing (especially when I tell them about Caffenol).

Choose the right brimmed hat and you will look like a refugee from the days when the 67 was king. Shoot it proudly. Take pics of, or focus on, inanimate objects occasionally so people are comfortable with seeing it in your hands. Mark out a beat. Take it for a coffee regularly. Become part of the furniture. The more you're known, the more likely it is people will vouch for you if some idiot takes undue offence.

I am hoping that I can eke out extra sharpness on 8x10 prints than a 35mm even if things go badly. But my hope is to get good enough I can capture very sharp images of well-composed street shots.

I can't go 30 minutes without someone asking me about my camera. People usually say "thats a really nice camera!" but when further probed they know nothing about it or photography. What they mean is "thats a BIG camera." I'll take it - it starts a conversation. And yes, people seeing me shoot buildings and wide scenes makes them feel more comfortable with me being around. St. Louis is small enough for people to begin to recognize me as "the camera guy."

What do you think about my technique of shooting on faster film to be able to close down more? At some point almost everything will be adequately in focus. Definitely not at f/4, maybe close enough at f/8, and probably so a f/11 or f/16.

Thanks for the feedback!

**mattb123** · 10-03-2017, 01:12 PM - **1 Like**

Seems like a perfect scenario to figure out/practice your hyperfocal or zone focusing techniques.

**gofour3** · 10-03-2017, 01:20 PM

here is what I do for street work with the 6x7:

- shoot faster 400 ISO film, so more DOF.
- try and use hyperfocal focusing. (of course this is easier with my 67II, as it has aperture priority)
- otherwise I meter and focus on a "spot", so if someone walks into that spot all I have to do is press the shutter. If you are shooting 400ISO film and it's sunny then your shutter speeds will be pretty fast and your subject will be in focus.

Phil.

Femto1969 · 10-03-2017, 01:56 PM

Originally posted by gofour3

here is what I do for street work with the 6x7:

- shoot faster 400 ISO film, so more DOF.
- try and use hyperfocal focusing. (of course this is easier with my 67II, as it has aperture priority)
- otherwise I meter and focus on a "spot", so if someone walks into that spot all I have to do is press the shutter. If you are shooting 400ISO film and it's sunny then your shutter speeds will be pretty fast and your subject will be in focus.

Phil.

Yes, I've definitely been trying to envision my hyperfocal distances/focus zones. It is going to take a good amount of practice since I've grown up in the world of amazing AF.

Wow - I guess I didn't realize the 67ii has aperture priority. Drool. Maybe I should trade my two P67 bodies in and buy a 67ii.

I like your idea of the focus traps. I'll try this technique too.

What apertures do you usually find yourself using when you have ISO 400 in and its a sunny day? I'm trying to balance camera shake with DOF. I could shoot at 1/1000 and f/8 or 1/250 and f/16... Until I get a strong feel for how the negs turn out I don't have much guidance about which will be best. My sense at this point is to shoot at 1/500 and minimize the aperture/maximize DOF. I can be almost certain I will see no camera shake at 1/500 as long as I am steady. At least the difference between 1/500 an 1/1000 should be negligible. And this way I get an additional stop of DOF. Would 1/250 be pretty safe?

Thanks!

Swift1 · 10-03-2017, 02:10 PM - **1 Like**

I would use the 75mm or a 90mm for street instead of the 105mm. And I would practice judging focus distance by eye a using scale focusing. Use fast and try to keep your aperture near f/11
I don't think Aperture Priority will be a huge benefit, especially since it requires the AE prism.
I shoot using scale focusing with my Rolleiflex quite a bit. With practice you can get fairly quick and accurate.

**gofour3** · 10-03-2017, 02:38 PM

Originally posted by Femto1969

What apertures do you usually find yourself using when you have ISO 400 in and its a sunny day?

Here in not so sunny Vancouver, 400ISO usually means f16 and a shutter speed of 1/500, so no issues hand holding.

Yes the P67II has lots of extra features, including aperture priority, TTL flash & matrix/spot/centre weighted metering options. That and the user changeable focusing screens are the main reason to upgrade.

I like using my 55/4 & 67II for street shooting. just set the aperture to f/16 and move the infinity mark on the lens distance scale to f/16 and you just blast away like a P&S camera.

Phil.

Silent Street · 10-03-2017, 03:17 PM - **1 Like**

I am not involved in street photography, other than the absolute critical sharpness of low light landscape photography, so my suggestion is to dabble with hyperfocus and a fixed aperture of say f11 (3 m focus) and leave it at that and shoot away. A fair bit of the image will be sharp (all things else coming into play such as vibration and the natural wobbling about that is par for the course with the P67).

The 105mm lens is a bit long for street; I thought of the 55 or 45mm; either/both allow for easy cropping out of the frame and enlarging from that point. And the wider the lens, the more will be in focus.

Mastering any genre of photography is not, and never has been, dependent on equipment and features. Clue up on advanced skills with the P67 to rise above the ordinary. I could probably do street photography with any of my pinhole cameras, taking advantage of the rudimentary, simple nature of photography "the way it once was" (soft, blurry, abstract). No need for AE prisms!

At this time I am shocked at the very poor quality of photography from so-called "pros" (on Flickr, among other places)... people who have thrown away $6,000+ on the Nikon D850. What are they doing? Cats, dogs, babies, house roofs, old cars and front lawns with the sprinkler going. They should all get 2 weeks detention and a disposable camera as penalty.

---------- Post added 4th Oct 2017 at 09:23 AM ----------

[quote=gofour3;4104247]Here in not so sunny Vancouver, 400ISO usually means f16 and a shutter speed of 1/500, so no issues hand holding.

I should hope things pick up quite nicely before and when I make landfall in YVR next August-September 2018. The 2013 trip was utterly cold, grey, wet and miserable. Even the coffee served looked under the weather (though the BBQ salmon lifted spirirs admirably well!).

wombat2go · 10-03-2017, 04:29 PM - **1 Like**

Takumar 6x7 90 LS scale focused on my home built camera.
https://app.box.com/s/pzzorays1lydomsk9rre

stevebrot · 10-03-2017, 06:57 PM - **2 Likes**

PF user @Rense uses his Pentax 6x7 for street photography with the waistlevel finder...

Pentax 6x7 Street Shots | Flickr

Steve

Jellygeist · 10-03-2017, 08:13 PM - **1 Like**

Make sure to do those neck exercises! I am getting the 67 Stoop from hauling mine around. Badge of honour, really.

It's one thing to be stingy with film, we all have to be, but you don't learn unless you press the shutter. Practice those focussing techniques and you should become more fluid and spontaneous. The wider lens will help, too, if you can get one. No big deal if you can't, though.

This is my only real "street" photo with the 6x7

I pointed my camera at these kids (who were about to get into a fight) for a good 25 seconds to get the focus and nobody noticed. You'd be surprised at what busy people don't notice.

Femto1969 · 10-04-2017, 07:33 AM - **2 Likes**

Thanks for the examples and continued advice!

I finally got around to making a Flickr account. While scanning and processing my negatives from my trip to Seattle in early summer has taken a long time, I'm slowly getting through the film. Check out a few examples of my work! All but the last two were taken on my Pentax 67.

Niles Zee | Flickr

**gofour3** · 10-04-2017, 08:15 AM

Originally posted by Silent Street

I should hope things pick up quite nicely before and when I make landfall in YVR next August-September 2018. The 2013 trip was utterly cold, grey, wet and miserable. Even the coffee served looked under the weather (though the BBQ salmon lifted spirirs admirably well!).

Aug/Sep are nice here, though it rarely gets really hot. (above +30C). A lot has changed in the coffee scene here as well, hipster coffee has taken over. So you are looking at $4-5CND for a siphoned/pour-over coffee now at the non-chain coffee places.

Phil.

10-03-2017, 09:59 AM	#1
Femto1969 Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2017 Photos: Gallery Posts: 120	Tips for Street Photography - Pentax 67 Hi Team, I just took my updated kit out for a spin on the streets of St. Louis. I'm using a Pentax 67 with a waist level viewfinder and a 105mm f/2.4. But I have a variety of lenses and finders at my disposal (namely the 55 and 75mm lenses). I thought that using the waist finder would be a great method for me. Bringing the hulking SLR up to my eye is not inconspicuous. Usually people immediately realize they are being photographed. With the SLR style and the waist finder, most people have no idea they are appearing in my viewing screen. And this way I can get that Vivian Meyer perspective, where everyone looks like a towering statue. However I am hesitating quite a bit before I take the shot. It is hard for me to confirm sharp focus with the finder near my waist. My eyes aren't perfect and I'm still getting used to manual focusing. And the major advantage of shooting medium format is the detail - which could easily be lost with poor focus. I'm wondering if you have any tips about nailing the shot sharply and quickly. Here is my new strategy, and tell me if it makes sense to you: 1) Put my contacts in and wear a brimmed hat! I should ensure that when I go out my eyes are as sharp as can be and the sun is out of my eyes/finder 2) Frequently meter the scene and set the camera settings so I all I need to do is focus and snap 3) Use faster film, even in broad daylight (ISO 400) so I can get shots at 1/1000 of a second into the f/8 f/11 range, or higher. The reason I think this may help is that even if I miss focus slightly, at a higher f-stop, my depth of field will be wide enough where it won't matter. Sure I won't get quite the same level of subject to background separation, but at least I will have the shot in focus. 4) Just shoot when I have the opportunity. I've missed shots waiting to long for better composition. I'd rather have the shot without magazine quality composition/focus than not at all. I need to stop being such a miser with my film. The point is to get out there and shoot! I'd love to hear if you think my new strategy will work, and if you have any other tips.

10-03-2017, 03:17 PM - 1 Like	#10
Silent Street Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Castlemaine, Victoria, AUS Photos: Albums Posts: 1,151	I am not involved in street photography, other than the absolute critical sharpness of low light landscape photography, so my suggestion is to dabble with hyperfocus and a fixed aperture of say f11 (3 m focus) and leave it at that and shoot away. A fair bit of the image will be sharp (all things else coming into play such as vibration and the natural wobbling about that is par for the course with the P67). The 105mm lens is a bit long for street; I thought of the 55 or 45mm; either/both allow for easy cropping out of the frame and enlarging from that point. And the wider the lens, the more will be in focus. Mastering any genre of photography is not, and never has been, dependent on equipment and features. Clue up on advanced skills with the P67 to rise above the ordinary. I could probably do street photography with any of my pinhole cameras, taking advantage of the rudimentary, simple nature of photography "the way it once was" (soft, blurry, abstract). No need for AE prisms! At this time I am shocked at the very poor quality of photography from so-called "pros" (on Flickr, among other places)... people who have thrown away $6,000+ on the Nikon D850. What are they doing? Cats, dogs, babies, house roofs, old cars and front lawns with the sprinkler going. They should all get 2 weeks detention and a disposable camera as penalty. ---------- Post added 4th Oct 2017 at 09:23 AM ---------- [quote=gofour3;4104247]Here in not so sunny Vancouver, 400ISO usually means f16 and a shutter speed of 1/500, so no issues hand holding. I should hope things pick up quite nicely before and when I make landfall in YVR next August-September 2018. The 2013 trip was utterly cold, grey, wet and miserable. Even the coffee served looked under the weather (though the BBQ salmon lifted spirirs admirably well!). Last edited by Silent Street; 10-03-2017 at 03:24 PM.

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10-03-2017, 10:41 AM - 1 Like	#2
CreationBear Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Posts: 2,415	Originally posted by Femto1969 wear a brimmed hat! Ha, you have to be rolling with the off-side wooden handle as well... Between being nearsighted and living in an armed (but polite) society I'm afraid I'm of no help with street shooting--but Pentax forum member "Oculus" is one of the best I've seen...it would be worth doing a search of PF to see some of his work.

10-03-2017, 11:07 AM - 2 Likes	#3
pathdoc Pentaxian Join Date: Mar 2015 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 6,381	The 67 uses the sort of film you sort of need to be a miser with. But in street photography it is a rule that sometimes composition beats both correct exposure and ultra-sharp focus. GIven the size of your negatives, you have a bit more latitude than 35mm and 120 shooters for creating the same-sized print in this regard. That's not a licence to go all balls-out, who-cares-about-focus Lomo style; just that sometimes there has to be give around the edges of picture quality. The advantage of the 67 and cameras like it is that while it isn't exactly the most unobtrusive camera (take an ME or MX if you want that), it's the sort of thing that rates as an antique in most people's minds; it's practically a conversation-starter. I keep a few pics on my Flickr and in my phone that I can show people to demonstrate what I do, and quite a few are interested to see that film is still a thing (especially when I tell them about Caffenol). Choose the right brimmed hat and you will look like a refugee from the days when the 67 was king. Shoot it proudly. Take pics of, or focus on, inanimate objects occasionally so people are comfortable with seeing it in your hands. Mark out a beat. Take it for a coffee regularly. Become part of the furniture. The more you're known, the more likely it is people will vouch for you if some idiot takes undue offence.

10-03-2017, 01:01 PM	#4
Femto1969 Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2017 Photos: Gallery Posts: 120 Original Poster	Originally posted by pathdoc The 67 uses the sort of film you sort of need to be a miser with. But in street photography it is a rule that sometimes composition beats both correct exposure and ultra-sharp focus. GIven the size of your negatives, you have a bit more latitude than 35mm and 120 shooters for creating the same-sized print in this regard. That's not a licence to go all balls-out, who-cares-about-focus Lomo style; just that sometimes there has to be give around the edges of picture quality. The advantage of the 67 and cameras like it is that while it isn't exactly the most unobtrusive camera (take an ME or MX if you want that), it's the sort of thing that rates as an antique in most people's minds; it's practically a conversation-starter. I keep a few pics on my Flickr and in my phone that I can show people to demonstrate what I do, and quite a few are interested to see that film is still a thing (especially when I tell them about Caffenol). Choose the right brimmed hat and you will look like a refugee from the days when the 67 was king. Shoot it proudly. Take pics of, or focus on, inanimate objects occasionally so people are comfortable with seeing it in your hands. Mark out a beat. Take it for a coffee regularly. Become part of the furniture. The more you're known, the more likely it is people will vouch for you if some idiot takes undue offence. I am hoping that I can eke out extra sharpness on 8x10 prints than a 35mm even if things go badly. But my hope is to get good enough I can capture very sharp images of well-composed street shots. I can't go 30 minutes without someone asking me about my camera. People usually say "thats a really nice camera!" but when further probed they know nothing about it or photography. What they mean is "thats a BIG camera." I'll take it - it starts a conversation. And yes, people seeing me shoot buildings and wide scenes makes them feel more comfortable with me being around. St. Louis is small enough for people to begin to recognize me as "the camera guy." What do you think about my technique of shooting on faster film to be able to close down more? At some point almost everything will be adequately in focus. Definitely not at f/4, maybe close enough at f/8, and probably so a f/11 or f/16. Thanks for the feedback!

10-03-2017, 01:12 PM - 1 Like	#5
mattb123 Site Supporter Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Colorado High Country Photos: Gallery Posts: 10,873	Seems like a perfect scenario to figure out/practice your hyperfocal or zone focusing techniques.

10-03-2017, 01:20 PM	#6
gofour3 Site Supporter Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Vancouver, Canada Posts: 8,092	here is what I do for street work with the 6x7: - shoot faster 400 ISO film, so more DOF. - try and use hyperfocal focusing. (of course this is easier with my 67II, as it has aperture priority) - otherwise I meter and focus on a "spot", so if someone walks into that spot all I have to do is press the shutter. If you are shooting 400ISO film and it's sunny then your shutter speeds will be pretty fast and your subject will be in focus. Phil.

10-03-2017, 01:56 PM	#7
Femto1969 Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2017 Photos: Gallery Posts: 120 Original Poster	Originally posted by gofour3 here is what I do for street work with the 6x7: - shoot faster 400 ISO film, so more DOF. - try and use hyperfocal focusing. (of course this is easier with my 67II, as it has aperture priority) - otherwise I meter and focus on a "spot", so if someone walks into that spot all I have to do is press the shutter. If you are shooting 400ISO film and it's sunny then your shutter speeds will be pretty fast and your subject will be in focus. Phil. Yes, I've definitely been trying to envision my hyperfocal distances/focus zones. It is going to take a good amount of practice since I've grown up in the world of amazing AF. Wow - I guess I didn't realize the 67ii has aperture priority. Drool. Maybe I should trade my two P67 bodies in and buy a 67ii. I like your idea of the focus traps. I'll try this technique too. What apertures do you usually find yourself using when you have ISO 400 in and its a sunny day? I'm trying to balance camera shake with DOF. I could shoot at 1/1000 and f/8 or 1/250 and f/16... Until I get a strong feel for how the negs turn out I don't have much guidance about which will be best. My sense at this point is to shoot at 1/500 and minimize the aperture/maximize DOF. I can be almost certain I will see no camera shake at 1/500 as long as I am steady. At least the difference between 1/500 an 1/1000 should be negligible. And this way I get an additional stop of DOF. Would 1/250 be pretty safe? Thanks!

10-03-2017, 02:10 PM - 1 Like	#8
Swift1 Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Oregon Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 5,079	I would use the 75mm or a 90mm for street instead of the 105mm. And I would practice judging focus distance by eye a using scale focusing. Use fast and try to keep your aperture near f/11 I don't think Aperture Priority will be a huge benefit, especially since it requires the AE prism. I shoot using scale focusing with my Rolleiflex quite a bit. With practice you can get fairly quick and accurate.

10-03-2017, 02:38 PM	#9
gofour3 Site Supporter Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Vancouver, Canada Posts: 8,092	Originally posted by Femto1969 What apertures do you usually find yourself using when you have ISO 400 in and its a sunny day? Here in not so sunny Vancouver, 400ISO usually means f16 and a shutter speed of 1/500, so no issues hand holding. Yes the P67II has lots of extra features, including aperture priority, TTL flash & matrix/spot/centre weighted metering options. That and the user changeable focusing screens are the main reason to upgrade. I like using my 55/4 & 67II for street shooting. just set the aperture to f/16 and move the infinity mark on the lens distance scale to f/16 and you just blast away like a P&S camera. Phil.

10-03-2017, 04:29 PM - 1 Like	#11
wombat2go Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Michigan Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,207	Takumar 6x7 90 LS scale focused on my home built camera. https://app.box.com/s/pzzorays1lydomsk9rre

10-03-2017, 06:57 PM - 2 Likes	#12
stevebrot Otis Memorial Pentaxian Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Vancouver (USA) Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 42,007	PF user @Rense uses his Pentax 6x7 for street photography with the waistlevel finder... Pentax 6x7 Street Shots \| Flickr Steve

10-03-2017, 08:13 PM - 1 Like	#13
Jellygeist Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2017 Location: Brandon, MB Photos: Albums Posts: 334	Make sure to do those neck exercises! I am getting the 67 Stoop from hauling mine around. Badge of honour, really. It's one thing to be stingy with film, we all have to be, but you don't learn unless you press the shutter. Practice those focussing techniques and you should become more fluid and spontaneous. The wider lens will help, too, if you can get one. No big deal if you can't, though. This is my only real "street" photo with the 6x7 I pointed my camera at these kids (who were about to get into a fight) for a good 25 seconds to get the focus and nobody noticed. You'd be surprised at what busy people don't notice.

10-04-2017, 07:33 AM - 2 Likes	#14
Femto1969 Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2017 Photos: Gallery Posts: 120 Original Poster	Thanks for the examples and continued advice! I finally got around to making a Flickr account. While scanning and processing my negatives from my trip to Seattle in early summer has taken a long time, I'm slowly getting through the film. Check out a few examples of my work! All but the last two were taken on my Pentax 67. Niles Zee \| Flickr

10-04-2017, 08:15 AM	#15
gofour3 Site Supporter Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Vancouver, Canada Posts: 8,092	Originally posted by Silent Street I should hope things pick up quite nicely before and when I make landfall in YVR next August-September 2018. The 2013 trip was utterly cold, grey, wet and miserable. Even the coffee served looked under the weather (though the BBQ salmon lifted spirirs admirably well!). Aug/Sep are nice here, though it rarely gets really hot. (above +30C). A lot has changed in the coffee scene here as well, hipster coffee has taken over. So you are looking at $4-5CND for a siphoned/pour-over coffee now at the non-chain coffee places. Phil.